Speaking French on the radio

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xlent
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Speaking French on the radio

Post by xlent »

I think its about time, changes are made to prevent pilots (who are fluent in English) from speaking French on the radio. I can understand the private sector but when I fly into Montreal and airline pilots (Jazz and AC) particularly, are speaking French on the radio, something is wrong. I think most pilots are actively listening to ATC conversing with pilots and it helps to highten their situational awareness with respect to other airplanes. I understand that if two airplanes are in direct conflict, ATC will make the required transmissions to apply corrective action...but, this means more air time to get the point accross. Theres also the little things like being able to tell if theres an airplane fairly close behind you on approach, and you can correct the situation yourself without ATC instruction simply by increasing your speed momentarily and all of a sudden, its a non issue.
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by Cat Driver »

ooooowwwwwww, that should really light up the forum!! :smt040
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by The Mole »

K-beckers. When will they realize they lost the war. Maybe another beat down is neaded.
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by pilotbzh »

Not so xlent in french are you?
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ticasse
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by ticasse »

What? You're a pilot, can't you learn a few lines of french ? Is it too hard for you ? Took me 2 days to get used to do english coms when I flew in Alberta during 3 months.
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by jetflightinstructor »

I see clearly your point. But do you understand what you are asking?

Ladies and gentleman, speak my language please, I want to understand what you say....

Do you know which is the first language on earth??? Have a guess..... Wrong! Chinese.

Do you imagine in 20 years chinese people on chinese forums complaining because you dont speak chinese when they come to fly to your city? What will you feel in your heart, I mean HONNESTLY?

Yes agreed, speaking the same language is better for the understanding, especially for the one who can clearly speak and understand it.
But the world is the world. If you add russian, french, italian, chinese, indian, german, spanish ect... well, thats over 85% of the world that is more comfortable speaking an other language than english...

So yes if we all speak the same language (wich is not the case), it would be better for aviation.
But understand that what you ask, and knowing it comes from somebody whom tongue mother is english, it's a bit arrogant, even if you are right, you are already lucky enough not being imposed to learn a specific language just to do your job.
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by Cat Driver »

What? You're a pilot, can't you learn a few lines of french ?
Learning a few lines of French will not make one able to understand the language. And I am a pilot who does not speak French, does that somehow make me an inferior pilot?

What would you do ticass if you flew in all the countries we fly in delivering airplanes all over the world? Learn every language for every country we fly in?
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by jetflightinstructor »

Theres also the little things like being able to tell if theres an airplane fairly close behind you on approach, and you can correct the situation yourself without ATC instruction simply by increasing your speed momentarily and all of a sudden, its a non issue.
Yes... and you may be asked to slow down because you are too close to the preceding traffic now.

You should avoid to modify you approach speed, a stabilized one should be Vref plus 10, Vref over the threshold.
I wouldnt modify my published and calculated approach speed, just because I have a guess concerning my position because of the last radio communication I have listened.
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taylor498
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by taylor498 »

I am undoubtedly bias, because my first language is English. But the international language for aviation is English, is it not? If it were something else, then I guess I'd have some extra learning to do.

Not quite sure how I feel about having both on the radio here, but if someone were to be speaking French, I couldn't help but feel out of the loop... as we all know situational awareness is key to everyone's safety.
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by Cat Driver »

I can understand the private sector but when I fly into Montreal and airline pilots (Jazz and AC) particularly, are speaking French on the radio, something is wrong.
Maybe Jazz and AC are hiring more French speaking pilots who are not really fluent in English so it is easier for them to communicate in French?
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by E-Flyer »

ticasse wrote:What? You're a pilot, can't you learn a few lines of french ? Is it too hard for you ? Took me 2 days to get used to do english coms when I flew in Alberta during 3 months.
The international aviation language is english ... of course it takes you 2 days to learn english, french has so many little crap that changes the entire meaning - it takes a life time to learn. In english, if you walk into Starbucks and say "me coffe black cream no" people will understand what you want. In french, the guy will light a cigar and blow the CO2 at your face and tell you to bugger off. Trust me, I speak both.
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Last edited by E-Flyer on Mon Aug 25, 2008 4:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
jetflightinstructor
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by jetflightinstructor »

I am undoubtedly bias, because my first language is English. But the international language for aviation is English, is it not? If it were something else, then I guess I'd have some extra learning to do.

