On take off the controller was like "abc, no join on your transponder!" I asked him to repeat and he said the exact same thing

Has anyone heard this before? Is this is the correct ATC phraseology when your mode C isn't reporting? It seemed kind of confusing at the time.

I don't recall what I've been told before when either my mode C wasn't even on or I had to cycle the ident, but it was something pretty straightforward and it was not along the lines of "abc no join on your transponder!" lol kind of cracks me up. He had an overseas accent I don't know if it was just a different way of saying it that made sense to him and not me but there shouldn't be ambiguity like that in class C.

And also if you have someone that has "no joining of their transponder" would you tell that pilot 100 feet off the runway?

No joy?

100% certain he said « no joy ». In other words, we can’t see it or it’s not working.

Braun wrote: ↑Wed May 20, 2020 10:32 am 100% certain he said « no joy ». In other words, we can’t see it or it’s not working.

This

Re-cycle your transponder - and see if that helps.

Braun wrote: ↑Wed May 20, 2020 10:32 am 100% certain he said « no joy ». In other words, we can’t see it or it’s not working.

thanks for clearing that up, he must have said "no joy"

any deeper explanation of what that means exactly and why that's used as opposed to anything else? Just curious that's all but good to know.

and thanks ill pass this on

It means your transponder is either not working at all, or not displaying a Mode C readout on their radar. All you need to do is either cycle the transponder OFF and then back to Mode C again and see if that clears it up... or, turn the bloody thing on to begin with.

Sure, it may very well be non-standard phraseology according to NavCanada; but whom among us hasn't used a bit of plain English on the radio from time to time to get the point across?

From Urban Dictionary:

"No joy is an English expression meaning a lack of success or failure; it can also mean a lack of luck. It is believed to derive from the lack of happiness or joy when success is achieved or a stroke of good fortune is encountered. Therefore no success, no luck, no joy."

AnonPilot wrote: ↑Thu May 21, 2020 11:48 am From Urban Dictionary:

"No joy is an English expression meaning a lack of success or failure; it can also mean a lack of luck. It is believed to derive from the lack of happiness or joy when success is achieved or a stroke of good fortune is encountered. Therefore no success, no luck, no joy."

hahaha thanks man, no joy it is

No joy is also the Nato Brevity Codeword for something not working. The controller might be ex military and just reverting back to the term that they were used to.

nutlord wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 2:09 pm No joy is also the Nato Brevity Codeword for something not working. The controller might be ex-military and just reverting back to the term that they were used to.

Cool man, thanks. That's what I was wondering - if there was an underlying meaning or background to the term. cheers!

nutlord wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 2:09 pm No joy is also the Nato Brevity Codeword for something not working. The controller might be ex military and just reverting back to the term that they were used to.

It is a Nato Brevity codeword/phrase but it doesn't mean "not working", rather in the air environment it means "Aircrew does not have visual contact with the target/bandit/bogey/landmark or enemy position"

The controller is saying he can't see your transponder.

I am curious as to which controller told the OP this, the departure controller? The reason I ask is the OP questioned whether a controller should be telling them this 100 feet off the runway. The only reason I would talk to them is if they called me on departure. So if it was the departure controller telling them this after they checked in I have to ask, why did they call him so low and what did they expect him to say/do?

Whoops, I confused it with "bent".

Speaking of "NATO brevity" I recall an RAF Ascot Hercules respond to my inquiries by saying "That's all charlie, all charlie" I responded by saying "Say again". He of course responded by repeating "That's all charlie, all charlie". He of course meant "That is all correct" The use of the phraseology was new to me.

kevenv wrote: ↑Sat May 23, 2020 4:08 am

nutlord wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 2:09 pm No joy is also the Nato Brevity Codeword for something not working. The controller might be ex military and just reverting back to the term that they were used to.

It is a Nato Brevity codeword/phrase but it doesn't mean "not working", rather in the air environment it means "Aircrew does not have visual contact with the target/bandit/bogey/landmark or enemy position"

The controller is saying he can't see your transponder.

I am curious as to which controller told the OP this, the departure controller? The reason I ask is the OP questioned whether a controller should be telling them this 100 feet off the runway. The only reason I would talk to them is if they called me on departure. So if it was the departure controller telling them this after they checked in I have to ask, why did they call him so low and what did they expect him to say/do?

Thanks for the additional information about "no joy" If it means visual contact then why would he say no joy to the transponder when he was looking for the transponder on the radar screen?

And yes tower said contact departure airborne so I checked in with departures once airborne. I usually make the call to whomever after gear up so ya pretty low, 100-200 feet above the runway maybe but that's off-topic I was just wondering about no joy

DadoBlade wrote: ↑Sat May 23, 2020 1:24 pm Speaking of "NATO brevity" I recall an RAF Ascot Hercules respond to my inquiries by saying "That's all charlie, all charlie" I responded by saying "Say again". He of course responded by repeating "That's all charlie, all charlie". He of course meant "That is all correct" The use of the phraseology was new to me.

I must say that is pretty interesting,

triplebarrel wrote: ↑Mon May 25, 2020 6:51 amThanks for the additional information about "no joy" If it means visual contact then why would he say no joy to the transponder when he was looking for the transponder on the radar screen?

Because he is looking at the radar screen where he would normally see the transponder return and can't see it, ie: no visual contact. Honestly this is the first time in 30 years that I have seen any confusion over this, either in the military or out.

triplebarrel wrote: ↑Mon May 25, 2020 6:51 amAnd yes tower said contact departure airborne so I checked in with departures once airborne. I usually make the call to whomever after gear up so ya pretty low, 100-200 feet above the runway maybe but that's off-topic I was just wondering about no joy

I only brought it up because you did in your post. If you don't want the controller talking to you while you are only 100 feet off the runway because you are busy doing other things, don't call him. "Contact departure airborne" doesn't mean you have to do it as soon as wheels are up. I have aircraft check in at all altitudes on the SID, from off the departure end to 5 miles out.

kevenv wrote: ↑Mon May 25, 2020 2:51 pm

triplebarrel wrote: ↑Mon May 25, 2020 6:51 amThanks for the additional information about "no joy" If it means visual contact then why would he say no joy to the transponder when he was looking for the transponder on the radar screen?

Because he is looking at the radar screen where he would normally see the transponder return and can't see it, ie: no visual contact. Honestly this is the first time in 30 years that I have seen any confusion over this, either in the military or out.

triplebarrel wrote: ↑Mon May 25, 2020 6:51 amAnd yes tower said contact departure airborne so I checked in with departures once airborne. I usually make the call to whomever after gear up so ya pretty low, 100-200 feet above the runway maybe but that's off-topic I was just wondering about no joy

I only brought it up because you did in your post. If you don't want the controller talking to you while you are only 100 feet off the runway because you are busy doing other things, don't call him. "Contact departure airborne" doesn't mean you have to do it as soon as wheels are up. I have aircraft check-in at all altitudes on the SID, from off the departure end to 5 miles out.

Yeah for sure, that all makes sense. thanks!! much appreciated