Lost medical

[J31]

I have recently heard of commercial pilots losing their medical because of a medication they where taking. This was after their doctor said it was fine and it was discovered later it was not. It has me wondering about cold medications, etc. Is there a web site at TC that lists approved and prohibited medication for pilots?

[Louis]

I don't think TC publishes such a list, the FAA does not, I did however find this list which should be of some help:

http://www.aviationmedicine.com/meds.htm

[CallForProposals]

Is it just me, or does there seem to be a real/potential problem with medication and aviation medicals?

How can a pilot be expected to disclose medications he/she is using if there is always the potential that a medical can be denied?
Does TC really think that a pilot taking Effexor (anti-depressant) is going to disclose this information to the AME?

Also, with such strict confidentiality laws, is there really any way your AME or TC could find out about prescribed medications if the pilot does not directly volunteer this information?

[Hedley]

A friend of mine investigated an accident - I think it was the F-20 demo in Europe. The pilot experienced GLOC after one negative, then nine positive.

By looking at his credit card records, they found his purchases of unapproved medicine.

So, I guess the moral of the story is to pay cash, and grunt harder.

[Jaques Strappe]

Rather than worry about TC giving you a temp medical suspension while taking the medication, maybe you should be worrying more about the potential liability you are risking yourself and family to, should there be an accident.

Even if you were not at the controls at the time, they find out you were on some non approved maedication, your ass is grass. In the U.S. good bye job, house, car credit and hello bankruptcy after the lawyers are done.

Seems like a no-brainer to me.

[Cat Driver]

This is a very tricky area of flying, however to make it simple if you do not feel medically fit or if you suspect that something you have taken will impair or has impaired your normal functions the last place you want to be is behind the controls of an aircraft...

..TC is your least worry.

Flying is all about decision making and good airmanship, and knowing when to say no.

Cat

[CallForProposals]

Jaques and Cat Driver -

Your explanation and logic works in theory, but how practical is it?

I'll put out two of my initial questions again:

1) Does TC really think that a pilot taking Effexor (anti-depressant) is going to disclose this information to the AME?

2) Also, with such strict confidentiality laws, is there really any way your AME or TC could find out about prescribed medications if the pilot does not directly volunteer this information?


I think in many cases, the answer to #1 is going to be
no!

In the case of #2, if the answer is no, then I think there is certainly a problem with the system.

I'm in no way advocating breaking rules regarding restricted medications, I'm just trying to discuss this issue realistically, keeping in mind human nature. Unfortunately, knowing when to say NO doesn't work for all pilots.

[Cat Driver]

" Unfortunately, knowing when to say NO doesn't work for all pilots. "

True, but those of us who can use common sense and can say no live longer.

Cat

[Boss Hawg]

2) Also, with such strict confidentiality laws, is there really any way your AME or TC could find out about prescribed medications if the pilot does not directly volunteer this information?

The first medical I did, the CAME asked if I was taking any prescription meds and I said no. I had actually been prescribed an inhaler a few years earlier that I rarely, almost never used. A few weeks later I got a letter in the mail from TC saying "we know you take this medicine, don't use it while flying" or something to that effect.

[J31]

I don't think TC publishes such a list, the FAA does not, I did however find this list which should be of some help:

http://www.aviationmedicine.com/meds.htm

Thanks that helps

[J31]

Rather than worry about TC giving you a temp medical suspension while taking the medication, maybe you should be worrying more about the potential liability you are risking yourself and family to, should there be an accident.

Even if you were not at the controls at the time, they find out you were on some non approved maedication, your ass is grass. In the U.S. good bye job, house, car credit and hello bankruptcy after the lawyers are done.

Seems like a no-brainer to me.

The point is how do you as a pilot know what is "non approved" We have the CAR's that spell out the regulations on a web site but we can not find out if Claritin is legal! (non drowsy I know is) Yes we can ask our TC medical doctor but ultimately we as pilots are legally responsible. If he gives you wrong info your ass is still grass

[Airtids]

Best course of action for a pilot who worries about these things is to use an AME as your family doctor. It's their JOB to know what's approved and what isn't. Jacques and Cat have hit the nail on the head- TC shouldn't be your big concern. If you follow the above advice, you have somewher to deflect the blame and the liability.

[Cat Driver]

We as pilots / mechanics are the final authority on whether or not we are physically and mentally fit to safely perform our duties.

Only we know for sure how we feel on a given day, our Doctor is the one that we turn to when we do not feel well or suspect that somethingis changing.

