AC and TRZ Agree to Terminate Arrangement

[tintin42]

Edit double post

[Fanblade]

Just for my friend FL 280


AC reduction bid is out all Rouge position are gone....why you think? lol

I think the pandemic has given AC an opportunity to rethink their fleet plans moving forward. They mentioned simplifying the fleet. Many wrenches have been thrown into the mix to have ended up where we are. The initial intent was never to have the 320 fleet split between Rouge and mainline. Rouge was to be 320 and mainline 737. Then the Max 9 didn’t pan out. Then the Max grounding. Then an A220 order. Then Max orders reduced to 50.

We have way too many NB types. I’m wondering if mainline becomes NB Airbus. Rouge 737. This is step 1. As leisure bounces back the 737 gets moved.

It could just be to minimize bumping and pay protections during the bid as well. Either way AC says Rouge will be ramped back up as leisure kicks back in.

Essentially Rouge is the same as Transat. 100% closure. I’m not that optimistic that this type of flying will return until summer 2021 in any meaningful way.

[Old fella]

On thing is certain - the AT group will not become insolvent because precedent has been set via politics aka Air Canada acquisition of CAI years back. No sitting Federal and Quebec Government will want to see a headline announcement of a bankrupt AT, isn’t gonna happen. AC will acquire AT and what the end result will be and how it will finally shake out is well above me to even suggest a viewpoint. Carry on

[telex]

On thing is certain - the AT group will not become insolvent because precedent has been set via politics aka Air Canada acquisition of CAI years back. No sitting Federal and Quebec Government will want to see a headline announcement of a bankrupt AT, isn’t gonna happen. AC will acquire AT and what the end result will be and how it will finally shake out is well above me to even suggest a viewpoint. Carry on

So a company (AT) with a product that has no value in the present climate only had to act fast by not flying. At all.
If I recall Gilles said companies that go beyond acting fast and making a plan beyond simply not flying will do better than those that just cease flying.
No doubt about it that AT will live on by simply acting fast and ceasing flying.

[JoeyBarton]

Just for my friend FL 280


AC reduction bid is out all Rouge position are gone....why you think? lol

If you are on the blue side I would be way more worried about AC not making any comment on the transaction. If the deal is delayed by 1-2 years, how small or deeply affected is Transat gonna be? Or simply gone?
Remember the longer it takes, the longer trz pilots are furloughed and the higher the chance of the blue side partly or fully folding.
Again, careful what you wish for.

[Old fella]

On thing is certain - the AT group will not become insolvent because precedent has been set via politics aka Air Canada acquisition of CAI years back. No sitting Federal and Quebec Government will want to see a headline announcement of a bankrupt AT, isn’t gonna happen. AC will acquire AT and what the end result will be and how it will finally shake out is well above me to even suggest a viewpoint. Carry on

So a company (AT) with a product that has no value in the present climate only had to act fast by not flying. At all.
If I recall Gilles said companies that go beyond acting fast and making a plan beyond simply not flying will do better than those that just cease flying.
No doubt about it that AT will live on by simply acting fast and ceasing flying.

I would respectfully suggest under the current climate the complete airline industry has a product than can be considering of little value let alone AT. AC vs AT has a political theme and as we all know politics is abstract.

[Localizer]

Altiplano, sharkslasers, and FL-280 .. seriously guys .. get a grip, pop a Lorazepam and chill out .. quit acting like rabid dogs every time a troll comes out from under the bridge.

Maybe one of the AT guys can comment on this .. besides the current shape of the industry was AT in financial hardship before the pandemic? I think the answer is no, and I haven’t seen any reports to that effect .. so why are posters saying the acquisition is with regards to the financial difficulties of AT?

The articles online hint that AT has access to around a billion dollars .. I don’t know the burn rate but if AC is burning $20 million a day, they would only be a fraction of that. Seems to me AT can hold out for a long time.

[tailgunner]

A quick glance of the financial results from 2019 show a 33000000$ dollar loss for Transat. AC shows a 917000000 $ dollar profit for 2019.
2019 was a high water mark for the global airline industry. Airlines consistently showed profits across the board. If Transat struggled to post largely positive numbers during this period, I think that one may interpolate that they have/had some weakness/ challenges with their existing business plan going forward.
All bets are off now, because of the huge global paradigm change in worldwide travel.
Cheers

[altiplano]

Altiplano, sharkslasers, and FL-280 .. seriously guys .. get a grip, pop a Lorazepam and chill out .. quit acting like rabid dogs every time a troll comes out from under the bridge.

I thought my comment was pretty "chill"... "I don't think the loss of 600 jobs is anything to LOL about." Is that"rabid?"

Cracks me up that people point fingers in here about the most reasonable and benign comments.

[Localizer]

No sensible person thinks the loss of 600 jobs is anything to laugh about. I apologize if your comment was lost in translation.

