"1/2hr rule": Where'd it go?

[ywgflyboy]

Don't make me pull over!

[reality_check]

Reality check, (proper fitting name for you and this topic),
What are your credentials? And where do you get your info? You seem to be very upset over this topic. Your comments truly enlighten me to the fact that you don't have a clue as to how an operation runs. Its been stated before that every unit is different and within each unit every sector operates differently. "Work a half hour and then go on break??" Moron.
Staffing determines everything and how we operate each specialty. Time of day and volume also determines staffing requirements at the position. Some sectors could be, depending on time of year, leave, etc., PLUS staff on shift. How it is determined as to who is working and when, does not matter. Sectors are opened and closed tactically. This also determines staffing. By the time the evening shifts are done most sectors are combined into midnight configurations which does not require the same amount of staff. As long as bodies are available to be recalled what business is it of yours as to who goes home and when....Why so bitter about all this....Maybe that would be a far more interesting thread than your little bitch fest about what and how we run our operation.

IFRATC

ifratc, I'm sure all your blather is very interesting for those who do not already hold an ATC licence.

Unfortunately, staffing numbers have nothing to do with what we're talking about in this thread. Try and pay attention.

[IFRATC]

If there is enough bodies to fill traffic requirements and immediate recall at that given time what the F&CK does it matter??? Thats my blathering point idiot....
I scratch my head as to why you are so F&#KING bothered by this, whether you are a controller or a CT'ed trainee??? Aspirations of becoming another labotomy of a shift manager maybe??? Your pointless whining and crying is (a) embarassing if you are a controller: and (b) completely retarded if you are not.

IFRATC

[kevenv]

I must have left early, what was the point of this thread?

[reality_check]

If there is enough bodies to fill traffic requirements and immediate recall at that given time what the F&CK does it matter??? Thats my blathering point idiot....
I scratch my head as to why you are so F&#KING bothered by this, whether you are a controller or a CT'ed trainee??? Aspirations of becoming another labotomy of a shift manager maybe??? Your pointless whining and crying is (a) embarassing if you are a controller: and (b) completely retarded if you are not.

IFRATC

It isn't so much about traffic requirements, although that is definitely a concern.

It's about the lazy union mentality of controllers doing their grocery shopping when they're being paid to be in the building. After all, if you're paid for an X hr shift, shouldn't you actually be in the building during the shift? Seems pretty simple to me. If you pulled that stunt at any other job you'd be fired.

[sgt_fss]

If you pulled that stunt at any other job you'd be fired.

Controlling isn't like any other job. That's why most controllers love their job so much.

[reality_check]

If you pulled that stunt at any other job you'd be fired.

Controlling isn't like any other job. That's why most controllers love their job so much.

Uh, leaving early is not part of the collective agreement, and in fact has been explicitly prohibited via several memos from management, but thanks for coming out.

[cyeg66]

Uh, leaving early is not part of the collective agreement, and in fact has been explicitly prohibited via several memos from management, but thanks for coming out.

I just figured it out. You're management, aren't you?!?... Look, we're really sorry for leaving early b4 the end of our shifts. We just didn't think you were watching us as closely as preschool teachers watch their students in the playground that's next door to the pedophilia remand center. We thought we could police ourselves but you're right, we clearly aren't capable.

On a side note Mr. Manager, could you explain to me why these mysterious memos circulate in only select control centres and not all of them? *I say this having worked in 2 different centres where mgmt appears to have very different priorities...*

Oops. Gotta go. Almost late leaving early from work.



Edit: I guess what I mean is, give it a rest. No matter what angle you look at them from, rats never look good.

[Braun]

Actually, just leave him alone. He has absolutely no credibility and no one cares about him or his posting.

[tesox2]

I didnt get that memo!

[reality_check]

On a side note Mr. Manager, could you explain to me why these mysterious memos circulate in only select control centres and not all of them? *I say this having worked in 2 different centres where mgmt appears to have very different priorities...*

Well here's a news flash for you: there are seven centres in Canada. Perhaps yours hasn't had some of the blatant violations that others have.

[yippiekaiyea]

Um...does it REALLY make a whip of difference to anyone if ATC's have or have not got an unwritten policy to leave work early? Seriously? If they do, does that make them horrible people or something? If they don't, does that make them amazing somehow?

I'll tell you what I think is amazing: individuals who spend their working days ensuring that people who are experiencing the miracle of flight, while sitting in pressurized cigar containers, at 30000 feet, moving at just under the speed of sound, actually make it to their destinations safely every day. THAT is pretty amazing. I honestly wouldn't care if ATC's arranged for their schedules to include sleep, hot tubbing, playing hula hoops or yes...even leaving a bit early to head home everyday (if that's what's going on), because, frankly, they deserve praise for what they do.

