SOme of you are right
This has been done to death
But then again your right not too much from any apparent pilots
Everyone is keeping there mouth shut
Maybe its fear of them really not getting a job back
In short the pilots are all laid off except 6 or so 48hrs recall. Plan to have limited opps in the next couple of days.
However seems the pilots have to do some training amd the company need some trained pilots to operate- but the training will be done while on lay off 9ie you don't get paid-you get the time off later)
As for the cash flow- well non of the pilots will be paid- not even holidays as its a short term lay off and the company does not have to pay out the holiday time- they need the cash to pay for fetting the opps running again. So no one laid off is getting anything
T.C shuts part of Skyward down
Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, lilfssister, North Shore, I WAS Birddog
Oh yes, there's a chaplain, and you can pretty much bet your life that he is still getting a pay cheque. And I suspect that the reason not much has been written from actual Skyward employees on this thread is that the ones who could bailed out of YTH ASAP after getting the ol' pink slip. So unless they have received calls to return for unpaid training they are as far away from town as they can be!!
-
Cat Driver
- Top Poster
- Posts: 18921
- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 8:31 pm
Newf .. If you're asking whats going on there, and nobody is offering the info either company/pilots/TC .. I believe thats kicking a dead horse .. because all we are seeing on here now is hearsay .. what ppl think they're hearing or what they speculate is going on .. and I also think that is dis-respectful to those involved. Take it or leave it .. imagine yourself in there shoes .. 
Who cares if the company has a chaplin .. I believe thats there business, and who are we to sit back and discuss people's faith and decisions. There are a lot of airlines with chaplin's on staff, incase you didn't realize that, and im not going to say there job is of any less importance then another. Times like this is when they earn there money ..
Who cares if the company has a chaplin .. I believe thats there business, and who are we to sit back and discuss people's faith and decisions. There are a lot of airlines with chaplin's on staff, incase you didn't realize that, and im not going to say there job is of any less importance then another. Times like this is when they earn there money ..
-
Rubberbiscuit
- Rank 8
- Posts: 754
- Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2005 3:02 pm
Nothing against religion, but if they do happen to lay off the chaplain, there is a baptist minister who lives in PA and owns his own aviation company, who could maybe go over to Thompson and show Skyward how to do things the "northern way" and not get caught. Maybe they could pay him $1000 before taxes, and have him cut firewood for the terminal and houses to keep them warm for the winter months.
-
Midnight_Sun
- Rank 0
- Posts: 9
- Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 4:49 pm
T/C deemed Skyward to have lost operational control and pulled their o/c pending an audit.
Last edited by Midnight_Sun on Tue Apr 19, 2005 9:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.
We used to have fire warning lights come on all the time in the Hawker. Never had to "dance the dance" though!
ROTGLMFAO over the company chaplin crap though! Training....no pay? Days off in lieu? No vacation pay...at all? 48 hour call back? I'd be putten Skyward in my rear view mirror.....last one out, turn off the lights!
ROTGLMFAO over the company chaplin crap though! Training....no pay? Days off in lieu? No vacation pay...at all? 48 hour call back? I'd be putten Skyward in my rear view mirror.....last one out, turn off the lights!
I guess lets face it- the whole situation stinks for those on layoff
Seems the whole point and big question is why did it end up here.
Its not to apportion blame BUT someone has to take responsibility in some form.
Some say its the "operational staff" eg pilots and AMEs who accepted the conditions- others say its that management.
But at the end of the day it could be a lot of things.
My thought is how might it change?
In short its got to come from the top- from what I hear some of the managers have it and some don't- I heard the CP is batting for his pilots and has been communicating- as for the owner is he still even in town?
As for the top management- well seems they are having problems jumping from the bush mentality to the regional carrier mentality. Skyward is a big place now.
I don't think they have ever heard of cost benefit analysis before- the benefits of proactive verse reactive. Will it change? From what I've heard I am not too sure.
