Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

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The Tenth Man
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by The Tenth Man »

Seniority bidding is easy to accomplish, and you likely understand it: the company offers individual pairings, trips, or bid lines (full monthly schedules), and pilots bid on these in order of seniority, subject to the usual restrictions, vacation, training etc.

Socialized bidding is an attempt to satisfy as many people possible by trying to honour as many of the bid parameters of each pilot as possible. Algorithmically, one could achieve such a result in any number of ways. There is a level of complexity in scheduling aircrew that means it is by no means a simple matter. WestJet has not offered a detailed explanantion of how the third party's software works, therefore we have no idea of how successful the final product each month is. Unfortunately, there are not many airlines using our bidding system, so the number of companies offering bidding software to accommodate us is very limited.

That said, at WJ, we can bid for or avoid various pairing attributes (days worked, days off, length, layovers, destinations, check in/out times, redeyes etc) and the software will do its best. Each month, a numerical satisfaction index is attached to the awarded schedule which reflects a numerical score per incidence of bid attribute sought multiplied by the bid priority attached. Supposedly, every three months, the pilot's satisfaction index should be lower than average.

What this means in practice is that there is less predictability than in seniority scheduling, which varies according to the complexity of the bid. Commuters typically bid check in/out times and multi-day pairings and are more or less accommodated. Others bid days off only and are generally accommodated. Some bid single day pairings and depending on the base, are generally accommodated. If you start filling in all of the bid attributes (16 or so?), then you might end up with a result that the algorithm determined was "optimized" but leaves you crying for days.
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altiplano
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by altiplano »

Can you bid:
"Avoid flying with _____"?
That's a really useful bid right there.
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C-GGGQ
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by C-GGGQ »

Got ya, clear as mud :lol: but yeah I've seen that kind of system used before.
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Schooner69A
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by Schooner69A »

Can you bid:
"Avoid flying with _____"?

Only if you'll stop hiding behind your pseudonym... :smt040
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Lightchop
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by Lightchop »

The Tenth Man wrote: Mon Dec 31, 2018 2:53 pm
Lightchop wrote: Mon Dec 31, 2018 2:02 pm
The Tenth Man wrote: Mon Dec 31, 2018 12:45 pm

Speaking of manning up, I note you are posting under a pseudonym.

John Swallow
250 208 7462
Says the guy who has 9 different users on here. Why not just make an account called John Swallow and be done with it.

The fact you write people up for discussion of union related things, which effects your job proves you are rediculous and only likes drama.

How many times have you talked about your wing suit flying in the flight deck? Many, I'm sure. Which is not work related. Maybe those FOs should start writing you up.
I happen to enjoy the fact that having multiple usernames on here seems to trigger people like yourself, so that's what has encouraged me to keep doing it. I figure I'm at the end of the line in that pursuit, so you are likely going to have to get used to this username.

For now.
Or maybe it's time to just leave this forum once and for all since the moderators don't seem to give a shit. Do what you're doing on literally any other forum gets you IP banned. This site is falling apart and has been for the last few years.
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Old fella
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by Old fella »

altiplano wrote: Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:33 am Can you bid:
"Avoid flying with _____"?
That's a really useful bid right there.
Pardon my airline flying ignorance but wasn’t CRM training the intent to alleviate the “ avoid flying with... “ scenario because of past cockpit conflicts. I thought that kind of stuff was past history, how can well trained professionals not get along to the point “ I don’t want to work with him/her”.
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Schooner69A
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by Schooner69A »

"This site has been falling apart...for years..."


I'll call a BS on that one. Just because you disagree with something here doesn't mean that everyone else is out of step.

Remember, some people improve a group by their presence; some by their absence.


It's up to you to suss out your contribution...
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North Shore
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by North Shore »

Lightchop wrote: Mon Dec 31, 2018 3:02 pm Or maybe it's time to just leave this forum once and for all since the moderators don't seem to give a shit. Do what you're doing on literally any other forum gets you IP banned. This site is falling apart and has been for the last few years.
Whoa, nelly! Steady up there, Lightchop. Google ‘The Tenth Man,’ and you’ll see why he carries on as he does. As he hasn’t broken any forum rules yet, it’s difficult to justify banning him.
No-one if forcing you to read his posts, especially when you do have the option of adding him to your ‘foe’ list, and not seeing them.
We, on the other hand have to tediously wade through Every. Single. One. So my G.A.S factor is probably a lot higher than yours :wink:
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Schooner69A
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by Schooner69A »

"No-one if forcing you to read his posts..."

