Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

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squawk
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by squawk »

atphat wrote: Mon May 07, 2018 2:51 pm
squawk wrote: Sun May 06, 2018 10:51 am
RidersRule wrote: Sun May 06, 2018 9:22 am Great post.
Don’t think for a second that AC pilots are not loving WJ pilot turmoil. Remember they had a rumour going around that they would join ALPA too? What happened to that game plan? Must have been more of a playbook than a gameplan. They would love nothing more than to see WJ burn to the ground. It’s the old saying “ don’t tell anybody your problems , because half don’t care and the other half are glad you have them.”
Never underestimate the high level of schadenfreude here!

I'm not sure who you speak for but it's definitely not "AC" pilots. I don't think any AC pilot wants to see a WJ colleague suffer. In fact I think every professional pilot in Canada is hoping they get their scope figured out which will in turn help the entire industry.

If you don’t have a dog in this fight than I suggest you keep your comments to yourself. Funny how all the AC pilots pile in when their competitor is in a bad way. Not all of us have the privilege of working for the “people’s airline”.
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RustyDeuce
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by RustyDeuce »

skypirate88 wrote: Mon May 07, 2018 5:23 pm Apparently the 787 will be revealed tomorrow...good timing with the pilot picket tomorrow as well.
Good timing? It's a great way to build resentment against the pilot group sure. That feeling is growing outside of the FA and pilot ranks. Take that to the bank.
Leaders in the company? Not anymore.
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by sepia »

squawk wrote: Mon May 07, 2018 7:43 pm
atphat wrote: Mon May 07, 2018 2:51 pm
squawk wrote: Sun May 06, 2018 10:51 am

Don’t think for a second that AC pilots are not loving WJ pilot turmoil. Remember they had a rumour going around that they would join ALPA too? What happened to that game plan? Must have been more of a playbook than a gameplan. They would love nothing more than to see WJ burn to the ground. It’s the old saying “ don’t tell anybody your problems , because half don’t care and the other half are glad you have them.”
Never underestimate the high level of schadenfreude here!

I'm not sure who you speak for but it's definitely not "AC" pilots. I don't think any AC pilot wants to see a WJ colleague suffer. In fact I think every professional pilot in Canada is hoping they get their scope figured out which will in turn help the entire industry.

If you don’t have a dog in this fight than I suggest you keep your comments to yourself. Funny how all the AC pilots pile in when their competitor is in a bad way. Not all of us have the privilege of working for the “people’s airline”.
How bent are you squawk? The only things AC guys have said here are well wishes for our peers and friends. No one at AC is crossing their fingers behind their backs while saying good luck.

You've misrepresented absolutely everything you've posted about with regards to AC pilots. Just step away from the keyboard.

I truly understand these aren't easy times. I've been exactly where you're at now. I remember having a young family, applying for a max line of credit to prepare for the worst. I made it out okay and you guys will too. Don't let the fear mongering bullshit liquidate the company crap get to you.

No one gets to the airline level without having worked with people who've taken different forks in the road. Wishing harm on WJ would be wishing harm on many of my good friends.

I hope you guys get an industry leading contact. I know a lot of guys at WJ and they've all worked super hard to get there. You deserve a fair contact, don't sell yourself short.
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by squawk »

sepia wrote: Mon May 07, 2018 8:24 pm
squawk wrote: Mon May 07, 2018 7:43 pm
atphat wrote: Mon May 07, 2018 2:51 pm


I'm not sure who you speak for but it's definitely not "AC" pilots. I don't think any AC pilot wants to see a WJ colleague suffer. In fact I think every professional pilot in Canada is hoping they get their scope figured out which will in turn help the entire industry.

If you don’t have a dog in this fight than I suggest you keep your comments to yourself. Funny how all the AC pilots pile in when their competitor is in a bad way. Not all of us have the privilege of working for the “people’s airline”.
How bent are you squawk? The only things AC guys have said here are well wishes for our peers and friends. No one at AC is crossing their fingers behind their backs while saying good luck.

You've misrepresented absolutely everything you've posted about with regards to AC pilots. Just step away from the keyboard.

I truly understand these aren't easy times. I've been exactly where you're at now. I remember having a young family, applying for a max line of credit to prepare for the worst. I made it out okay and you guys will too. Don't let the fear mongering bullshit liquidate the company crap get to you.

No one gets to the airline level without having worked with people who've taken different forks in the road. Wishing harm on WJ would be wishing harm on many of my good friends.

I hope you guys get an industry leading contact. I know a lot of guys at WJ and they've all worked super hard to get there. You deserve a fair contact, don't sell yourself short.
Thanks for your reply. I still hold to my position that the majority of AC pilots would like to see a buffalo jump as far as Westjet pilots are concerned.
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altiplano
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by altiplano »

I think you're wrong. I think the majority of AC pilots aren't following it at all... the ones that are though, want to see you guys do well.

