Too Good to be True?

[dirtdr]

So I am shopping for a first airplane for myself to use as a x-country machine. I have just over 200hrs... Mostly all longer x-countries post ppl.

After renting a block of time on a PA28 and a C172, i have started looking for something a little faster for regular trips across alberta (400 miles).

So i find this 172RG that is available in my area with a fresh engine and decent equipment/paint/interior. I looked up the specs outlined below (from a downloaded 1980 172RG POH):
140kt cruise.... Firewalled at 8500ft 10.x gph
130+kt cruise down to 60% power
1050ish pounds useful load

What am iI missing? These numbers seem too good to be true. Is there something really terrible about this airframe? Why dont we see more of these around?

[CFR]

RG's seem to go for much less in general. I asked around for a reason and got a lot of speculation but no hard facts. Things like gear collapses and the cost of annual gear swing were put forward as reasons people shied away from them, but ...

[ahramin]

If you are looking at buying a specific aircraft, join the type club and start asking questions of the people who already own one.

www.cessna.org

[dirtdr]

Can the cost of an annual gear swing really be that much?

I checked on insurance rates and rates are only $100/yr more than a 172m.. And only for the first year. 5hrs dual required to transition to folding gear.

[ahramin]

The gear swing isn't all that much work but you do need someone with the proper jacks. Don't put your airplane on jacks unless those jacks are approved for that aircraft type.

It's not the gear swing, it's when the gear doesn't swing.

[co-joe]

If you're comparing the price of the RG to the rest of the 172 line up remember the regular skyhawk prices are inflated by flight school demand. You can't spin an RG so it's really useless for PPL/CPL training, and with dissappearing legs, and a fixed pitch wind shovel maintenance costs are slightly higher and there's always the possibility a student gears it up. I loved the RG at my flight school. I payed the extra $20 an hour every chance I got. Great machine through and through. The Arrow is 20 kts faster (more with gap seals and VG's) but has way more AD's I think if you wanted to compare a similar machine.

[AirFrame]

A lot of the issue is with how high the airplane has to be jacked to allow the gear to swing... The legs hang down like the bollocks on a pitbull when they are retracted. Looks damned unnerving from the ground every time one takes off. But hey, it works! And the plane does look nice with the gear up.

You just need jacks that pick the plane up at the tiedown rings and hoist it a further 5' into the air. Or so.

[Rookie50]

Have some Rg Time. That 140 kt cruise is a fantasy based on what I've seen, although I wasn't firewalling it. They are 125 -130, on a good day.

[iflyforpie]

Have some Rg Time. That 140 kt cruise is a fantasy based on what I've seen, although I wasn't firewalling it. They are 125 -130, on a good day.

+1

The Cardinal RG is a solid 130 knot plane; I can't see the 172 RG being faster.

[Mr Ed]

Get a tiger. Low maint and way cooler - literally. As a 17 year tiger driver /owner i can guarantee lower maint than any rg and at least 130kts cruise., 950 lbs useful load. Trick is finding a decent one.

[Schooner69A]

dirtdr: have you considered any of the Van's tribe of aircraft? The -6s, 7s, and 8s will all cruise twenty to thirty knots faster than their equivalent factory built aircraft. (Yes, I am biased as I'm building one) Now, those listed are two place aircraft which may not suit your requirements, but they are solidly built and a delight to fly. If you've never been up in one before, you should try and do so...

PS Go to www.vansaircraft.com for more info on the series

John

[rigpiggy]

what is your budget, and what are you trying to accomplish? If you want a fast retract get a mooney, smaller inside but good value for money. A later model 210 with the struts will cost about as much, go farther, faster, with more load, or get the P206 for lower maintenance. There may also be a leaseback or shared a/c opportunity. Just make sure maintenance is up to snuff
http://www.trade-a-plane.com/search?s-t ... c&s-page=1
http://www.trade-a-plane.com/detail/air ... 60821.html

[Rookie50]

Get A R182, I did. Lots turning over in the US, Useful load, space, reasonable speed, very stable.

