Operating different machines.
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Operating different machines.
What requires the most concentration and accuracy to operate different machines.
If one compares the concentration to keep a transport truck or a bus in the driving lane in close proximity with other vehicles compared to the concentration and accuracy needed to fly an airplane with the spatial separation aircraft have which is more difficult?
And of course there is the autopilot in airplanes that are not available in trucks and busses.
If one compares the concentration to keep a transport truck or a bus in the driving lane in close proximity with other vehicles compared to the concentration and accuracy needed to fly an airplane with the spatial separation aircraft have which is more difficult?
And of course there is the autopilot in airplanes that are not available in trucks and busses.
Re: Operating different machines.
Which airplane? Operated in what environment? Trying to accomplish what with the airplane?
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Re: Operating different machines.
Ever sat back and watched a really experienced excavator, or grader operator do their jobs? It's poetry.
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Re: Operating different machines.
Why should we care what the cognitive demands are (or aren't) of driving a truck or bus? We're pilots. If we want to drive a big vehicle, then quit flying and go and do so; conversely, quit driving a bus, and take some flying lessons.
Say, what's that mountain goat doing up here in the mist?
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Ass, Licence, Job. In that order.
Happiness is V1 at Thompson!
Ass, Licence, Job. In that order.
Re: Operating different machines.
Well, i race formula cars. It is all planning. There are always surprises, but it is remarkably similar, but a lot more intense than driving on the road or flying. Different, but you need your reflexes more often than a big vehicle or airplane. Driving a full on race car is not hard, but driving it fast is a whole other thing. You can not just fly around the track. There is a race plan, a test session plan and that is broken down to segments for every corner. There is not really a comparison in that sense. It is harder physically than flying for sure. You need your wits about you in the same way, if that makes sense, but obviously, if things are not going well, you can just pit or pull over. The accidents are normally not fatal, which is nice. I have been scared way more in racing. If you get scared in flying, you keep it to yourself. Never driven a big truck but imagine it is a challenge.
Re: Operating different machines.
My post was made because a lot of my career was seasonal flying, Aerial application, Fire suppression and airshow flying which by the nature of the job was seasonal.Why should we care what the cognitive demands are (or aren't) of driving a truck or bus? We're pilots. If we want to drive a big vehicle, then quit flying and go and do so; conversely, quit driving a bus, and take some flying lessons.
During the off flying part of the year I drove transport trucks to earn enough money to support my family.
I posted this because I thought it might be an interesting subject, however I may have failed to take into consideration this is a flying forum and thus not the best place to discuss any other occupation....
Oh well at least I was a part time pilot, which should give me some acceptance here among real pilots.
Re: Operating different machines.
Having done both I would say the concentration used during an IMC approach (no autopilot) is roughly the same as switching lanes down a 5 lane across highway during heavy traffic in a semi. Accordingly driving on cruise down the interstate for hours at a time pretty much the same as the cruise portion without an autopilot.
Re: Operating different machines.
Excellent comparison.Having done both I would say the concentration used during an IMC approach (no autopilot) is roughly the same as switching lanes down a 5 lane across highway during heavy traffic in a semi. Accordingly driving on cruise down the interstate for hours at a time pretty much the same as the cruise portion without an autopilot.
That makes me feel better, a positive response.
Re: Operating different machines.
Currently the approach feels harder to me. Probably because I'm 250 hrs into charter flying vs 7 years at 600,000 miles in a semi. Or Maybe it's cause only that captain has the Hsi/CDI on his side makes the scan kinda lopsided lol.
Re: Operating different machines.
This is the one! Decision making skills aside, for simple hands and feet, backhoe/excavator is it. For the first few hundred hours on my excavator, I would focus on making my hands move levers, which in turn moved the bucket. I moved earth. After a thousand some hours on my excavator, I detached my brain one day while trenching. I watched the bucket moving nicely, exactly where I wanted it to go. In the middle of this adequate machine control, I looked at my hands. They were moving the levers here and there, and I realized that my brain had no idea, and no care what my hands were doing, my brain was moving the bucket, my hands were just in the control path.Ever sat back and watched a really experienced excavator, or grader operator do their jobs? It's poetry.
Next to excavator would be hand wheeling a curved cut on a manual milling machine.
Allow your brain to operate the machine, with your hands in the control path, focus less on your brain moving your hands on the controls.
Re: Operating different machines.
Try piano.
https://youtu.be/fdKEUmFUMFg
https://youtu.be/fdKEUmFUMFg
DId you hear the one about the jurisprudence fetishist? He got off on a technicality.
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Re: Operating different machines.
at that point. you would be able to do something else as well lets call it multi-tasking, however the professionals say there is no such thing !They were moving the levers here and there, and I realized that my brain had no idea, and no care what my hands were doing, my brain was moving the bucket, my hands were just in the control path.
