Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

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Chris M
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by Chris M »

CBAME wrote: Sat Mar 17, 2018 7:03 amOn my daily commute i often see fuselages, wings and tails wrapped up in blue plastic heading down the highway between YXU and YYZ, How much building is actually done at Downsview? or is it more of an assembly plant. Downsview is a unique place and has some history but its location is not the best.
The Q400 wing and cockpit, as well as the wing for the Lear 70/75 are built from scratch in Downsview. Otherwise all major components are trucked in for final assembly.

The Q400 fuselage comes from China.

For the Global the wings and fuselage are build by Mitsubishi near Pearson, the cockpit comes from Montreal, the tail comes from Mexico and the h-stab comes from Ireland.
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seasonaldriver
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by seasonaldriver »

So, just to throw this in as a wild card suggestion that won't happen because it is west of Toronto, but how about YGM, Gimli in Manitoba? Big concrete runway, lots of space, cheap housing nearby, ramp big enough any plane they make...
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bobcaygeon
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by bobcaygeon »

seasonaldriver wrote: Sun Mar 18, 2018 9:54 am So, just to throw this in as a wild card suggestion that won't happen because it is west of Toronto, but how about YGM, Gimli in Manitoba? Big concrete runway, lots of space, cheap housing nearby, ramp big enough any plane they make...
Minimal numbers of existing skilled employees in the area (and little potential for new ones if you've ever visited the interlake.)
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seasonaldriver
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by seasonaldriver »

Maybe not in Gimli and the interlake but Winnipeg is not far away and I think has a significant number of people in the aerospace industry. Also maybe some present employees could be persuaded to move west.
But like someone said in an earlier post, any move will be east. Manitoba, on the fringe of the frontier, hardly seems to exist.
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sanjet
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by sanjet »

As predicted, Bombardier just sold the Q400 program.



Bombardier Sells Aging Q400 Turboprop Line, Cutting 5,000 Jobs As It Sharpens Focus On Business Jets
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeremyboga ... 97539d1736
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goingnowherefast
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by goingnowherefast »

Does that include parts and maintenance support for the whole Dash 8 series?
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CLguy
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by CLguy »

MONTREAL — Bombardier Inc. announced Thursday it will cut about 5,000 jobs across the organization over the next 12 to 18 months as part of a new restructuring plan.

The cuts are expected to lead to about US$250 million in annualized savings by 2021.

The company also announced the sale of what it called a number of non-core assets.

Bombardier has struck a deal to sell its Q Series aircraft program and de Havilland trademark to a subsidiary of Longview Aviation Capital Corp. for about US$300 million.

It also announced the sale of its aircraft's flight and technical training business to CAE, and the monetization of royalties for about US$800 million.

"With our heavy investment cycle now completed, we continue to make solid progress executing our turnaround plan," Bombardier chief executive Alain Bellemare said in a statement.

"With today's announcements we have set in motion the next round of actions necessary to unleash the full potential of the Bombardier portfolio."

The changes came as Bombardier reported a profit of US$149 million or four cents per share in its latest quarter, compared with a loss of US$100 million or four cents per share in the same quarter last year.

Revenue in what was the company's third quarter totalled $3.64 billion, down from $3.84 billion a year ago.

On an adjusted basis, Bombardier said it earned four cents per share in the quarter compared with a break-even result in the third quarter of 2017.

Longview Aviation, the parent company to Viking Air Ltd., said once it completes its deal with Bombardier it will become North America's largest commercial turbo-prop aircraft manufacturer.

The agreement includes the entire Dash 8 program, including the 100, 200 and 300 series and the in-production Q400 program.

"The Dash 8 turbo-prop is the perfect complement to our existing portfolio of specialized aircraft including the Twin Otter and the Canadair CL 215 and 415 series of water bombers," Longview Aviation chief executive David Curtis said in a statement.
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Chris M
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by Chris M »

goingnowherefast wrote: Thu Nov 08, 2018 6:44 am Does that include parts and maintenance support for the whole Dash 8 series?
Everything. Spares, support, customer service... The works. For all Dash-8 variants.

Apparently Viking also bought the Dehavilland name.
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by rookiepilot »

https://business.financialpost.com/tran ... 1541696983

Down 27% at the lows today.

