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Amik Caravan
Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, lilfssister, North Shore
Amik Caravan
Amik Caravan near Little Grand this afternoon. Details still sketchy but CBC reported 9 including pilot survived the ice landing... (with or without power?)
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Re: Amik Caravan
Ouch. Looks like my pics of the islander crash up north back in 08. Nose gear dug in on landing and buckled. Glad everyone's ok.
Re: Amik Caravan
It looks to me like the pilot did a good job of getting it on the surface, when the visual cues would have been pretty poor in such an open area with no texture on the unbroken snow - that'd be a glassy water landing. If power off, extra challenging! In the first photo, the prop does look like it might be feathered. I'd say good job of a forced landing, in circumstances probably more difficult than initially apparent.
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Re: Amik Caravan
Oh yes, great job. VFR with little or no visual clues. All the way to a loss of situational awareness, onto a frozen lake. That prop doesn’t look feathered. Another pilot unaware of the one hundred and eighty degree turn.
Cheers
Illya
Cheers
Illya
Wish I didn't know now, what I didn't know then.
- Redneck_pilot86
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Re: Amik Caravan
Does seem odd to have flaps up for a forced approach.
The only three things a wingman should ever say: 1. "Two's up" 2. "You're on fire" 3. "I'll take the fat one"
Re: Amik Caravan
It is interesting that these accidents are fairly common.
Re: Amik Caravan
I don't know how close to the edge of the lake that van touched down, but it should go farther in the glide with the flaps up. You know, if it was a forced approach and not forced into gentle CFIT by a low ceiling/poor vis/desire to stay 'VFR.'Redneck_pilot86 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:22 pm Does seem odd to have flaps up for a forced approach.
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Re: Amik Caravan
OH, I think that if a Caravan had had an engine failure in Manitoba on a flight planned route, we'd all know about it? There'd have been a MAYDAY call. There'd have been a cadors published. Nobody would be hiding it. They'd be screaming it from the roof tops. Nope. This Caravan pushed VMC, lost visual and ended up lucky to be alive.
There's a lesson here that everybody ignores time and time again. Don't push the weather. TURN AROUND
There's a lesson here that everybody ignores time and time again. Don't push the weather. TURN AROUND
Wish I didn't know now, what I didn't know then.
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Re: Amik Caravan
You've never flown a Caravan, have you.lownslow wrote: ↑Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:39 pmI don't know how close to the edge of the lake that van touched down, but it should go farther in the glide with the flaps up. You know, if it was a forced approach and not forced into gentle CFIT by a low ceiling/poor vis/desire to stay 'VFR.'Redneck_pilot86 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:22 pm Does seem odd to have flaps up for a forced approach.
Wish I didn't know now, what I didn't know then.
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Re: Amik Caravan
Flaps in the caravan are electric. They could have easily been raised afterwards to get them out of the way while unloading etcRedneck_pilot86 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:22 pm Does seem odd to have flaps up for a forced approach.
Re: Amik Caravan
"C-FAFV, a Cessna 208B aircraft operated by Amik Aviation, was conducting a VFR flight from
Winnipeg/St. Andrews (CYAV), MB to Little Grand Rapids (CZGR), MB with 1 pilot and 6
passengers on board. During the final approach for Runway 36 at CZGR, the aircraft collided with
the frozen surface of Family Lake, approximately 0.75 nautical mile south of the threshold of
Runway 36. The pilot and passengers egressed the aircraft, and were transported to the Little
Grand Rapids nursing station for evaluation. The pilot suffered minor injuries. The aircraft
sustained substantial damage."
Winnipeg/St. Andrews (CYAV), MB to Little Grand Rapids (CZGR), MB with 1 pilot and 6
passengers on board. During the final approach for Runway 36 at CZGR, the aircraft collided with
the frozen surface of Family Lake, approximately 0.75 nautical mile south of the threshold of
Runway 36. The pilot and passengers egressed the aircraft, and were transported to the Little
Grand Rapids nursing station for evaluation. The pilot suffered minor injuries. The aircraft
sustained substantial damage."
Re: Amik Caravan
For sure they were more fortunate than that Air Tindi crew a few months ago.
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Re: Amik Caravan
Only way to do this is to lose sight of the runway and continue the descent.pelmet wrote: ↑Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:19 pm "C-FAFV, a Cessna 208B aircraft operated by Amik Aviation, was conducting a VFR flight from
Winnipeg/St. Andrews (CYAV), MB to Little Grand Rapids (CZGR), MB with 1 pilot and 6
passengers on board. During the final approach for Runway 36 at CZGR, the aircraft collided with
the frozen surface of Family Lake, approximately 0.75 nautical mile south of the threshold of
Runway 36. The pilot and passengers egressed the aircraft, and were transported to the Little
Grand Rapids nursing station for evaluation. The pilot suffered minor injuries. The aircraft
sustained substantial damage."
Thanks for that.
They're lucky folks.
Wish I didn't know now, what I didn't know then.
- Redneck_pilot86
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Re: Amik Caravan
Sure, flaps should stay up until the desired landing area is attained, but then be lowered to reduce the ground speed as much as possible. *if* this was a forced approach. The only plausible reason I could see for leaving the flaps retracted is if you are covered in ice - which doesn't appear to be the case but it could have melted. Alternatively, maybe the pilot simply forgot the flaps and stalled? The caravan will drop out of the sky around 80 knots, well above the 63 kt stall speed.lownslow wrote: ↑Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:39 pmI don't know how close to the edge of the lake that van touched down, but it should go farther in the glide with the flaps up. You know, if it was a forced approach and not forced into gentle CFIT by a low ceiling/poor vis/desire to stay 'VFR.'Redneck_pilot86 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:22 pm Does seem odd to have flaps up for a forced approach.
The flaps are not in the way of anything while unloading, even in the attitude this one is in.The Hammer wrote: ↑Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:08 pmFlaps in the caravan are electric. They could have easily been raised afterwards to get them out of the way while unloading etcRedneck_pilot86 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:22 pm Does seem odd to have flaps up for a forced approach.
The only three things a wingman should ever say: 1. "Two's up" 2. "You're on fire" 3. "I'll take the fat one"
Re: Amik Caravan
No Van time here but I stayed at a Holiday Inn, does that count for something? The point is moot now anyways because we know it wasn't a forced approach, but I know flaps generally shorten glide distance and I'm not convinced Cessna could get an exemption on the laws of physics.
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Re: Amik Caravan
The C208 AFM recommends but does not demand the use of full flap on a forced landing. In my mind that makes it pilot's discretion based on circumstances.
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Re: Amik Caravan
And the Sowind Bandit crew/ pax over 20 years ago at the same airport.