I figured this was worth its own thread since it's been such a hot topic for a while now. The regs have been amended and 60 days from today co-pilot time will officially count 1 for 1.
Government of Canada introduces changes to pilot licensing
February 12, 2014 – Ottawa – Transport Canada
The Honourable Lisa Raitt today announced amendments to the Canadian Aviation Regulations which will set the groundwork for the introduction of the Multi-crew Pilot Licence (MPL), extend the validity period of medical certificates associated with certain pilot licences and modify the requirements regarding credits of co-pilot flight time.
Industry groups, including training organizations, pilot associations, unions and operator associations, have widely supported these regulatory amendments, which bring Canada in line with international standards.
The amendments were published in the Canada Gazette, Part I in February 2013, followed by a 30 day public consultation period. The final regulations were published in Canada Gazette II today and come into force 60 days from today.
Quick Facts
The regulatory amendments introducing the MPL are the first step toward establishing the MPL in Canada. The next step is updating certification standards for approved training organizations (ATO) intending to deliver MPL training.
MPL training is an innovative and structured competency-based program, specifically designed to develop the skills and knowledge required to become an airline co-pilot.
Other international civil aviation authorities, such as the United Kingdom, Germany, Sweden, Switzerland, allow MPL training.
Certain pilot medical certificates will have a longer validity period in accordance with recent changes to international standards.
All experience gained as a co-pilot can now be put towards other pilot licences, making it easier for pilots to progress professionally.
And more importantly (at least for some of us cheap old unorganized f#%ks):
(6.1) The validity period of a medical certificate for a commercial pilot licence, a multi-crew pilot licence — aeroplane and an airline transport pilot licence, if the holder of the licence is acting as a flight crew member for hire or reward, is 12 months.
Sorry about thread hijack.
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A very sad day indeed, dumbing down the already low standard of training in our country. In my opinion in order to have your ATPLs you should be required to have Co-Pilot time at 50% but also a minimum of 500 hours as FO in a two crew airplane.
As great as it sounds for some, it's probably going to have zero effect other than getting pilots their ATPL sooner.
There are still only so many left seat positions, and those will still open up at the same rate with attrition. The most qualified pilots will be hired, and this legislation probably won't be a factor in their experience.
So the number of ATPL rated co pilots will rise.
What it might change is the number of pilots who are willing to go work for the ATPL factories for peanuts because they figure they will get ahead faster than it used to take.... meaning less job opportunities and lower wages.
Unless the law states that it is retroactive, only
co-pilot time AFTER 60 days from today will
count 1:1
?
Nope. All previously logged time will count.
On a brighter note, time logged on the ramp will now count as 50% towards your forklift drivers ticket and ATPL.
So whats the deal with the MPL? As far as I can work out, its designed for ab-initio students to be able to quickly get a licence to act as a FO on a multi turbine 705 aircraft. So what happens after that, how do these guys ever get an ATPL and upgrade?
Duffman wrote:So whats the deal with the MPL? As far as I can work out, its designed for ab-initio students to be able to quickly get a licence to act as a FO on a multi turbine 705 aircraft. So what happens after that, how do these guys ever get an ATPL and upgrade?
Once they have the required hours, they do a flight test and get the PPL/CPL/ATPL - It's all in the gazette.
A lot of people knock instructors, I frequently knock instructors who are in it for the hours, that being said it does take some form of decision making choosing when to take over from a student who needs to make mistakes but also needs to not kill you. Should time spent as a training captain doing line indoc count for less than regular captain time? I know your time as a training captain should be cut to the 5% mark
but am I reading this correctly...
I don't have to do a medical every 6 months (ATPL) when over 40 unless I'm flying SPIFR with pax...
Mandatory 6 month medicals now start at 60...
Hell YA!
BBB
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Brantford Beech Boy wrote:I don't know about that co-pilot time thing....
but am I reading this correctly...
I don't have to do a medical every 6 months (ATPL) when over 40 unless I'm flying SPIFR with pax...
Mandatory 6 month medicals now start at 60...
Hell YA!
BBB
Nope you're not reading it correctly.
- It's "40 years of age or over", not "over 40."
- It's "single pilot operation", not "single pilot IFR operation."
The co-pilot time thing doesn't bother me too much. Do I think the new rule makes aviation safer? No, I do not. I have a hard time understanding how the "safety case" was made for this decision. However, I do believe that the employer has always had the responsibility to decide whether or not someone is competent to hold a certain responsibility regardless of the license held. I think this has always been the case. It's too bad that Transport Canada isn't more help in this responsibility, but that's life, I guess. Transport Canada's requirements to hold a license above "private" are so woefully low in the first place, who cares if they lower them even further? Frankly I think if they dropped the whole concept of "licenses" nothing would change. The industry decides who is competent. There are people with licenses who shouldn't be in an aeroplane at all, we all know that... so given that, what is a "license" worth? Nothing.We just have to remind ourselves that Transport Canada is just another obstacle to reducing error and loss, and deal with them as we do anything else like weather, terrain, fatigue, incompetence, or complacency.
esp803 wrote:A sad day for the standards of Aviation in my books.
E
If instructing can count 1:1, surely speculating from the RHS AND actuating the flaps should do so as well??
+1
And a -1
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Flying is better than walking. Walking is better than running. Running is better than crawling. All of these however, are better than extraction by a Med-Evac, even if this is technically a form of flying.
I love all the negative comments from all the bitter ATPL holders. Common guys, that a second and think about it.
You all know damn well that an instructor who putts around the circuit for 1300 hours is no where near as qualified for an ATPL than his counter part who left instructing when he had the ATPL pic requirements and has 1000 hours multi crew turbine time flying hard imc.
When the shortage is in full swing and 704 operators keep losing their captains to larger 705's, they're going to have to lower their left seat requirements. It's pure economics. Do you want Captain 172 up front in the 1900 you're riding?
Well I for one am happy. it means I can get my ATPL sooner and get it over with. Will it get me another job quicker? No. Will I get captain quicker? No. As already stated, the employer will decide when I am ready, whether I have 1500 hours or 3000 hours, they will decide when they think is the right time to give me captain on something with more than one engine. Until then I will keep on flying and getting experience as I have until now.
So what is the actual reason for this 1 for 1 rule? I know they mention it is to bring everything in line with ICAO, but why? Is it to make the life of an MPL-holder easier?