Exactly! I peruse this board everyday; there are lots of posts I don't follow because the subject is not of any interest to me. But, that is no reason to ban those threads.
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Alcoholism
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by Alcoholism »

Confirmed, North Shore is another John personality. Funny how my negative posts don't get deleted, but a light humoured one does, eh mods. Guess what my posting habits will be from now on. RIP avcanada.
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Hangry
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by Hangry »

.
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Alcoholism
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by Alcoholism »

How's that Mods?
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C.W.E.
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by C.W.E. »

No moderators seem to work on other forums.
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Schooner69A
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by Schooner69A »

Effin' amazing how everybody complains about a thread, but they keep coming back to it. Like magpies to a shiny object.
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neophyte
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by neophyte »

“So why should I apply to WJ? All I see is some weirdo on the top of the seniority list getting angry at the rest of his coworkers for wanting to improve their working conditions.“

Why should WE be trying to convince YOU to join WJA? If you are interested in joining team teal - APPLY. If you think you’d be better off somewhere else - GOOD LUCK. It is a pilots market for the time being.

Your posts seem to have a certain aire about them. You will learn soon enough that this industry (and life in general) owes you nothing.

As KAG stated, AC seems to be the place to go these days. For how much longer, no one knows (I sure wouldn’t want to be in their bottom 10% when the music stops - and it will stop one day). If memory serves me, Transat had layoffs less than 3 years ago and Sunwing only recently stopped it’s foreign pilot program. No company is perfect.

Do us all a favour and check the attitude.

BE HUMBLE
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goingnowherefast
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by goingnowherefast »

neophyte, you missed the point of the whole thread
goingnowherefast wrote: Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:06 am If the new contract is as bad as I've been hearing, sounds like WestJet is the new feeder for Transat, Sunwing and AC. Swoop can be a feeder for Flair.

I just assumed WJ management would see the pilot shortage, new duty regs coming and do what they can to make WJ an appealing company to fly for. Everybody else is struggling to recruit, now WJ is widely known for successfully screwing over their pilots. Not a good reputation to have right now.
neophyte wrote: Tue Jan 01, 2019 9:54 pmWhy should WE be trying to convince YOU to join WJA? If you are interested in joining team teal - APPLY. If you think you’d be better off somewhere else - GOOD LUCK. It is a pilots market for the time being
I'm not interested in joining team teal, and can't figure out why anybody would either, given the past year. That's not your problem though, it's a problem for WJ management. I'm just trying to figure out why WJ management doesn't want an industry competitive pilot contract when every other airline is hurting for pilots.
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Schooner69A
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by Schooner69A »

"I'm just trying to figure out why WJ management doesn't want an industry competitive pilot contract when every other airline is hurting for pilots."


Given what's happened in the past year, I think that what WJ management WANTS is to do is pull a Ronald Reagan. :smt040

PS When I hear the term "industry competitive contract", all I see is :dollar:
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by neophyte »

WJA doesn’t have a pilot retention/hiring problem yet. Time will tell if that that changes in the coming months. Any pilot hiring problem will manifest itself at WJE and WJ Link well before WJA.

WJ is well known for keeping costs as low as possible on all levels. This latest contract, like all previous agreements, is about COST for the company. I understand what you are saying about retention/ attracting new pilots. It is a concern for me as well. However, should crew shortages result, and flights get cancelled, those “costs” will be analyzed and dealt with (perhaps they open the contract early if it gets too bad).

When it becomes available, I encourage anyone to compare the new contract to the old agreement. From what I have seen, the gains have exceeded any losses. Does that mean it’s a good contract? Not necessarily.

The WJ MEC made no promises regarding the 1st contract. That said, I have flown with many P2P members or members of the various “pilot chat groups” that convinced themselves that we deserved Delta WAWACON after the dust settled. I believe Dec 21 was especially hard on that group of pilots. I was hoping for more than was awarded but that is the game. Please remember the MEC, and by extension the pilot group agreed to go to arbitration.

I fly for WJA so perhaps I see things with a teal hue. Can you explain how Sunwing or Transat is a better career move (as opposed to same but different). I have flown with multiple pilots from both, why did they make the leap to WJA if things were so good at their previous airline?

Interesting times for sure.

Neo
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sstaurus
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by sstaurus »

neophyte wrote: Wed Jan 02, 2019 9:00 am Any pilot hiring problem will manifest itself at WJE and WJ Link well before WJA.

That's already here... Guys are dropping like flies and there's hardly any one to replace them with. WJ is in the precarious position of having to hire more and more OTS, at the expense of guys at Encore by turning off the light at the end of the tunnel, causing more and more to leave. There is an experience drain going on.
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Re: Why does anyone want to work at WestJet?

Post by FL320 »

neophyte wrote: Wed Jan 02, 2019 9:00 am
I fly for WJA so perhaps I see things with a teal hue. Can you explain how Sunwing or Transat is a better career move (as opposed to same but different). I have flown with multiple pilots from both, why did they make the leap to WJA if things were so good at their previous airline?
Because at one point we all think the grass is greener on the other side. I was really surprised to see some WJA pilots at Air Transat’s offices for interviews few weeks ago. Air Transat is a very nice place to work in my opinion. Pilots hired in 2014 are now upgrading on the widebody; and the company has been hiring non stop since (and about +100 to come).
Out of curiosity how long does it take from DOH to left seat B767/787 at WJ?
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