on call vs. on reserve ....definition please

[JohnnyHotRocks]

OK, so we all know that Transport Canada's website absolutely sucks and it is impossible to use the search function to find anything useful...
does anyone have a link to a TC definition for "on call" and "on reserve"?

thanks in advance
John

[fanspeed]

On call is when you have to wait around for the company to call. On reserve is much the same, only usually when up north.-shammattawa, gods lake or the like. One can be on call while on reserve, but not the reverse. While on reserve it is best to be friendly with the locals-one does not need to be friendly while on call. Good luck!

[JohnnyHotRocks]

I don't go anywhere near the north unless it is crossing Greenland to get to Europe...
What I need is a legal definition as per the CARS

thanks
John

[ywgflyboy]

Reserve: ready for duty on notice of more than 1 hour (Car:700.21)

On Call: ready for duty less than 1 hour

On standby: at a specified location, ready for duty in under 1 hour.

If you use quotes in your search "on call", "on reserve" you will get the exact page.

[Dagwood]

CARS 700.01

“flight crew member on reserve” - means a flight crew member who has been designated by an air operator to be available to report for flight duty on notice of more than one hour; (membre d'équipage de conduite en réserve)

Not sure where the definition for "On Call" is though.

[ywgflyboy]

"flight crew member on call" - means a flight crew member who has been designated by an air operator to be available to report for flight duty on notice of one hour or less; (membre d'équipage de conduite en disponibilité)

See Part I - General Provisions Subpart 1

[JohnnyHotRocks]

beat me to it....
thanks all

[JohnnyHotRocks]

good tip btw using quotes on the search function
Thanks

[A Regulator]

Use the search function as there is quite a bit of information regarding duty time, on call etc. I have posted some information on all the defs.

[@leastillbehappy]

So if one is "on call" or "on reserve", does the company have to specify the duty time for that day, or can a pilot technically be called at any point during a 24hr period? Again having difficulty finding that one in the CARS.

[Mach .28]

http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/s ... l-3359.htm

[frankfrank]

Normally I cringe when people post a reply with a TC link, but yours Mach.28 was actually a fine quote of Guidance material.

Perhaps someone should ask the CP of a certain Northwestern Ontario chisel charter company, Hmmm can't quite place the name, Air Alpha, no, Charlie, no, it'll come to me. They schedule their pilots with no regard for any of the three reserve procedures. They even have a "flex" shift, where a pilot is on reserve for 24 hours straight. And apparently the pilots have to report while on reserve in under an hour.

How these hacks get by Transport I'll never know.

[Changes in Latitudes]

Normally I cringe when people post a reply with a TC link, but yours Mach.28 was actually a fine quote of Guidance material.

Perhaps someone should ask the CP of a certain Northwestern Ontario chisel charter company, Hmmm can't quite place the name, Air Alpha, no, Charlie, no, it'll come to me. They schedule their pilots with no regard for any of the three reserve procedures. They even have a "flex" shift, where a pilot is on reserve for 24 hours straight. And apparently the pilots have to report while on reserve in under an hour.

How these hacks get by Transport I'll never know.

That's just one example among many operators that push the same scenario.

This 24 hour on-call / reserve business goes on many places and I can't quite wrap my head around it. If one is on-call 24 hours for days on end, how do you schedule proper rest? Their justification is, from what I understand, when the phone rings, you should be waking up from 6-8 hours of sleep? Transport is dropping the ball on this. Post a few more "fatigue kills" posters at our places of employment though, they're top notch. TRANSPORT CANADA has a huge problem that needs to be addressed here.

My guess is that since there is no quantitative way to put a statistic on how many infractions, incidents, and accidents this policy actually causes, it just falls by the wayside. Fatigue can easily be more costly than hiring extra crew or dividing a schedule into AM and PM shifts, but people refuse to acknowledge it.

[4hrstovegas]

"Reserve" has more specific rest periods (22:00 - 06:00) and rest periods are to be set 24 hrs in advance. Additionally, the rest period cannot be shifted more than 3 hrs (I believe) in one day, or more than 7 or 8 hrs in a week. Does this happen? Who knows. On call doesn't prescribe specific rest periods like that.

[A Regulator]

Please be very carefull when reading "guidance information" as it may NOT be what the regulation actually says. I will repost what the regulations say as the information is all over the place and I have put it all in one place for easy ref.

"flight crew member on reserve" - means a flight crew member who has been designated by an air operator to be available to report for flight duty on notice of more than one hour;

"flight crew member on call" - means a flight crew member who has been designated by an air operator to be available to report for flight duty on notice of one hour or less;

"flight crew member on standby" - means a flight crew member who has been designated by an air operator or private operator to remain at a specified location in order to be available to report for flight duty on notice of one hour or less;

"crew member" - means a person assigned to duty in an aircraft during flight time;

"flight crew member" - means a crew member assigned to act as pilot or flight engineer of an aircraft during flight time;

"flight deck duty time" - means the period spent by a flight crew member at a flight crew member position in an aeroplane during flight time;

"flight duty time" - means the period that starts when a flight crew member reports for a flight, or reports as a flight crew member on standby, and finishes at "engines off" or "rotors stopped" at the end of the final flight, except in the case of a flight conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 of Part VII, in which case the period finishes 15 minutes after "engines off" or "rotors stopped" at the end of the final flight, and includes the time required to complete any duties assigned by the air operator or private operator or delegated by the Minister prior to the reporting time and includes the time required to complete aircraft maintenance engineer duties prior to or following a flight;

"flight time" - means the time from the moment an aircraft first moves under its own power for the purpose of taking off until the moment it comes to rest at the end of the flight;

700.21 (1) An air operator shall provide flight crew members on reserve, within each 24-hour period, with a rest period that meets the requirements of the Commercial Air Service Standards.