Getting stuck in some semantical argument about some line item policy point seems to somehow be besides the point don't you think? Seriously people...take a chill pill and have a coke and a smile.

Peace

[IFRATC]

Yippiekaiyea,

Thanks!!!!

IFRATC

[ywgflyboy]

Um...does it REALLY make a whip of difference to anyone if ATC's have or have not got an unwritten policy to leave work early? Seriously? If they do, does that make them horrible people or something? If they don't, does that make them amazing somehow?

I'll tell you what I think is amazing: individuals who spend their working days ensuring that people who are experiencing the miracle of flight, while sitting in pressurized cigar containers, at 30000 feet, moving at just under the speed of sound, actually make it to their destinations safely every day. THAT is pretty amazing. I honestly wouldn't care if ATC's arranged for their schedules to include sleep, hot tubbing, playing hula hoops or yes...even leaving a bit early to head home everyday (if that's what's going on), because, frankly, they deserve praise for what they do.

Getting stuck in some semantical argument about some line item policy point seems to somehow be besides the point don't you think? Seriously people...take a chill pill and have a coke and a smile.

Peace

Not bad for a first post... Welcome aboard!

[cyeg66]

Well here's a news flash for you: there are seven centres in Canada. Perhaps yours hasn't had some of the blatant violations that others have.

Hey dipstick, news flash for you: I'm intimately familiar with the number of control centres accross Canada, which company policy is to recognize that there are 8 FIRs (Gander domestic + oceanic), but I digress. What I was actually saying was that I've worked in 2 centres that represent both ends of the spectrum. Now, as many (read: all) people, save yourself, have pointed out, nobody cares about your incessant boohoo'ing about an issue that does not involve you.

This menial issue of yours, I would compare to me bitching about pilots acting like hotshots in airports, walking around with prominent stripes on shoulders, neat and tidy uniforms, polished shoes and briefcases and an aire of arrogance about them. It only serves to magnify the fact that I'm a little bit jealous that it's them and not me.

Now, for the love of pete, quit while you're way, way behind.


Edit: and yippiekaiyea, nice job.

[reality_check]

The fact that some of you defend the violation of the contract is typical of the entitled attitude exhibited by many controllers. I guess time will tell whether or not the various MACCOs agree with your biased and arbitrary interpretation of what is written in black and white. Good luck with that when they start checking the numbers.

[IFRATC]

Loser,
They are always checking the numbers. Unlike you, they really don't care in the big scheme of things. As long as their operation runs smoothly they don't get hard-ons over minimal issues that DON'T affect the day to day operation of ATC. If that were the case, (and I will err a bit on the arrogant side) they know they would have an out right mutiny to deal with. The truth of the matter is they don't care. Airlines are not calling to complain about controllers and when they leave their shifts because it does not affect them. I suggest you go back to your little office and let the operation run like it should... smoothly...
I too have worked in multiple centres. I too have seen many sides of the management spectrum. Too much micro management inevitably leads to a volitile work atmosphere. Controllers are a strange bunch. We love our job, but don't like to be told how to do it. At the same time, we have to accept the fact that managers have the right to manage the operation. The right combination of respect between controllers and managers WILL work together to run an operation efficiently. That is what it comes down too. Maybe you should take that little green monster of a chip on your shoulder, along with your napolean complex and leave it outside the operation. You would be amazed at what a little mutual respect will do. Rarely will you ever see any type of combative environment here in YYZ. Respect my friend.... Learn to give some, and then you will gain some.

IFRATC

[Lurch]

This menial issue of yours, I would compare to me bitching about pilots acting like hotshots in airports, walking around with prominent stripes on shoulders, neat and tidy uniforms, polished shoes and briefcases and an aire of arrogance about them. It only serves to magnify the fact that I'm a little bit jealous of the fact that it's them and not me.

Thats it, controllers aren't grumpy because we are in their airspace, they are grumpy because they aren't in our seats

Lurch

[cyeg66]

Thats it, controllers aren't grumpy because we are in their airspace, they are grumpy because they aren't in our seats

Lurch

Damn hotshot pilots, makin' us grumpy

[reality_check]

Loser,
They are always checking the numbers. Unlike you, they really don't care in the big scheme of things.

I guess you're right, they do check once in a while. They did dock that guy in Winnipeg of 5 days' pay for leaving 45mins before the end of his shift. I suppose they do care once in a while, or else they wouldn't have docked him.