Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

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Don'tSink
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Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by Don'tSink » Thu Apr 04, 2019 12:07 pm

Hello everyone,

I've been offered a job as a F.O on various aircraft with various operators, and wanted your opinions.

1. King air F.O
2. Metroliner F.O
3. Navajo F.O

The first two jobs are both up north. The third job is based near the GTA. Personally, I'm considering the Navajo job. The plane typically flies 30-35 hours a week and it varies from local and cross border flights. One thing that really stood out to me was that rather than receiving a PCC, the chief pilot mentioned that the F.O would have a PPC and under a controlled environment with decent weather, I'd be allowed to act as PIC and build my PIC time.

I wanted to know if there would be any drawbacks of not taking the turboprop jobs (i.e airlines want turbine time?). My eventual goal is to use this as a stepping stone to get to the regional's and then to the big carriers.


Don'tsink
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lownslow
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by lownslow » Thu Apr 04, 2019 12:57 pm

Right now if you're thinking of the next job it's probably all about the same. Hell, a year ago I even saw an executive of a national airline tell a couple CPL students "Just rent a 152 until you hit 500 hours and give us a call."

Instead of 'best for career progression' I think you're better off now to think of 'best to prevent future hassle.' Priority one is to not take a job that has a high risk of killing you. Flying lots sounds good too but if your plan is to hit it and quit it, who cares if you fly there for six months or nine before you leave, right? Beyond that, you'll need a given amount of PIC time to get your ATPL sometime down the road so having someone pay you while you rack that up while actually being the PIC is better than having to deal with some PICUS program later. Same idea with night time. Really, look up what you'll need to get your AAs, compare to what you have, then find a way to have the dots connect themselves.
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Roadrunnersmother
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by Roadrunnersmother » Thu Apr 04, 2019 1:07 pm

Navajo position no question.
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Heliian
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by Heliian » Thu Apr 04, 2019 1:49 pm

Whichever has the best pay, get hours.

The ho guy might be blowing smoke too though.

Personally, I think the Navaho is a dirty piece of garbage.

Good luck.
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digits_
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by digits_ » Thu Apr 04, 2019 2:02 pm

King Air would be the nicest plane.
Metro would most likely be a 704 operation, so that might look better on your resume.
If the navajo actually will give you multi PIC, then that's probably the best choice.
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proflight
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by proflight » Thu Apr 04, 2019 2:07 pm

Is there any metro flying up north like NWT? Northern Ontario and other provinces are not that bad. You should be able to “survive” with the wage they pay up north compared to the Navajo FO job in GTA, which I don’t think I can afford living unless I have parents that I can live with. I would say pick whatever job that gives you the most hours, so you can move on to 705 as quick as possible if that is what you want at the end.
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valleyboy
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by valleyboy » Thu Apr 04, 2019 2:38 pm

My only advice is beware. If something sounds too good to be true it usually is. Carrots usually end up being just something used to insert where it hurts the most. If what he is saying is remotely true they should be hiring you as a captain and using co-captains on the flight line.
If 2 of these opportunities is the same company that operates both metros and navajos. I need say no more.
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valleyboy
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by valleyboy » Thu Apr 04, 2019 2:38 pm

My only advice is beware. If something sounds too good to be true it usually is. Carrots usually end up being just something used to insert where it hurts the most. If what he is saying is remotely true they should be hiring you as a captain and using co-captains on the flight line.
If 2 of these opportunities is the same company that operates both metros and navajos. I need say no more.
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goingnowherefast
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by goingnowherefast » Thu Apr 04, 2019 6:47 pm

Largely depends on the operator too. I'd rather fly a great Navajo with top notch maintenance than an old clapped out A90 that sees a wrench every 50 hours, and the "703 MEL" sticky note in the journey log. Unfortunately Navajo usually means cheap-ass operator and crap maintenance, although there are exceptions.
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Don'tSink
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by Don'tSink » Thu Apr 04, 2019 7:13 pm

Thanks for the advice everyone! I'll be calling in tomorrow for the navajo job.
I'm in no rush to get to the airlines but would eventually like to get there. Taking into account what everyone brought up - The navajo was actually in very good shape, compared to the ones I've seen on my trip up North handing out resumes. Aside from that the owners actually fly the plane with their family in the back. I'd rather take my chances here and hopefully not have to worry about ending up 6 feet under.

If this was the company that operates both metros and Navajo I wouldn't consider it.