I quit drinking over twenty years ago because I "knew" that I was in a danger zone as far as my ability to function on a safe level was concerned. When I took the cure for alcoholism my only issue with TC was to inform them that I had gone to the Shick Shadel Clinic in Seattle and gave them access to my medical records in the USA and that was to insure that should I ever start drinking again my pilots license would be suspended.

When I did my medical in Amsterdam last month I answered "yes" on the medical form to the question asking if I had ever been treated for drug addiction or alcohol abuse....one of the Doctors that examined me was amazed that I had answered yes to that question, she said that in over 30 years of doing airmen medicals she had never seen a pilot answer yes to that question.

She also said that if only more of her clients would do that she would be quite happy, as she knows that the problem is systemic in aviation.

Anyhow CARs and TC are nothing more than guidelines by which we determine what to do, the real determing factor is your own self worth.

Cat

[Jaques Strappe]

callforproposals

Does TC really think that a pilot taking Effexor (anti-depressant) is going to disclose this information to the AME?

They don't think, they dictate and a pilot is required to disclose this info to the AME.

2) Also, with such strict confidentiality laws, is there really any way your AME or TC could find out about prescribed medications if the pilot does not directly volunteer this information?

Who cares? if there is an accident and they go looking for someone to pin the blame on and a blood test reveals a medication that a) noboby knew about and b) should not be there, you are history.

A guy got done in the U.S for a runway over run and because he was trying to have kids and was on some drug to get the boys swimming, he was roasted. The over run had nothing to do with him taking a fertility drug. Didn't matter, he had no defense and even if he had one, it evaporated when this came to light.

It is kind of like walking around with a great big skid mark in your drawers. Nobody will know about it until you are in an accident!

[captain_v1.0]

Your best bet in any cases is probably to be open and honest with your AME, you've both got the same goal.. to keep you flying. If you have been prescribed a drug that TC has deemed naughty they'll know it and may be able to find an alternative.

Besides it makes more sense to be mention any problems or concerns early on and be on the ground for a couple weeks or months, then to have a serious problem and get your certificate yanked for good because you didn't speak up sooner.

And if my AME is reading this I need a refill of my Rx because that itching burning sensation is back.

[CallForProposals]

callforproposals

Does TC really think that a pilot taking Effexor (anti-depressant) is going to disclose this information to the AME?

They don't think, they dictate and a pilot is required to disclose this info to the AME.

Jaques,
TC dictates many things. However, if the system isn't realistic in terms of it's expactations on the pilots (even as a minority), then it won't work.

[Blakey]

Let me get this straight; you're saying the system does work now?

[Jaques Strappe]

callforproposals

Does TC really think that a pilot taking Effexor (anti-depressant) is going to disclose this information to the AME?

They don't think, they dictate and a pilot is required to disclose this info to the AME.

Jaques,
TC dictates many things. However, if the system isn't realistic in terms of it's expactations on the pilots (even as a minority), then it won't work.

In that case, use your best judgement. Whatever TC does or doesn't do in your opinion, I think they are relying on some common sense being used. Are you going to get your Omega 3 vitamins cleared? Probably not. Your example of anti-depressants? I hope so and if you didn't, then you get what you deserve. It ain't rocket science.

[A Regulator]

Well this link does not specifically say what you can and can not take but it gives you insite to what the CAME's look for on an exam.

http://www.tc.gc.ca/CivilAviation/Regse ... t42402.htm

[CallForProposals]

callforproposals
They don't think, they dictate and a pilot is required to disclose this info to the AME.

Jaques,
TC dictates many things. However, if the system isn't realistic in terms of it's expactations on the pilots (even as a minority), then it won't work.

In that case, use your best judgement. Whatever TC does or doesn't do in your opinion, I think they are relying on some common sense being used. Are you going to get your Omega 3 vitamins cleared? Probably not. Your example of anti-depressants? I hope so and if you didn't, then you get what you deserve. It ain't rocket science.

I'm not suggesting anyone break the rules. Nor have I ever broken the rules myself. All I am saying is that I imagine there are more than a handful of pilots flying in Canada who lie to their CAME so that they don't lose their medical. I'm just pointing out what I consider to be a problem with the system.

[Jaques Strappe]

Sorry Man

I didn't mean to imply that you personally were taking something you shouldn't.

I guess I am saying that pilots should have good judgement and common sense but you are right, I am probably expecting too much and therefore, there probably are some guys wondering around taking anti psychotic drugs and flying airplanes!