Swissair Flight 111 atc recording
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Swissair Flight 111 atc recording
This was recently released
http://www3.thestar.com/cgi-bin/star_st ... ssair.html
What is the procedure for fueling dumping when an emergency has been declared. Does it still needs to be over water?
http://www3.thestar.com/cgi-bin/star_st ... ssair.html
What is the procedure for fueling dumping when an emergency has been declared. Does it still needs to be over water?
ouch.... it's always a weird feeling to hear someone's last minutes...
regarding fuel dumping, the manops has been amended since then... at the time of the crash, it was necessary to protect all the airspace below the A/C to the ground, and up to 3000' above. now, we only have to protect 6000' below the A/C, which means that you can dump pretty much everywhere, given you are at least 6000' AGL.
however, as you say, when the pilot declares an emergency... things change.
have you noticed how unclear the situation was? no mention of smoke in the cockpit has been made on the frequency, except when the pilot hit the wrong button... that makes it pretty tough for the controller to take action...
regarding fuel dumping, the manops has been amended since then... at the time of the crash, it was necessary to protect all the airspace below the A/C to the ground, and up to 3000' above. now, we only have to protect 6000' below the A/C, which means that you can dump pretty much everywhere, given you are at least 6000' AGL.
however, as you say, when the pilot declares an emergency... things change.
have you noticed how unclear the situation was? no mention of smoke in the cockpit has been made on the frequency, except when the pilot hit the wrong button... that makes it pretty tough for the controller to take action...
I'm intercontinental when I eat french toast
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Last edited by wordstwice on Fri Apr 10, 2009 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
- invertedattitude
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ATC are trained under a variety of emergency generic situations. The problem with emergencies is that none of them are generic, every single situation is going to have different circumstances given the plethora of variables given in a controller airspace envrionment.
From what I understand, if the crew had proceeded directly to the airport they would have landed somewhere close to downtown Halifax, and even the best scenarios resulted in an off-field uncontrolled (Can't see) landing... so given the other possible scenarios this was likely the best outcome unfortunately.
From what I understand, if the crew had proceeded directly to the airport they would have landed somewhere close to downtown Halifax, and even the best scenarios resulted in an off-field uncontrolled (Can't see) landing... so given the other possible scenarios this was likely the best outcome unfortunately.
What I found very interesting in the newspaper article was the loss by Nav Canada on this issue, and the release of tapes and transcripts. It went to the Supreme Court.
Canada is now on par with the US. Tapes will probably be released to the media almost immediately.
Not just pilot/controller tapes, but controller/controller audio.
Lexx
http://www.ykf.ca
Canada is now on par with the US. Tapes will probably be released to the media almost immediately.
Not just pilot/controller tapes, but controller/controller audio.
Lexx
http://www.ykf.ca
First I would like to express my deepest sympathies for all involved with this tragic crash.
Regarding the handling of emergencies, common sense dictates
101.3
Do not deviate from a rule or a separation
minimum. You may, however, deviate from a
procedure provided the situation warrants. (N)
101.3 Note 1:
Deviations from procedures may be warranted for
reasons such as air/ground communications failure,
radar failure, inter-unit/sector communications
failure, and in-flight emergencies/contingencies.
Deviations for the purpose of expediting air traffic
should be avoided.
Regarding the handling of emergencies, common sense dictates
101.3
Do not deviate from a rule or a separation
minimum. You may, however, deviate from a
procedure provided the situation warrants. (N)
101.3 Note 1:
Deviations from procedures may be warranted for
reasons such as air/ground communications failure,
radar failure, inter-unit/sector communications
failure, and in-flight emergencies/contingencies.
Deviations for the purpose of expediting air traffic
should be avoided.
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