C525 goes missing over Lake Erie with 6 aboard

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Roar
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Re: C525 goes missing over Lake Erie with 6 aboard

Post by Roar »

complexintentions wrote: Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:47 pm Is a CJ4 really a "high-performance" jet?

Not being facetious, but I thought it was a descendant of the Citation I/II?
The CJ4 has a typical cruise speed of .76 or around 440ktas, typical rotation speed is 105 kias and landing ref of 105-112 kias. Unlike the Citation I/II with its straight wing the CJ4 has a 12.5 degree sweep on the wing.
So I guess it all boils down to what you consider “high performance”. It’s not a Citation X but neither is it the old Citation I.
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jschnurr
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Re: C525 goes missing over Lake Erie with 6 aboard

Post by jschnurr »

From the accident report linked above.

The pilot had 1205 TT, 56 hrs in the C525 out of which 8.7 was PIC. He also had 372.9 hrs in a Cessna 510.

Interestingly, the pilot's experience is listed as a factor, but no further mention. Is it normal these days to be in such an airplane (SPIFR no less!) with barely over 1000TT?
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Re: C525 goes missing over Lake Erie with 6 aboard

Post by Old fella »

jschnurr wrote: Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:02 pm From the accident report linked above.

The pilot had 1205 TT, 56 hrs in the C525 out of which 8.7 was PIC. He also had 372.9 hrs in a Cessna 510.

Interestingly, the pilot's experience is listed as a factor, but no further mention. Is it normal these days to be in such an airplane (SPIFR no less!) with barely over 1000TT?
It is the classical example of why private pilots with very minimal time and experience should never be allowed to be in that type of Aircraft(CJ4), max cruise 450kts, 17,000 lbs max weight and it can get up to FL400+ and those PP types think they can handle all of this by themselves. A good many of them end up as smoking holes in the ground or in this case fish bait. Sadly they take others with them.
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Re: C525 goes missing over Lake Erie with 6 aboard

Post by Old fella »

Double post - deleted.
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Last edited by Old fella on Sat Oct 13, 2018 10:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
Eric Janson
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Re: C525 goes missing over Lake Erie with 6 aboard

Post by Eric Janson »

jschnurr wrote: Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:02 pm From the accident report linked above.

The pilot had 1205 TT, 56 hrs in the C525 out of which 8.7 was PIC. He also had 372.9 hrs in a Cessna 510.

Interestingly, the pilot's experience is listed as a factor, but no further mention. Is it normal these days to be in such an airplane (SPIFR no less!) with barely over 1000TT?
I guess if someone has the money they can buy themselves something like this. The limiting factor would probably be the availability of Insurance.

You can't buy experience. That's unfortunately not always understood.
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Re: C525 goes missing over Lake Erie with 6 aboard

Post by pelmet »

In reality, people are getting into spiral dives and crashing under the same circumstances in single engine lightweight general aviation aircraft. Whether it is an empty 727 at -30 degrees turning out at 400 feet and climbing like a rocket or a Cessna 172 heavily loaded off of runway 15 at YTZ at night in the turn over Lake Ontario, it will be pitch black as if someone painted over the windows with black paint and you neeed to Scan, Scan, Scan. Not play with radios, or other distractions or even just concentrate on a part of one instrument at the expense of the other appropriate instruments.

The guy in this accident had 400 hours of jet time.
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