Most of us have many friends, former colleagues, and even family across both companies.. I want nothing more than the best for all of us, a healthy industry, and a strong united profession...

I want you to get a better rate than I have, and then I want to push the bar higher again on our next go... that's it... all I want is to get paid more and it takes both groups pushing to achieve it.

We all need to reach North American industry standard. ie. US major wages.
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Canadianjetpilot
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by Canadianjetpilot »

RustyDeuce wrote: Mon May 07, 2018 8:03 pm
skypirate88 wrote: Mon May 07, 2018 5:23 pm Apparently the 787 will be revealed tomorrow...good timing with the pilot picket tomorrow as well.
Good timing? It's a great way to build resentment against the pilot group sure. That feeling is growing outside of the FA and pilot ranks. Take that to the bank.
Leaders in the company? Not anymore.
Not sure who exactly you are talking to - except maybe Campus staff who are very much victim's of executive propaganda WRT to the happenings outside their walls.

As you may or may not know the WJ maintenance department is currently in a state of being significantly understaffed with a steady stream of AME's leaving for greener pastures. You may want to ask one of them why that is. I can also tell you that the maintenance department is closely following the pilot progress and taking notes on how the pilots have been able to get the executive to the table and start to make real change to their working conditions.

As are the CSA's who at present aren't sure if they will be 'Encored' into lower paying positions when the pink 737's replace the blue and green 737's at the soon to be Swoop bases. The company has already set that precedent, is attempting to do the same with the pilots and it is not unreasonable to expect they will continue to do so.

I'll also add this. The WJ pilot group is guiding their representation not ALPA. ALPA is merely providing support to those efforts. Nor is the pilot group being greedy. Greedy would be insisting on being compensated higher than everyone else. That is not the case. The pilot group simply wants industry standard duty and rest limits, standard trip rigs, and to protect the jobs of those here now and those to follow later so no one else gets 'Encored'. There is a reason EVERY other airline in North America has those standards. Those standards improve many aspects of a pilots career making them healthier, safer and more productive and having less TAFB. You need look no further than the near catastrophic health issues that befell WJ pilots in the last few years as a result of being overworked under the current work conditions ( which happen to be the lowest of all the major Civil Aviation Authorities worldwide). The company's own safety reports showed an over 80% increase in fatigue related occurrence reports between 2014 and 2016. Interesting note: those reports were removed from employee access in 2017.

I believe the AC folk are in our court because they recognize that without unity amongst our professional peers we will continue to see this profession be marginalized.
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by tsgas »

WJA stock just hit a 12 month low today. :smt014
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by Noo »

Ma teefor
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by Fanblade »

squawk wrote: Mon May 07, 2018 8:51 pm

Thanks for your reply. I still hold to my position that the majority of AC pilots would like to see a buffalo jump as far as Westjet pilots are concerned.
Your view point I find odd. AC pilots in no way see themselves as competing with WJ pilots. Nor do we want any harm to come to you. Our companies compete but not the employee groups. The WJ pilots are brothers and sisters. We AC pilots know all too well what you are going through. We also know the tables will one day turn again on us. It’s inevitable.

This is a first contract. The second you set a strike deadline, if it even gets that far, WJ will request binding arbitration and it will be granted. It is highly unlikely an arbitrator will give away work you are contractually entitled to. Never heard of it happening. Likely the arbitrator will smack WJ for thier behaviour. Industry standard is your hourly rate multiplied by the amount of hours they flew at the offending operation.
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Alcoholism
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by Alcoholism »

There's a difference between a WJ pilot and a AC pilot. WJ pilots have a backbone.
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seriousflyer
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by seriousflyer »

Don't let "sqwak" extremely juvenile comments divide you. Air Canada pilots have been through this, and more, over the last 5 decades. They have a backbone.
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by Mach1 »

Was Weedpro2000 out picketing?

Inquiring minds want to know. :)
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by FL410AV8R »

Mach1 wrote: Tue May 08, 2018 3:11 pm Was Weedpro2000 out picketing?

Inquiring minds want to know. :)
No sign of the mighty mouth. All talk and no action. No surprise really.

I was proud to stand there with 150 of my peers and send a strong message.

