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unregistered
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 7:53 pm 
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A good day for Jazz, a sad day for Canadian aviation.

150 well paid B757/A320 jobs destroyed in favour of "lower cost" labour.

When will we wake up? It's embarrassing.

:roll:


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Liquid Charlie
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 9:00 pm 
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In my opinion all they are doing is setting up another 5 year airline -- damn it's strange how history keeps repeating it's self -- I think it's high time that airlines should tell all those travel service brokers to pound salt and pay the proper price for a seat on an airplane. Our lives would be better for it -- :rolleyes:


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teacher
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 9:35 pm 
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Lower cost labour? Seriously?


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UKPilot
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 9:46 pm 
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Dash-Ate wrote:
Is the Cadet program still in place? 200 hrs and a fresh CPL for right seat in the 757? :rolleyes:


Not anymore, nope. It's just a plane though :wink:


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flyinhigh
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 9:55 pm 
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Liquid Charlie wrote:
In my opinion all they are doing is setting up another 5 year airline -- damn it's strange how history keeps repeating it's self -- I think it's high time that airlines should tell all those travel service brokers to pound salt and pay the proper price for a seat on an airplane. Our lives would be better for it -- :rolleyes:



Well considering that Jazz has already been around for 6 years and going strong, I think that your logic is completly screwed. How is Jazz another start up? because we have a surpluss of pilots, that instead of laying off we now have to higher more. Because we already have a major route/infastructure set up. MMMMM

Sorry as I have said before to my colleges, don't like it, thats fine. Just don't bitch and than fly on us when were doing it because you saved that 100 bucks off the total fair by flying sunquest.


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Localizer
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 10:46 pm 
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Quote:
Big Pistons Forever wrote:

I see the new outfit will be called "Thomas Cook Airlines" not "Jazz Airlines"....so does that mean the flight crew will be sourced seperately from Jazz, or will Jazz pilots be able to bid the 757 ?

Localizer wrote:

The Dash-8's and CRJ's say "Air Canada" on the side .. but there are no Air Canada pilots on the inside ... The name painted on the bird means nothing.

Black Cat wrote:

Not to nit pick but the name on the side of the CRJs and Dash8s says "Air Canada JAZZ" as do their hats and jepp manuals. And there are "Air Canada JAZZ" pilots inside. Until recently the company did operate as air canada jazz but now my understanding is that they have dropped the air canada will be known as Jazz, possible from the litigation from porter.


Don't mind if I nitpick a little more ... Think of it as rather 2 names on the plane .. Air Canada and Jazz ... by the way my paycheck does not say "Air Canada Jazz" ... just Jazz Air LP ... which makes me a Jazz pilot ... Not an Air Canada Jazz pilot. Confused?


Quote:
A good day for Jazz, a sad day for Canadian aviation.

150 well paid B757/A320 jobs destroyed in favour of "lower cost" labour.

When will we wake up? It's embarrassing.


Do you know how much a Jazz pilot is going to make flying a B757? Since you don't seem to work there .. and I do .. and I have no idea, i'd like you to enlighten me with your keen sense of foresight.


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CanadianEh
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 11:06 pm 
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If Jazz starts hiring, those Sky Service guys with 757 type ratings could be scooped up quick. Whether they had the 757 rating or not, with their level of experience they would be scooped up regardless IMO.


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teacher
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 11:53 pm 
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Until our new contract is done being renegotiated and an adjustment is made to account for larger aircraft flying I think all should reserve judgement on wages. Keep in mind that us Jazz pilots have been under a CCAA contract this whole time and are now just having it updated.


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KAG
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 11:56 pm 
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CanadianEh wrote:
If Jazz starts hiring, those Sky Service guys with 757 type ratings could be scooped up quick. Whether they had the 757 rating or not, with their level of experience they would be scooped up regardless IMO.


Doesn't work that way. Jazz is a union job where seniority trumps all. The Skyservice folks would go BOTL, and get what was avialable equipment. The 57 will go very senior I would think.
What I could see happening is some Skyservice pilots hired under a contract basis to train the Jazz guys. After Sim and line indoc, the Jazz guys take over and the Skyservice pilots continue their job hunt. IMHO anyway.


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Liquid Charlie
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 1:09 am 
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I guess we will sit back and see -- it will be very interesting to see how the planes are crewed -- I certainly hope from within Jazz and yes to have a collective agreement is a must and ALPA prevails.

I guess we see Flare and KFC and one always wonders what twists and turns will appear.

My earlier statement had no flames directed towards pilots or airlines -- just the travel companies that expect to make money off the backs of people who staff their chosen/created carrier -- it's a cut throat biz with very narrow margins and half a dozen 75's draining Jazz could have devastating effects on a very good company. I wish everyone the best of luck - I just hope history does not repeat it's self yet another time in the Canadian Aviation Charter/Holiday market.


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Dark Helmet
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 3:54 am 
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As far as wages go. Without a shadow of a doubt, we will be working under a new CA by the time the 757s arrive. A CA that will bring better WAWCON.