Re: Operating different machines.
I drove haul truck pulling wood and I'll tell ya the stress level was higher on the winter Bush roads than driving any aeroplane.truck or bus? We're pilots.
Black air has no lift - extra fuel has no weight
http://www.blackair.ca
http://www.blackair.ca
Re: Operating different machines.
Exactly, and that is why I started this subject.I drove haul truck pulling wood and I'll tell ya the stress level was higher on the winter Bush roads than driving any aeroplane.
There used to be a saying.
Flying is hours and hours of pure boredom, with the odd moment of stark terror.
Re: Operating different machines.
Oof yeah absolutely. Never did logs. Did flat deck through northern Ontario for a bit though. That was a rough winter.
Re: Operating different machines.
Comparing truck drivers to pilots is like comparing a goalie to a zamboni driver.
Yeah it’s tough to figure out how to drive the zamboni, to control the fluid and the edgers or whatever. How to not run into the boards and make that oval pattern. Even harder is choreographed Zamboni driving so you don’t wind up hitting the other Zamboni or wasting time going over what the other guy already did. The Zamboni driver is always doing something like the truck driver is, but it isn’t anything that requires a high amount of skill or thinking.
The goalie. If he’s got a good team all he does is stand there. Cut the angle off a bit when the other team enters the zone. Touch the puck if they don’t want an icing call. But when they take a shot on net it’s years worth of training and practice and skill that gives him the glove save. That’s a pilot. Lots of boredom. But you have to be alert and ready for anything at all times and not everyone can just gear up and do it.
That’s why there are a lot more pilots who are truck drivers than truck drivers who are pilots.
Yeah it’s tough to figure out how to drive the zamboni, to control the fluid and the edgers or whatever. How to not run into the boards and make that oval pattern. Even harder is choreographed Zamboni driving so you don’t wind up hitting the other Zamboni or wasting time going over what the other guy already did. The Zamboni driver is always doing something like the truck driver is, but it isn’t anything that requires a high amount of skill or thinking.
The goalie. If he’s got a good team all he does is stand there. Cut the angle off a bit when the other team enters the zone. Touch the puck if they don’t want an icing call. But when they take a shot on net it’s years worth of training and practice and skill that gives him the glove save. That’s a pilot. Lots of boredom. But you have to be alert and ready for anything at all times and not everyone can just gear up and do it.
That’s why there are a lot more pilots who are truck drivers than truck drivers who are pilots.
Re: Operating different machines.
If being a pilot is so difficult and takes so much intelligence to perform the task why is there no education requirements to become a pilot?
The only requirement is having enough money to get the licenses.
The only requirement is having enough money to get the licenses.
Re: Operating different machines.
I have no idea if the goalie is supposed to be the pilot or the truck driver in your analogy.Zaibatsu wrote: ↑Sat Nov 30, 2019 10:12 am Comparing truck drivers to pilots is like comparing a goalie to a zamboni driver.
Yeah it’s tough to figure out how to drive the zamboni, to control the fluid and the edgers or whatever. How to not run into the boards and make that oval pattern. Even harder is choreographed Zamboni driving so you don’t wind up hitting the other Zamboni or wasting time going over what the other guy already did. The Zamboni driver is always doing something like the truck driver is, but it isn’t anything that requires a high amount of skill or thinking.
The goalie. If he’s got a good team all he does is stand there. Cut the angle off a bit when the other team enters the zone. Touch the puck if they don’t want an icing call. But when they take a shot on net it’s years worth of training and practice and skill that gives him the glove save. That’s a pilot. Lots of boredom. But you have to be alert and ready for anything at all times and not everyone can just gear up and do it.
That’s why there are a lot more pilots who are truck drivers than truck drivers who are pilots.
As an AvCanada discussion grows longer:
-the probability of 'entitlement' being mentioned, approaches 1
-one will be accused of using bad airmanship
-the probability of 'entitlement' being mentioned, approaches 1
-one will be accused of using bad airmanship
Re: Operating different machines.
I realize that difficulty of operation doesn't directly relate to accidents/death as a result but certainly there is a somewhat causational link. Anyway, that's the way my thoughts went as it seems to me that any difficult activity with the risk of injury is that much more so if death is possible. Here's a report that indicates (without knowing the criteria for the study) flying is worse that way than trucking.
This chart is from the linked article (which doesn't add any detail on the chart criteria).
https://cdllife.com/2018/record-high-nu ... -job-2017/
This chart is from the linked article (which doesn't add any detail on the chart criteria).
https://cdllife.com/2018/record-high-nu ... -job-2017/
Being stupid around airplanes is a capital offence and nature is a hanging judge!
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“It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.”
Mark Twain
Re: Operating different machines.
There is the factor of physics 5X5, the chance of an accident being fatal is way higher in an airplane than in a truck generally speaking due to velocity.