Thanks,

Don'tSink
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goingnowherefast
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by goingnowherefast » Thu Apr 04, 2019 7:28 pm

What's the name of the Navajo company? PM if you'd prefer.
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MrWings
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by MrWings » Thu Apr 04, 2019 7:53 pm

goingnowherefast wrote:
Thu Apr 04, 2019 7:28 pm
What's the name of the Navajo company? PM if you'd prefer.
LOL! Nice try!

He might give you the names of the other two. :lol:
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goingnowherefast
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by goingnowherefast » Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:59 am

Haha, I don't want to fly a Navajo, been there done that. I'm just offering the reputation of the operator that someone new to the industry might not be aware of.
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lownslow
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by lownslow » Fri Apr 05, 2019 10:15 am

Don'tSink wrote:
Thu Apr 04, 2019 7:13 pm
The navajo was actually in very good shape, compared to the ones I've seen on my trip up North
I'm not suggesting that's the case here, but given two airplanes of roughly the same age it's the pretty one that you often have to be wary of.
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altiplano
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by altiplano » Fri Apr 05, 2019 5:27 pm

Used to be a no brainer to take the turbine job when you can... advance quickly if you can. Good luck!
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shimmydampner
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by shimmydampner » Sat Apr 06, 2019 12:13 am

I always thought it was a no brainer to go for the PIC time. But then l never did understand what was so mystical about turbines.
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citabriaguy
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by citabriaguy » Sat Apr 06, 2019 5:54 am

Be cautious about that PIC carrot if you’re a low hour guy. If we’re talking a place like flyGTA then you’re moving PAX and it’s busy airspace. Not saying it can’t happen, but I’d double check with someone who’s moved on from there.

Not great sitting right seat in a plane that doesn’t need two pilots. I’d much rather be a turbine FO if I wouldn’t be getting PIC either way, but I like the the Ho from the left just fine.

The GTA gig could be a sweeter deal not being away from home, but end of the day it’s whatever your priorities are.
Any bonds? Pay difference and how about time off? Where do you get more hours?
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MrAviator19
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by MrAviator19 » Sun Apr 07, 2019 10:35 am

Don'tSink wrote:
Thu Apr 04, 2019 12:07 pm
Hello everyone,

I've been offered a job as a F.O on various aircraft with various operators, and wanted your opinions.

1. King air F.O
2. Metroliner F.O
3. Navajo F.O

The first two jobs are both up north. The third job is based near the GTA. Personally, I'm considering the Navajo job. The plane typically flies 30-35 hours a week and it varies from local and cross border flights. One thing that really stood out to me was that rather than receiving a PCC, the chief pilot mentioned that the F.O would have a PPC and under a controlled environment with decent weather, I'd be allowed to act as PIC and build my PIC time.

I wanted to know if there would be any drawbacks of not taking the turboprop jobs (i.e airlines want turbine time?). My eventual goal is to use this as a stepping stone to get to the regional's and then to the big carriers.


Don'tsink
A seasoned pilot once told me, "The best way to build jet experience is on the Lear, and the best way to build turboprop experience is on the metro!". Personally, I would take the King Air job based solely on type. But Navajo would be the best job in terms of location and lifestyle. But do keep in mind that it isn't a turboprop after all. Many companies these days would rather hire someone with experience on a high-performance airplane even if it's a single-engine like the PC-12 (WJ Encore openly advertises this in their qualifications requirement).

The "controlled PIC" time they're offering you, would that be considered PICUS to a maximum of 100 hours?

MrA
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shimmydampner
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by shimmydampner » Sun Apr 07, 2019 3:23 pm

PICUS isn't a thing for 703 airplanes. I mean, when you think about it, it's not really a real thing at all, but I digress.
What was this seasoned pilot's rationale for his opinion of Lear and Metro experience?
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752lover
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by 752lover » Tue Apr 09, 2019 8:19 pm

Roadrunnersmother wrote:
Thu Apr 04, 2019 1:07 pm
Navajo position no question.
Hi Roadrunnersmother, can you please drop me a private message please? Thanks
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C.W.E.
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by C.W.E. » Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:35 pm

Are turbine engines more difficult to operate than piston engines?
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goldeneagle
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by goldeneagle » Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:40 pm

C.W.E. wrote:
Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:35 pm
Are turbine engines more difficult to operate than piston engines?
Not really, but they are way more expensive when you break them.
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C.W.E.
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Re: Job - Navajo vs Metroliner/KIng Air

Post by C.W.E. » Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:52 pm

Not really, but they are way more expensive when you break them.
Excellent answer. :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Hows things with you these days goldeneagle?
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