Super sonic homebuilt jet?

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Beefitarian
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Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#1 Post by Beefitarian » Sun Jul 03, 2011 8:33 pm

Sounds kind of crazy but possibly cool. Too bad it's nearly a million dollars.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFcXSqrk ... ure=relmfu
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#2 Post by ahramin » Mon Jul 04, 2011 6:55 pm

Kindof old news don't you think? It's already failed.
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#3 Post by iflyforpie » Mon Jul 04, 2011 7:43 pm

CAR 602.33 No person shall operate an aircraft at a true Mach number of 1 or greater.
http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/r ... htm#602_33
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#4 Post by Beefitarian » Tue Jul 05, 2011 6:49 am

So you would never own a fast car because it would be against the law to drive it full speed?
ahramin wrote:Kindof old news don't you think? It's already failed.
That's true but there must be someone else that missed the story. Rumor is there's one that flys in Canada still.
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#5 Post by Old Dog Flying » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:00 am

I believe that there were two built and both crashed due to inflight break-up as a result of control flutter...another Jim Bede venture
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#6 Post by Beefitarian » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:19 am

Let's both be wrong. 5 built 3 crashed 2 remain unflyable. Then again I don't trust Wikipedia completely either...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bede_BD-10
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#7 Post by cgzro » Tue Jul 05, 2011 4:39 pm

one crash was attributed to vertical fin separation the other was attributed to asymmetric flap deployment. Not sure about the third. The test pilot stepped down and that probably means he was scared. After that it changed hands.

The vertical fin forces were I believe underestimated even after modifications. This was new territory for composites.

The Bd 5j that crashed here in ottawa was also attributed to asymetric flap deployment but likely assembly error or construction error.

Too bad they were cool planes.
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#8 Post by Beefitarian » Tue Jul 05, 2011 4:46 pm

Pretty cool but how hard do you want to push something you assembled in your garage?
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#9 Post by RenegadeAV8R » Tue Jul 19, 2011 3:00 pm

Old Dog Flying wrote:I believe that there were two built and both crashed due to inflight break-up as a result of control flutter...another Jim Bede venture
Jim Bede created some successful and innovative design; the Grumman American AA5 series was first designed by Jim Bede. I think that was the first civil aircraft to use honeycomb structure and glued skin. But history is telling us the he was not a successful businessman.

cgzro wrote:
The Bd 5j that crashed here in ottawa was also attributed to asymetric flap deployment but likely assembly error or construction error.

Too bad they were cool planes.
IIRC, the asymmetric flap deployment was caused by a flap linkage that did not engage properly when the wing was re-installed (the aircraft was transported in an enclosed trailer, with its wings removed). Maybe that could fall into the "assembly error". There is a report about this tragic accident, somewhere on the internet.
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#10 Post by cgzro » Tue Jul 19, 2011 7:36 pm

But history is telling us the he was not a successful businessman
In terms of success .. how many aircraft designers names do you know...
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#11 Post by rigpiggy » Tue Jul 19, 2011 11:35 pm

dick van grunsven
jim stewart
dan denney
dean wilson
rob bushby
steve wittman
christen
john thorp

just off the top of my head
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#12 Post by cgzro » Wed Jul 20, 2011 7:25 am

That was my point, but I realize I stated it poorly. We know aircraft designers because they inspired us but we don't know many buisness men.
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#13 Post by RenegadeAV8R » Wed Jul 20, 2011 9:17 am

cgzro wrote:That was my point, but I realize I stated it poorly. We know aircraft designers because they inspired us but we don't know many buisness men.
Many of Jim Bede businesses were not successful.

But several aircraft designer were very successful businessman.

Christ Heinz designed several homebuilt/kit build aircraft and is business Zenair/Zenith is still doing great. Zenair/Zenith sold several ready to fly aircraft to several countries. Christ Heinz even designed a few certified aircraft.

Burt Rutan, from Scaled Composite. He designed the Vari-Eze among others, he designed the Voyager aircraft, more recently he designed Space ship One... and he won the Ansari X-prize in 2004. Burt Rutan started his career working for Bede Aircraft. Burt Rutan just retired, but Scaled Composite remains.


My initial remark was simply that Jim Bede created several interesting design, but he was not able to sustain his business with them.
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#14 Post by Beefitarian » Sat Jul 23, 2011 7:26 am

I'm in my wife's trailer in an RV park in Oregon. This designer/businessman talk makes me think of the man responsible for me being here. I think there could be an argument that some of his planes were failures. He flew one into a house, the one I'm here to see arguably didn't fly as it only lifted off and went a few miles in ground effect on it's only taxi run.