Putting that aside, a few years ago Jazz came very close to signing a contract with Winnair down in the Caribbean to operate a couple of Dash 8-100s. Off course that agreement never came to pass but we were so close that the Company an ALPA drafted a LOU for that operation. That LOU had separate WAWCON than our CA including a pay uplift for operating down in the Caribbean.

Most likely, there will be something similar for the 757 flying. This LOU may be incorporated into out New CA as well. Remenber that any LOU will have to be ratified by the pilot group.

These planes will be crewed by Jazz pilots. Our MEC was a HUGE catalyst in getting this contract together. They have been working extremely hard in order to diversify the revenue base at Jazz. They did not do this to see Jazz turn around and outsource that flying.

We will probably be hiring contract pilots to get the ball rolling and then take over the operation afterwards. There is a clause in our current CA that allows us to do this and most likely there will be one in our new CA as well.

Again all IMHO, the exact details have not been released yet.


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Air Canada Jazz
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 4:17 am 
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Hello everybody,
I've been telling you for years now, Jazz is the place to be. Good union, nice contract, nice airplanes, employees with good attitude and now 6 Boeing 757.
LoL
Keep looking up fellow pilots.
Jazz himself
:prayer:


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giligan
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 4:47 am 
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Perhaps when CanJet is done with those German skippers they will be available for a contract with Jazz. Oh, but that would never happen in a union shop like Jazz. BTW who represents the CanJet pilots???


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oates76
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 4:48 am 
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Wow, what a suprise :shock: I wonder if we'll see Jazz pilots doing summers in Europe for TCX like with Skyservice at some point down the road?


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Mig29
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 4:51 am 
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bigmoly wrote:
Wait for comments from AC pilots regarding potential conflicts with the CPA. Anyone??


I was about to say something about that....how will that work with ACPA and ALPA boys and girls???


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FlyingHi
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 4:53 am 
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Talking with an European friend, Thomas Cook requires 1000hrs PIC on type for their contracts. If current Jazz pilots don't meet that requirement, what are the possibilities that they would have to hire Canadians WITH a current 757 rating. Hmmm, where would you find a bunch of qualified, current on type, senior 757 captains? Skyservice?


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habs
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 5:15 am 
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"Talking with an European friend, Thomas Cook requires 1000hrs PIC on type for their contracts"

T.C.'s and every other airline's experience requirements can change at any time it suits them.

As for ACPA and ALPA, ACPA had many opportunities over the years and chose to look the other way. Too bad, so sad.

Each ALPA pilot group makes ALPA what it is within their own company. From what I know, Canjet is a weak link in the chain as very few pilots want to get involved hence the Germans and yadi yadi yada.

Congratulations Jazz, congratulations Jazz ALPA. As someone else mentioned, Jazz ALPA was a big factor in this. They had several meetings with T.C.

Jazz ALPA was also responsible for presenting the case to Milton as to why they would be better suited to operate RJ's, in particular the 705.

Contract pilots will start this out, but these 757's will be crewed by Jazz pilots without a doubt.


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JZA
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 7:19 am 
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Good News for JAZZ. As a former JAZZer I'm really pleased to hear this news and hope it turns into a successful long term venture. I have the feeling certain ACPA folk will have their panties in knot over this...hopefully they won't harbour any resentment to the JAZZ pilot group. If anything they should be on their companies case for not bidding on this contract.
Good job JAZZ!


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TQ2
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 1:18 pm 
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Where does Jazz ALPA stand regarding the use of TCX pilots in the winter to crew the 752's? I'm sure it will have been discussed as it's the way it was worked with SSV, this would allow the reciprocal exchange of pilots from Canada to UK in the summer period when the canadian routes aren't so busy.


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flyinhigh
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 2:03 pm 
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Well folks, This announement that we're getting 57's has been out for a day and not one negative comment or rant.

That deserves a big Congrats to you all. :D


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Localizer
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 10:55 pm 
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YO_MAMMA
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 11:52 pm 
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This bird is gonna look niaaaaaaacccceeeee in Jazz colors!! Congrats guyz!!


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YCL Boy
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:05 am 
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Me Thinking there not going to be Jazz coloured, but rather Thomas Cook paint scheme.
And where are those 757 coming from anyway Skyservice? or Thomas Cook current fleet?
Im guessing that 2 cargo companies south of the border are trying to get their hands on those SSV 57.

I Feel bad for the SSV employees, but at the same time congrats to the Jazzies.


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HavaJava
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:09 am 
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Methinks "Air Canada" will probably not be stamped on the side of the 757's...just Jazz...or as the previous poster said, perhaps a TC paint scheme.


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Localizer
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:48 am 
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I'm pretty sure the memo said the birds would bare the Thomas Cook colours ... by the way, nice registration .. C-GTRY?? .. is that intentional? (Good Try??)

None the less it sure would be nice to see a fleet baring that colour scheme ..


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