Not quite sure how I feel about having both on the radio here, but if someone were to be speaking French, I couldn't help but feel out of the loop... as we all know situational awareness is key to everyone's safety.
True. And nicely said.

At the same time, how would you deal with that? You are from "quebec" (or insert any country you want), you are 50 years old, you dont speak english, you speak "french", you have just bought a C150 and passed your PPL. You want to fly at "quebec city" airport. What would you do? Fly or not?

Be careful here... I agree with what you say. I just want to remind to Xlent the complexity of the world, and that the fact to be arrogant is just being part of the problem, not the solution
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ticasse
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by ticasse »

Cat Driver wrote:
What? You're a pilot, can't you learn a few lines of french ?
Learning a few lines of French will not make one able to understand the language. And I am a pilot who does not speak French, does that somehow make me an inferior pilot?

What would you do ticass if you flew in all the countries we fly in delivering airplanes all over the world? Learn every language for every country we fly in?
No I wouldn't. But if I were to fly in the same country for a certain period of time I would try to at least understand the basic aviation expressions of the locals.

I can hear chinese students speaking french and english on the radio over montreal all the time,they had to learn the basic aviation language, it's far from perfect and you certainly wouldn't be able to have a coherent discussion with them but they can tell you where they are and what they're going to do, isn't it enough ? You don't need to be fluent in french to understand "C-GABC finale 28".
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by Right Seat Captain »

taylor498 wrote: But the international language for aviation is English, is it not? If it were something else, then I guess I'd have some extra learning to do.
Last year I was flying in Spain, and many spoke Spanish on the radio. I had no idea what they were saying, however I could communicate with ATC in English.

Should I learn Spanish to fly in Spain, or should the Spanish learn English if they want to fly commercially?
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by AuxBatOn »

As I said before in an other topic, there will always be the recreational and private pilots that don't get out of Quebec and for them, there is absolutely no requiremetns to speak English. They will always be there, flying around big and not so big airports. As a PROFESSIONAL pilot, yes you should deifnately be able to use English on the radio. On the other hand, the English speaking PROFESSIONAL pilot flying into Quebec should definately have a basic understanding of the French aviation slang. That way, if he gets into a small (uncontrolled airport), he will be able to communicate with the other non-commercial pilots. Heck, most of my friends where I fly are pure English rednecks and they are able to learn basic words so they won't have an SA dump flying into a French place where there are lots of PPLs.

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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by xlent »

AuxBattOn, you almost got my point, thanks. If I was a Private Pilot flying in Sometown, Quebec, I would learn enough French to get me by...and I understand that some of these Private Pilots make their way to major centres such as Montreal. My point is, however that if a pilot is fluent in English, why do they choose to speak French on the radio. Do we expect that the Luftansa pilots also learn French because they fly into Montreal?
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by Cat Driver »

The poster who started this was not complaining about PPL's at some remote airport using French. The complaint was directed at Jazz and AC pilots.

So that was what prompted me to ask the following question, which may explain why they use French.
Maybe Jazz and AC are hiring more French speaking pilots who are not really fluent in English so it is easier for them to communicate in French?
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by AuxBatOn »

xlent wrote:AuxBattOn, you almost got my point, thanks. If I was a Private Pilot flying in Sometown, Quebec, I would learn enough French to get me by...and I understand that some of these Private Pilots make their way to major centres such as Montreal. My point is, however that if a pilot is fluent in English, why do they choose to speak French on the radio. Do we expect that the Luftansa pilots also learn French because they fly into Montreal?
No, I agree with you. In that case, the Jazz and AC guys would, IMHO, have to speak English as to increase everyone's SA without ATC having to translate everything to potential conflicts. I'm French, I've flown into Dorval and Quebec a few times and I've spoken English with ATC. I just add "Bonjour/Bonsoir" when he hands me over to someone else.

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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by Cat Driver »

I used to try and fit in when flying in the middle east by ending all my transmissions with " enchallah. " worked like a charm. :mrgreen:
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Re: Speaking French on the radio

Post by hawkerdriver »

Did somebody remember in 1976 or so the war for the right to work in french in the Quebec prov?
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