Maybe that's part of what made him a bad businessman and caused him to grow his hair and nails in a hotel in LasVegas while the H-4 Hurcules sat fully fueled and ready for departure within forty five minutes or whatever his orders were.

One of the guys I spoke with in the modeller's club worked for the guy in various non H-4 electronics projects. Him and another fellow told me about an incident during production of the H-4 when the guy just went into seclusion for 6 months. But because he micro managed everything no one was allowed to start a new task until the one they completed was personally inspected and approved. Pretty much everyone was waiting for approval and reassignment. Production ceased but everyone was required to come to work everyday at full pay waiting for him to return so the plane could be finished.

Then again due to his financial abilities to do all those things, most people probably would argue he was a great businessman. I personally think he was a great aircraft designer though obviously a bit mentally ill.
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#15 Post by Beefitarian » Sat Jul 23, 2011 7:29 am

Oh and there's a bunch of Burt's planes here and one cool space glider that could be described as failed since they didn't end up using it.
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#16 Post by Beefitarian » Sat Aug 06, 2011 8:07 am

Come back guys. Let's talk about Howard Hughes Jr. I think his dad's drill bit was the only reason he couldn't fail in business. Well... Maybe That and Noah.
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#17 Post by YYZSaabGuy » Sat Aug 06, 2011 12:41 pm

Enjoy the Spruce Goose, Beef. I was fortunate to see it in Los Angeles several years ago before it was moved to its current venue. It was absolutely gorgeous.
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#18 Post by Beefitarian » Sat Aug 06, 2011 6:13 pm

It was pretty amazing. $25 for a picture in the flight deck, even my wife who all but said, "Groan, another airplane museum? Ok." was impressed and excited.

It's good that the building is packed with planes all over the place partially under various parts of Senior Hughes' flying boat but it confuses you as to the immense size of it. I can't believe he never flew it at very least a bit more if for no other reason than to just to check it out or to say, "I told you it could fly!!"
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#19 Post by Bede » Fri Sep 23, 2011 6:34 pm

Both BD-10 crashes had nothing to do with Jim Bede's design. The first one was a stab failure which was redesigned, the second flap assymetry was a new flap design as well.

Bede may have over promised/under delivered on the -5, but was probably one of the most progressive light aircraft designers of the past 50 years.

PS I'm not related to any Bede family, but used to own a -5.
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#20 Post by takatiki » Mon Jun 17, 2013 7:29 am

I think before the Aircraft Designs inc made recalculations the flutterproplem after mach 0.85 was fixed. Plane reached mach 0.85 using 60% power.

Here is my PW615F powered twin supposed to go really near mach. Paper tiger as it for now..but looking for coengineers designers for it.

Any comment on it ?

http://forum.keypublishing.com/attachme ... 1371416498
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#21 Post by JMACK » Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:18 pm

Beefitarian wrote:Sounds kind of crazy but possibly cool. Too bad it's nearly a million dollars.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFcXSqrk ... ure=relmfu



Too cool Beef wish I was rich wish they held together better! Tanks for posting Brother! I missed it!

J
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#22 Post by Beefitarian » Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:35 pm

There is supposed to be a bd-5 at AirVenture Oshkosh this year.

http://www.airventure.org/news/2013/130 ... rojet.html

Speaking of "Wish I was rich." I went on a tour of Viking today, new twin otter, just about $7million.
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#23 Post by takatiki » Tue Jun 18, 2013 9:18 am

Beefitarian wrote:There is supposed to be a bd-5 at AirVenture Oshkosh this year.

http://www.airventure.org/news/2013/130 ... rojet.html

Speaking of "Wish I was rich." I went on a tour of Viking today, new twin otter, just about $7million.

That Microjet is awesome..just 1.1 kN of thrust. Cri Cri jet would cost just 40 000 canadian dollars if you can build one..it uses only 0.45 kN.
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#24 Post by ScudRunner » Wed Sep 25, 2013 9:35 pm

http://www.controller.com/listingsdetai ... 286967.htm

or just buy one of these for 165K and not worry about design flaws or spending 2 mil and having to put it together.
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Re: Super sonic homebuilt jet?

#25 Post by North Shore » Wed Sep 25, 2013 9:43 pm

^ Yes, but will it do 'The Ton'?

Colonel Sanders, care to comment here?
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