And I thought this was a world leading stock headed over 10 bucks imminently, in a ripping economy, I might add. So I was told, here.

Next Government support package in 5..4..3..2..1.

I'll take a pass, thanks. Again. My opinion on BBD hasn't changed.

Brutal company. Brutal management.
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flyingcanuck
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by flyingcanuck »

I’m pretty ignorant in this topic so if someone can explain. I read they have 1500 RJs in service + all the Qs.. how is a company like this doing badly?
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Cavalier44
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by Cavalier44 »

It’s sad to see Bombardier get broken up into smaller and smaller pieces as its major manufacturing programs are being sold off. At least the bright side to this is that some of these jobs will stay in Canada rather than having the Q400 program be sold to some other nation such as China, as was the rumour after the CSeries program was sold.

It will be interesting to see how Viking handles continued production of the Q400, if indeed they are able to. It’s certainly a long way from maufacturing a few dozen Twin Otter 400 Series per year. It would be interesting to see them restart manufacturing of the Q300 while carrying over some improvements from the Q400 program. ATR has been hugely successful in the 50-seat turboprop market simply due to the fact that there is no competitor to the ATR-42 currently being built. Certainly there are markets in Canada which are viable for this level of service while still being too small for a Q400, as the launch of WestJet Link and Jazz’s retention of the -300s proves.

Unfortunately Bombardier went all-in financially on the CSeries program and didn’t have the resources to continue innovating in the turboprop or small RJ market. Hopefully Viking will be a worthy successor to Bombardier/de Havilland Canada in that regard.
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by rookiepilot »

How people can think the same management that has destroyed the reputation of the train division, can somehow effectively produce a quality aviation product (Much more complex) AND make money while doing so, is beyond me.

I don't know Viking well, but suspect it's better run. No bailouts (to my knowledge anyway) and still in business.
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Last edited by rookiepilot on Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
CWhyYZ
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by CWhyYZ »

flyingcanuck wrote: Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:32 am I’m pretty ignorant in this topic so if someone can explain. I read they have 1500 RJs in service + all the Qs.. how is a company like this doing badly?
In a nutshell, a poorly mismanaged company that also spent every cent they had available on entering the narrow body jet world. Hampered by cost over runs and delays followed with poor sales. They leveraged the farm on the C Series. Now its a fire sale to just stay in business. They found themselves close to being kicked off the TSX when they became a penny stock a couple years ago.
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by rookiepilot »

https://business.financialpost.com/tran ... 00-layoffs

BBD announces layoffs at special meeting. CEO doesn't even show up, "schedule is very busy"
Executive bonuses? Fully Intact.

I remember here reading the defense of this "world class" company and their first rate management team, when I critiqued them.

LOL -- is all I can say. What an embarrassment. What a gutless CEO.
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lownslow
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by lownslow »

I thought the aviation side seemed to be the competently run part of the operation. What gives? Harder to get bailed out when you don't make garbage?
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by rookiepilot »

$2.25 today. Down another 10%.

BK....or yet another Bailout? Place your bets.

Maybe the Quebec taxpayers will actually revolt this time if asked to give that CEO another 10 million.

https://www.thestar.com/opinion/star-co ... rdier.html

3 billion so far to this "world class" company.
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by Diadem »

Rather than just focus on the negatives of Bombardier, on the flip side, what are the implications for Longview/Viking? Are they likely to continue building Q400s, or will they only provide support and let the fleets dwindle away? Is there a chance they'll start making modernized versions of the Classics? Would they move production to VIctoria or Calgary if they decide to build more?
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by rookiepilot »

I'd like the Bombardier defenders to show up, please.
I posted as such to Bill Morneau:

Sir, Canadians want to know why this government continues to pour money into Bombardier's executive bonuses and 14 million dollar CEO, while laying off thousands of workers -- while maintaining hard working small business folks are "tax cheats".
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Rowdy
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by Rowdy »

So what does Bombardier actually do?

The CRJ was canadair, the Q400 was dehavilland before them.. The C series is now Airbus...

Blows me away that our government just keeps handing their execs cash.
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goingnowherefast
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Re: Bombardier considers move away from Downsview

Post by goingnowherefast »

Take the money back from Bombardier, and give it to Viking. Restart the Q200/300/400 production. Build the Buffalo for civilian and military
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