720.21 Flight Crew Members on Reserve
The standards for compliance with this section are:
(1) An air operator shall provide each flight crew member with an opportunity to obtain at least 8 consecutive hours sleep in any 24 consecutive hours while on reserve by one of the following methods:
(a) the air operator shall provide the flight crew member with 24 hours notice of the time of commencement and duration of the rest period. The designated rest period cannot shift more than 3 hours earlier or later than the preceding rest period, nor more than a total of 8 hours in any 7 consecutive days;
(b) the flight crew member shall be given a minimum of 10 hours notice of the assignment and shall not be assigned any duty for these 10 hours; or
(c) the air operator shall not assign the flight crew member to flight duty time and shall not interrupt the flight crew member's rest period between 22:00 and 06:00 local time.

(2) Where an air operator is unable to provide a flight crew member with a rest period required by subsection (1) and the flight crew member is notified to report for flight duty or the reporting time occurs between 22:00 and 06:00 local time:
(a) the maximum flight duty time shall be 10 consecutive hours; and
(b) the subsequent minimum rest period shall be increased by at least one-half the length of the preceding flight duty time.

700.15 Flight Time Limitations
700.15 (1) Subject to subsection (2), no air operator shall assign a flight crew member for flight time, and no flight crew member shall accept such an assignment, if the flight crew member's total flight time in all flights conducted by the flight crew member will, as a result, exceed
(a) 1,200 hours in any 365 consecutive days;
(b) 300 hours in any 90 consecutive days;
(c) 120 hours in any 30 consecutive days or, in the case of a flight crew member on call, 100 hours in any 30 consecutive days;
(d) where the flight is conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 using an aircraft other than a helicopter, 40 hours in any 7 consecutive days;
(e) where the flight is conducted under Subpart 2 or 3, or is conducted using a helicopter, 60 hours in any 7 consecutive days; or
(f) where the flight crew member conducts single-pilot IFR flights, 8 hours in any 24 consecutive hours.

700.19 Requirements for Time Free from Duty
700.19 (1) Subject to subsection (2), an air operator shall provide each flight crew member with the following time free from duty:
(a) where the operation is conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 using an aircraft other than a helicopter, one period of at least 36 consecutive hours within each 7 consecutive days or one period of at least 3 consecutive calendar days within each 17 consecutive days;
(b) where the operation is conducted under Subpart 2 or 3 or is conducted using a helicopter, one period of at least 24 consecutive hours 13 times within each 90 consecutive days and 3 times within each 30 consecutive days; and
(c) where the flight crew member is a flight crew member on call, one period of at least 36 consecutive hours within each 7 consecutive days or one period of at least 3 consecutive calendar days within each 17 consecutive days.

(2) An air operator may provide a flight crew member with time free from duty other than as required by paragraphs (1)(a) and (b) if
(a) the time free from duty is authorized in the air operator certificate; and
(b) the air operator and the flight crew member comply with the Commercial Air Service Standards.
(3) An air operator shall notify a flight crew member on call of the commencement and duration of the flight crew member's time free from duty.

[2R]

Normally I cringe when people post a reply with a TC link, but yours Mach.28 was actually a fine quote of Guidance material.

Perhaps someone should ask the CP of a certain Northwestern Ontario chisel charter company, Hmmm can't quite place the name, Air Alpha, no, Charlie, no, it'll come to me. They schedule their pilots with no regard for any of the three reserve procedures. They even have a "flex" shift, where a pilot is on reserve for 24 hours straight. And apparently the pilots have to report while on reserve in under an hour.

How these hacks get by Transport I'll never know.

Sleeping on a bus travelling to another base counts as controlled rest ,according to the big sandwich guy

[paddy]

I think the biggest problem is the difference between on-call and reserve - where reserve has specific requirements set forth wrto defined rest, yet on-call, other then a definition has no other reference or guideline. Operators tend to interperate this as "If on-call were to be limited like reserve that would have been said in the CAR's therefor it is not..." This leads to the "Gray Area" and consequently people are put on 24 hour a day on-call.

[frankfrank]

Hmmmmm, I don't think "on call" is as grey an area as you may think. It was stated above that the two are almost identical except that "on call" has the pilot reporting in less than an hour.

As far as being on either "on reserve" or "on call" if the conditions of the CARS (a) and (b) cannot not be met, which being on reserve/call 24 hours a day would mean, then the duty day cannot exceed 10 hours. I do know the poor pilots working for this hack outfit put in 14 to 15 hour duty days in this case.

I'm surprised some fool from that company hasn't posted a response defending the companies actions, which is usually the norm in this forum. Maybe they're reading this and realizing they're getting the shaft.

Or, hopefully some TC inspector is browsing and is now planning to lay down the long dick of the law at the next audit!

[The Old Fogducker]

A Regulator:

Thanks for assembling all of that information in one place.

I had discussions with somone recently who failed to appreciate the differences between certain designations. You provided instant clarity on the situation.

Regards,
The Old Fogducker

[2.5milefinal]

The whole 'On Call, Reserve' thing is BS.
Transport knows it, the Owners know it, the CPs know it and most pilots know it.
Everyone chooses to ignore the problem.
24 hour on call ...really ?
" if you don't feel safe to fly then you should turn down the flight" yeah that's a good one too