Just listen to some of the posts (which concur with the things I\ve heard)
memo to staff- management says they volunteered the OC and TC are real happy with them taking such proactive measures and its a short term thing- next day turns out TC took it basically ripped the OC up and its a real big deal. Was management telling the truth or misleading the staff? I think the word bullsh""t came to someones lips.
All the pilots on "short term Layoff"- great- understand the reasons- but this means no one gets paid holiday pay so the company can keep the cash (maybe to pay the chaplin).
Anyone know wether the flight nurses got laid off??? You could lay off 1 of them to about 6 FOs.
Training on layoff- but they won't pay the pilots to do it- but they need the training done to get the OC back. Is this the horse or the cart first.
The unfortunate thing is that the pilots seem to really want to help the company be sucessful- and they go the mile- but generally get the screw for it- which makes them bitter- which makes a vicious circle.
At the end of the day the owner will preach (excuse the pun) that they have a safety first company but will be less than committed to implemneting it unless forced to do so by threat or dire consequence. Just like now, TC has brought dire consequence (avoidable at that).
Seems the only committed people are the worker bees at the front end who cover up for the safety, business and customer propaganda coming down from the top end.
Commitment to safety -EG the safety officer- a KEY saftey person- happens to be a line pilot who really is taking the job for the extra 200 bucks a month he needs to feed himself. primary duty- to track the first aid kits, secondary duty, don't do anything to spend money.
A prayer at christmas time for all the accident free flying is not a safety plan. I'd call it luck
The only way it MAY change is if they see something in it for them- which clearly there can be, lots of other companies see it- but until now they have been unable to comprehend as all they see is reactive expenditure. So close but so far.
How do they put it- the cost of an accident v the cost of preventing one.
Well I say the shut down is the equal of an accident- look how much it has and will cost when it was totally preventable. TOTALLY preventable and to make it worse they knew the audit was coming for months.
Thought to end- ask any employee and I would guess pilots (seeing they seem to be the main topic in this forum) 2 questions. These often come out after an accident (which I have drawn comparison too)
1 Did you expect this was likely to happen to the company.
2 Are you suprised the company had a serious accident (maybe killed someone)
If they answer that they are not suprised or yes- that really shows a very poor safety culture and the inability of the company to recognise it or be doing anything constructive about it.
my 2 cents
Good luck to those guys on layoff
Seems the whole point and big question is why did it end up here.
Its not to apportion blame BUT someone has to take responsibility in some form.
Some say its the "operational staff" eg pilots and AMEs who accepted the conditions- others say its that management.
But at the end of the day it could be a lot of things.
My thought is how might it change?
In short its got to come from the top- from what I hear some of the managers have it and some don't- I heard the CP is batting for his pilots and has been communicating- as for the owner is he still even in town?
As for the top management- well seems they are having problems jumping from the bush mentality to the regional carrier mentality. Skyward is a big place now.
I don't think they have ever heard of cost benefit analysis before- the benefits of proactive verse reactive. Will it change? From what I've heard I am not too sure.
Just listen to some of the posts (which concur with the things I\ve heard)
memo to staff- management says they volunteered the OC and TC are real happy with them taking such proactive measures and its a short term thing- next day turns out TC took it basically ripped the OC up and its a real big deal. Was management telling the truth or misleading the staff? I think the word bullsh""t came to someones lips.
All the pilots on "short term Layoff"- great- understand the reasons- but this means no one gets paid holiday pay so the company can keep the cash (maybe to pay the chaplin).
Anyone know wether the flight nurses got laid off??? You could lay off 1 of them to about 6 FOs.
Training on layoff- but they won't pay the pilots to do it- but they need the training done to get the OC back. Is this the horse or the cart first.
The unfortunate thing is that the pilots seem to really want to help the company be sucessful- and they go the mile- but generally get the screw for it- which makes them bitter- which makes a vicious circle.
At the end of the day the owner will preach (excuse the pun) that they have a safety first company but will be less than committed to implemneting it unless forced to do so by threat or dire consequence. Just like now, TC has brought dire consequence (avoidable at that).
