YYZ pilot questions

This forum has been developed to discuss ATS related topics.

Moderators: ahramin, sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, North Shore

Rank 0
Rank 0
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2016 8:50 am

Re: YYZ pilot questions

#26 Post by OscarKilo » Thu Oct 27, 2016 8:57 am

skypirate88 wrote:
At what point does the decision get made to switch to CATII operations? Does it impact the operation that significantly if an aircraft requests such an approach?
We change when the ceiling drops below 200 or we get numerous missed approaches because of the weather

CAT1 ILS vectored spacing is 2.5-3miles in a dedicated land and 5-6 miles in a mixed mode

CAT2 ILS is 8-10 miles dedicated or 14-16 miles mixed mode

The reason being in dedicated the arrival must have exited the runway and be established on the parallel taxiway by the time the next arrival is at 4NM final, in mixed mode the departure has to have overflown the localizer by the time the arrival is 4NM final

Where a CAT1 approach the arrival needs to be off the runway pavement by the time the next arrival is at the threshold and in mixed mode the departure needs to be rolling when the arrival crosses 2Nm final
---------- ADS -----------

Married a Canadian
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 181
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2007 5:22 pm
Location: YYZ terminal

Re: YYZ pilot questions

#27 Post by Married a Canadian » Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:32 am

I am just curious why the CATII wasn't being offered given the reports
The switch from CAT I to II/III is ALWAYS tough...and usually always ends up as confusing till an operation is established.
Not only does the cloud base get taken into account..but also the RVRs and whether they are trending lower or not. I was working the day in question, and at the time of the overshoots ALL of our minima were still above CAT II.

The minute we start advertising either CAT II or CAT III it will start restricting traffic, and there are also certain carriers that have different limits/minima who may or may not be able to conduct the approach. You can understand that if the weather limits aren't yet at our minima, we are reluctant to advertise...as we are then delaying...perhaps unnecessarily.
What happened on this day in question is that it took a few missed approaches for the weather and RVR to update, by this point we had aircraft in the arrival area who were unable to do the CAT II approach, or were able but needed the RVR to be above a certain level that was not being indicated at the time.

It is never straightforward to start with, we have our set minima for CAT II/III operations. We are aware that different aircraft and flight crew have their own minima in what they need to conduct an approach. It is best for us to set what we can and can't accept, then it is one size fits all....you can or you can't.
---------- ADS -----------

Rank 5
Rank 5
Posts: 340
Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2010 6:46 am

Re: YYZ pilot questions

#28 Post by skypirate88 » Sat Oct 29, 2016 5:06 pm

Thanks Oscarkilo and Married a Canadian. It is always nice to learn more about the job the folks on the other side of the radio do.

I was only looking at the fact that we nearly missed, and didn't even consider that there would be operators that potentially could not conduct the approach. I hope the tone of my question wasn't taken the wrong way.

Cheers. I appreciate the time you took to answer it for me.
---------- ADS -----------
A mile of road will take you a mile, but a mile of runway can take you anywhere

Post Reply

Return to “ATS Question Forum”