[FL320]

Air Canada Vacations Returning in June
https://ca-travelpulse-com.cdn.ampproj ... n-june.amp

[airboy1]

Air Canada Vacations Returning in June
https://ca-travelpulse-com.cdn.ampproj ... n-june.amp

And Air Transat conveniently cancels flights for June. Strange coincidences.
Just need to see A321XLR on the aircrat type

https://ca.travelpulse.com/news/airline ... inues.html

[Jimmy_Hoffa]

I wonder if all AC pilots need to be recalled before the TS pilots if the deal goes through.... could be a long few years.

[FL320]

I wonder if all AC pilots need to be recalled before the TS pilots if the deal goes through.... could be a long few years

Even if AC acquire Transat, it will take 1-2 years to merge all the ops. I expect Air Transat to continue its operations as usual for a while but with all the decisions being taken by the owner, AC.
I understand the AC flying belongs to ACPA pilots but even if there is a grief; as long as AC can prove that the merge of the entire ops is in process (which can’t be done overnight, especially in the actual unusual circumstances); TS pilots will still fly Air Transat’s aircrafts. The best for AC pilots might be to merge both pilot groups asap?

[Gilles Hudicourt]

A quick glance of the financial results from 2019 show a 33000000$ dollar loss for Transat. AC shows a 917000000 $ dollar profit for 2019.
2019 was a high water mark for the global airline industry. Airlines consistently showed profits across the board. If Transat struggled to post largely positive numbers during this period, I think that one may interpolate that they have/had some weakness/ challenges with their existing business plan going forward.
All bets are off now, because of the huge global paradigm change in worldwide travel.
Cheers

You are correct that with intense competition Transat was facing between Rouge and Sunwing, they were having a hard time making a profit. However, a plan had been made and was being implemented.

On the tour operator side , it involved investing in a Transat hotel brand.That is now on hold as far as I know.

On the airline side, it involved bringing the airline to just two types of aircraft, the A321 and the A330, with most pilots qualified to fly both, saving tons of training and dead heading costs. Seventeen fuel efficient 199 seat A321 NEO were ordered and were going to be put on the Europe flights in the summer and on southern destinations in the winter. The A330s would be maintained on the high capacity routes and on destinations beyond the A321s range, Rome Athens, Zagreb etc). In winter, excess A330s were to be parked or leased out in either ACMI or dry leases.

[flyinhigh]

The hotel brand is what is putting pressure on the financials, from the purchasing of property to the construction of hotels. If Transat did not do that, than it would be a different story.

Also Gilles you are correct, JME had said that it is all on hold due to the transaction. If the deal goes through AC will sell that off for hundred mil would be my guess.

You are correct that with intense competition Transat was facing between Rouge and Sunwing, they were having a hard time making a profit. However, a plan had been made and was being implemented.

On the tour operator side , it involved investing in a Transat hotel brand.That is now on hold as far as I know.

On the airline side, it involved bringing the airline to just two types of aircraft, the A321 and the A330, with most pilots qualified to fly both, saving tons of training and dead heading costs. Seventeen fuel efficient 199 seat A321 NEO were ordered and were going to be put on the Europe flights in the summer and on southern destinations in the winter. The A330s would be maintained on the high capacity routes and on destinations beyond the A321s range, Rome Athens, Zagreb etc). In winter, excess A330s were to be parked or leased out in either ACMI or dry leases.

[rudder]

On the airline side, it involved bringing the airline to just two types of aircraft, the A321 and the A330, with most pilots qualified to fly both, saving tons of training and dead heading costs. Seventeen fuel efficient 199 seat A321 NEO were ordered and were going to be put on the Europe flights in the summer and on southern destinations in the winter. The A330s would be maintained on the high capacity routes and on destinations beyond the A321s range, Rome Athens, Zagreb etc). In winter, excess A330s were to be parked or leased out in either ACMI or dry leases.

Awesome. So that was the pre-COVID plan. What is the updated plan?

With or without the AC transaction, TRZ/TS will operate separately for the foreseeable future. AC has already begun to act to modify commercial plan 2020 to commercial plan *2020-2023. Fleet shrunk. Routes cancelled. Structural change.

Going in to suspended animation is not a plan. What is the plan?

[airboy1]

Awesome. So that was the pre-COVID plan. What is the updated plan?

With or without the AC transaction, TRZ/TS will operate separately for the foreseeable future. AC has already begun to act to modify commercial plan 2020 to commercial plan *2020-2023. Fleet shrunk. Routes cancelled. Structural change.

Going in to suspended animation is not a plan. What is the plan?

That's Air Canada's problem to figure out. They will tell TRZ to maybe stay in suspension and use the TRZ aircraft to replace the aging a320s. AC is the owner after all once transaction is complete. Its just the seniority list that will take time.

[rudder]

Going in to suspended animation is not a plan. What is the plan?

That's Air Canada's problem to figure out.

Priceless.

[altiplano]

"Priceless" - LOL...

TRZ aircraft?

That's an expensive lease takeover... 720 million for a handful of new 321 leases when aircraft leases are a dime a dozen and you're reducing your own fleet and lease liabilities at present? And gas is cheap?

This will play out to the bitter end of approvals or lack of approvals and then we'll see what drops...