Seems the only committed people are the worker bees at the front end who cover up for the safety, business and customer propaganda coming down from the top end.
Commitment to safety -EG the safety officer- a KEY saftey person- happens to be a line pilot who really is taking the job for the extra 200 bucks a month he needs to feed himself. primary duty- to track the first aid kits, secondary duty, don't do anything to spend money.
A prayer at christmas time for all the accident free flying is not a safety plan. I'd call it luck
The only way it MAY change is if they see something in it for them- which clearly there can be, lots of other companies see it- but until now they have been unable to comprehend as all they see is reactive expenditure. So close but so far.
How do they put it- the cost of an accident v the cost of preventing one.
Well I say the shut down is the equal of an accident- look how much it has and will cost when it was totally preventable. TOTALLY preventable and to make it worse they knew the audit was coming for months.
Thought to end- ask any employee and I would guess pilots (seeing they seem to be the main topic in this forum) 2 questions. These often come out after an accident (which I have drawn comparison too)
1 Did you expect this was likely to happen to the company.
2 Are you suprised the company had a serious accident (maybe killed someone)
If they answer that they are not suprised or yes- that really shows a very poor safety culture and the inability of the company to recognise it or be doing anything constructive about it.
my 2 cents
Good luck to those guys on layoff
Tough act to follow...
To adress Localizer I wasn't making an observation on religion at all, my thought was simply financial. If you don't have any money coming in and your fighting for your company, every dollar counts. The Chaplins expierence in bussiness and the aviation industry amount to nothing! Send the guy home and bring him back when things are back on track. And no the Chaplin isn't an owner.
As for skyward, Transport continues to twist the knife. Good information is hard to come by and like this fourm b-llsh-t and rumors abound.
To adress Localizer I wasn't making an observation on religion at all, my thought was simply financial. If you don't have any money coming in and your fighting for your company, every dollar counts. The Chaplins expierence in bussiness and the aviation industry amount to nothing! Send the guy home and bring him back when things are back on track. And no the Chaplin isn't an owner.
As for skyward, Transport continues to twist the knife. Good information is hard to come by and like this fourm b-llsh-t and rumors abound.
So apparently there was supposed to be an announcement today at 4pm. Anyone hear anything?
They lost their ability to charter other companies today though. Perimeter was flying YWG-YTH, Kelner YWG-YNE, Bearskin and Beaver Air out of YTH to the northern spots, and apparently all flying for/on behalf of Skyward is cancelled as of tonite.
They lost their ability to charter other companies today though. Perimeter was flying YWG-YTH, Kelner YWG-YNE, Bearskin and Beaver Air out of YTH to the northern spots, and apparently all flying for/on behalf of Skyward is cancelled as of tonite.
"The South will boogie again."
Ok .. dr evil .. understood ..
From what i've heard, and understand is that the "green machine" (Perimeter) is the next target for the TC - Prairie & Northern region .. better dig your trenches deep and barricade the doors .. looks like they want blood .. Is Calm Air going to be the sole regional airline in MB? ..
- Damn TC! ..
From what i've heard, and understand is that the "green machine" (Perimeter) is the next target for the TC - Prairie & Northern region .. better dig your trenches deep and barricade the doors .. looks like they want blood .. Is Calm Air going to be the sole regional airline in MB? ..
- Damn TC! ..-
Northern Flyer
- Rank 6
- Posts: 437
- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 8:40 pm
When people start dying because the province is short medevac aircraft, I wounder how TC will be viewed by the general public.
The companys that are operational right now can keep up fine, but shut down the "Green Machine" and we'll lose four more birds.
Just a thought.......
The companys that are operational right now can keep up fine, but shut down the "Green Machine" and we'll lose four more birds.
Just a thought.......
-
Cat Driver
- Top Poster
- Posts: 18921
- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 8:31 pm
-
Right Seat Captain
- Rank Moderator
- Posts: 1237
- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:51 pm
- Location: Various/based CYOW