In unity.
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by PT6onH20 »

Alcoholism wrote: Tue May 08, 2018 2:44 pm There's a difference between a WJ pilot and a AC pilot. WJ pilots have a backbone.
If you say so :roll:
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by Alcoholism »

seriousflyer wrote: Tue May 08, 2018 3:05 pm Don't let "sqwak" extremely juvenile comments divide you. Air Canada pilots have been through this, and more, over the last 5 decades. They have a backbone.
This must be the lost decade then, because actions show otherwise. Care to give away the cargo flying again? Care to lock into another 10yr contract? Care to give away Rouge expansion again? Care to keep status quo? What else am I missing here? And don't give me the big bad gov't and arbitrator forced it on you. The reopeners are all on you.

I say to the WJ pilot group, you're better than AC, and deserve better. Don't be an AC pilot.
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by confusedalot »

Ummm.....as I recall, Rovinescu called up his buddy Harper, who in turn used his tool Lisa Raitt to do the dirty work of legislating the rank and file back to work, and therefore forcing the terms of a work contract.

What does backbone have to do with facing an autocratic state sponsored action. Could take to the streets like they do in other countries I suppose, but that tends not to happen in canada. The various overequipped swat teams would put a crushing end to it anyway.
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by flyer 1492 »

I wonder if CB's head was going to explode?
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by rambus »

disregard...
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by GhostRider6 »

I don’t work for WJ. However, thanks for sticking up for working conditions in this industry.


This being said, after reading some of the commentary on the CBC articles. I think the public level of sympathy is zero to this cause.. here’s a snapshot of the commentary from the joe six pack peanut gallery.

- overpaid, glorified bus drivers.. trying to soak the poor public for more $$ before airplanes are all automated anyways

- pilots do nothing but sit there .. planes fly themselves

- another company ruined (westjet) by pure union greed

- WJ pilots are the worst.. we had to turn around once when trying to land ( assume go- around)

- greedy entitied people

- pilots trying to get more layovers in Jamaica

- fire em all..


It went downhill from there...


I DO NOT agree with any of the aforementioned statements.i found these statements extremely disheartening. Again, I appreciate everything you guys and gals are doing. However, I think the public needs to be educated as a whole on what YOU are fighting for and the working conditions in our industry.

For example, the food industry went all out on the “ buy local, buy small, buy organic” movement. Guess what? Things changed..people ( me included) started supporting local farmers.

Ignorance with respect to what we actually do/ the effort it takes to advance ( at least in the past) is PROLIFIC!!

However, As long as the public thinks we are replaceable “ bus drivers” requiring zero education or skill nothing will change. Moreover, that the magical computer does everything ..( no PDM nada) Change needs to happen at the consumer level as well as at the boardroom level.

In no way am I saying corporate greed does not exist and that changes need to happen higher up the food chain... .. The problem is, everyone thinks this career is glitzy and glamorous... and this feeds into the public’s thirst for cheaper wages at our expense.

I have yet to hear the union release a public statement as to what you folks are fighting for .. as well as what conditions are like.

Good luck !
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Re: Exit Polls Showing Over 90% Strike Mandate Support

Post by tbaylx »

GhostRider6 wrote: Thu May 10, 2018 7:25 pm I don’t work for WJ. However, thanks for sticking up for working conditions in this industry.


This being said, after reading some of the commentary on the CBC articles. I think the public level of sympathy is zero to this cause.. here’s a snapshot of the commentary from the joe six pack peanut gallery.

- overpaid, glorified bus drivers.. trying to soak the poor public for more $$ before airplanes are all automated anyways

- pilots do nothing but sit there .. planes fly themselves

- another company ruined (westjet) by pure union greed

- WJ pilots are the worst.. we had to turn around once when trying to land ( assume go- around)

- greedy entitied people

- pilots trying to get more layovers in Jamaica

- fire em all..


It went downhill from there...


I DO NOT agree with any of the aforementioned statements.i found these statements extremely disheartening. Again, I appreciate everything you guys and gals are doing. However, I think the public needs to be educated as a whole on what YOU are fighting for and the working conditions in our industry.

For example, the food industry went all out on the “ buy local, buy small, buy organic” movement. Guess what? Things changed..people ( me included) started supporting local farmers.

Ignorance with respect to what we actually do/ the effort it takes to advance ( at least in the past) is PROLIFIC!!

However, As long as the public thinks we are replaceable “ bus drivers” requiring zero education or skill nothing will change. Moreover, that the magical computer does everything ..( no PDM nada) Change needs to happen at the consumer level as well as at the boardroom level.

In no way am I saying corporate greed does not exist and that changes need to happen higher up the food chain... .. The problem is, everyone thinks this career is glitzy and glamorous... and this feeds into the public’s thirst for cheaper wages at our expense.

I have yet to hear the union release a public statement as to what you folks are fighting for .. as well as what conditions are like.

Good luck !
If the pilot's actually go on strike and Westjet starts a public fight with the average pilot salary numbers business it's going to get far worse. ALPA had better to get out in front of that one.
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