[dirtdr]

I have been watchin a few rv-6s in the area... just today i found myself in the same general place and altitude as an rv6. I was worried cause he wasnt answering my calls... finally we talked to each other and i asked him his speed... 160knots... he was ahead of me.... ok.. NO CONFLICT!!!

But i do want a 4 seater (for the kids at least) and something i can afford to put gas in...

50k +- is my budget.
And something that can do 400 miles on 100l of gas.
And prefer somethibg i dont have to pour myself in and out of (the piper low wing single door drives me nuts)

[Bede]

dirtdr,

Careful. With that price range you might end up with the crappiest RG on the market. You're best of deciding on an airplane and buying the best one you can. You'll thank yourself when it comes to the first annual. If you can't get the best aircraft of it's type on your budget, go to a smaller airplane.

+1 to the guy who said Grumman Tiger. They aren't great on grass though.

[akoch]

I've been flying my Diamond DA20 for 300h now. It will do 135ktn TAS any day any altitude on 6 Gph. It will do 140 ktn tas "almost" any day on about 6.2 Gph. Occasionally 145-147 ktn, when things align on a really good day, and depending on altitude it will be about 6.2-6.7 Gph. Range is 600 nautical (on 96 litters). It is a two-seater only, so it crosses it out from your list I suspect.

Now I just moved up to the DA40. Exactly same speed, 4 (or more like 3 seats with full fuel), about 800 range. At literally twice the fuel burn, and exactly twice fuel on-board.

Pick your poison, I guess. But I have been very happy with the 20, and whoever gets it will enjoy it as well.

[akoch]

RV7/RV6s are awesome airplanes. Yes, they will do honest 160 ktn tas on about 9 Gph. At least the one I have access to does.

[cncpc]

Have some Rg Time. That 140 kt cruise is a fantasy based on what I've seen, although I wasn't firewalling it. They are 125 -130, on a good day.

Exactly. Got 300 or so hours in them. 140 kts in a shallow dive. Your numbers are correct. Otherwise, everything else is pretty accurate in the ad.

They did have some issue with blade fractures on the props. I know our competitor back in the day had a chunk come off back in the day, and we did a couple of years later.

[CFR]

I have been watchin a few rv-6s in the area... just today i found myself in the same general place and altitude as an rv6. I was worried cause he wasnt answering my calls... finally we talked to each other and i asked him his speed... 160knots... he was ahead of me.... ok.. NO CONFLICT!!!

But i do want a 4 seater (for the kids at least) and something i can afford to put gas in...

50k +- is my budget.
And something that can do 400 miles on 100l of gas.
And prefer somethibg i dont have to pour myself in and out of (the piper low wing single door drives me nuts)

Budget and desire often conflict. You can probably get an older 4 place that does what you want, but may kill you in future costs (I can probably get you an airworthy twin for 50K that will cruise 160 kts and easily carry 4 but ...). You can definitely get a newer 172 or 182 for 50K if it has been owned by a flight or parachute school with 19K hours on it. Try and find something your budget can handle with some room for first year surprises. Buying a bargain with no room for fixes can make the whole airplane owning thing unpleasant and result in a parked plane. I cannot stress enough building a relationship with an AME you trust (preferably one who allows you to assist or do some of the work yourself) who knows your aircraft type and is not an automatic parts changer. It doesn't hurt to foster the same type of relationship with someone who knows avionics (repairing vs replacing an older transponder is an interesting discussion).

Don't get me wrong, I am very happy that I bought my own plane that is within my means to own and operate, but it is not my "dream plane". Take your time and you will find the right one for you.

[bmc]

Another option is to find 1-2 partners to be able to increase the budget for the purchase and share in the expenses.

I also think the Tiger is a good consideration. Quick little four place.