Are foreign flight training hours counted towards CPL?

[pilotfromhk]

Hi all!

I am a student pilot from Hong Kong who has trained in Australia before for 40 hours (but didn't get any license).
Can I count these hours towards the CPL minimum requirement (i.e. 200 hours)?

Thanks all!

[photofly]

Yes.

[pilotfromhk]

Yes.

Thanks!

Do you know whether I can count all those hours or just part of them?
Also is there any conversion procedure that I need to follow or I just need to show my log book?

[photofly]

Towards the 200 hours you can count everything.

Are the 40 hour post-PPL? Did you already have a private pilot licence before those 40 hours? You're not clear. If so and you want some of the hours to count towards the 35 hours post-ppl dual instruction hours, or 30 hours post-ppl supervised solo flight time requirements you will have to provide evidence of how the hours for which you are claiming credit meet the relevant requirements: logbook entries, training records, instructor notes etc.

Otherwise you may want to claim credit for some of your training towards the PPL requirements instead.

[pilotfromhk]

Towards the 200 hours you can count everything.

Are the 40 hour post-PPL? Did you already have a private pilot licence before those 40 hours? You're not clear. If so and you want some of the hours to count towards the 35 hours post-ppl dual instruction hours, or 30 hours post-ppl supervised solo flight time requirements you will have to provide evidence of how the hours for which you are claiming credit meet the relevant requirements: logbook entries, training records, instructor notes etc.

Otherwise you may want to claim credit for some of your training towards the PPL requirements instead.

I didn't get any license so it is not post-PPL.
Does it mean that mine can only be counted towards my PPL training in Canada?
So maybe only 50% can be counted I guess since I still need extra training in Canada?

[photofly]

It's unlikely that you'll need to count extra hours for your PPL, since you will have to do training in Canada. But if you are ready for your PPL and you have fewer than 45 hours training in Canada then you can claim credit (1:1) for the hours you trained abroad, if you have evidence of the training.

You can't count any hours towards the 30 and 35 hours requirements of the CPL, but you can count them all towards the 200 hours total requirements.

[frog]

All those hours could be counted as long as they meet the Canadian requirements.

For instance, do you have the instrument time ? etc...

[pilotfromhk]

It's unlikely that you'll need to count extra hours for your PPL, since you will have to do training in Canada. But if you are ready for your PPL and you have fewer than 45 hours training in Canada then you can claim credit (1:1) for the hours you trained abroad, if you have evidence of the training.

You can't count any hours towards the 30 and 35 hours requirements of the CPL, but you can count them all towards the 200 hours total requirements.

Yeah that's what I am thinking too. Since I am aiming for the CPL anyway, I don't really care whether they can count towards the PPL requirement.
As long as they can count towards the 200 hours total requirements then it should be alright
Needa reduce the training costs haha

Thanks again!

[pilotfromhk]

All those hours could be counted as long as they meet the Canadian requirements.

For instance, do you have the instrument time ? etc...

Well those 40 hours including some basic theory and some solo circuits etc.
But just like PHOTOFLY has suggested, if they can count towards the 200 hours total requirement then I am more than satisfied already

[pilotfromhk]

.

[digits_]

I'm not familiar with the Australian training system, but if you are planning on using some of those hours to satisfy specific requirements for the CPL, other than the general 200 hours, you'll have to be able to proof the experience. There are for example requirements for night flying, cross country, instrument flight etc. Not all of those might be logged or documented in your logbook at this time.

[Big Pistons Forever]

As a general comment Transport Canada will accept training certified by any recognized ICAO authority. That is the training was carried out pursuant to the flight training regulations of the country where the flying occurred and there was a way to ascertain the validity of the training with a logbook endorsement, signed pilot training record, letter from the regulator etc etc. I once had a student that had 20 hours of dual and a Botswana Student Pilot Permit. All his time was accepted by TC

The first thing that needs to happen is a Canadian Flight school needs to go over the training you have and decided what meets the Canadian Aviation Regulations and what does not, then do a gap analysis and see what exercises are missing, for example instrument flying instruction. You then do what is needed to fill the gaps, any additional flying to prove competency and get recommended for a flight test, write the exam and then get a PPL. after that continue training and building time to meet the requirements of the Canadian Aviation Regulations. Of note some of the requirements for the CPL only apply to flying after the award of the PPL

Google Canadian Aviation Regulation Standard 421.26 and 421.30 to see all of the requirements.

[photofly]

I'm not familiar with the Australian training system, but if you are planning on using some of those hours to satisfy specific requirements for the CPL, other than the general 200 hours, you'll have to be able to proof the experience. There are for example requirements for night flying, cross country, instrument flight etc. Not all of those might be logged or documented in your logbook at this time.

None of the hours will count towards any of the specific CPL requirements (other than the 200 hours total time) in Canada because none of them were obtained post-PPL.

[frog]

I agree, the standards are the best place to start :

https://tc.canada.ca/en/corporate-servi ... ars#421_05

[digits_]

I'm not familiar with the Australian training system, but if you are planning on using some of those hours to satisfy specific requirements for the CPL, other than the general 200 hours, you'll have to be able to proof the experience. There are for example requirements for night flying, cross country, instrument flight etc. Not all of those might be logged or documented in your logbook at this time.

None of the hours will count towards any of the specific CPL requirements (other than the 200 hours total time) in Canada because none of them were obtained post-PPL.

Woops. Good point, I missed that part.

[pilotfromhk]

I'm not familiar with the Australian training system, but if you are planning on using some of those hours to satisfy specific requirements for the CPL, other than the general 200 hours, you'll have to be able to proof the experience. There are for example requirements for night flying, cross country, instrument flight etc. Not all of those might be logged or documented in your logbook at this time.

None of the hours will count towards any of the specific CPL requirements (other than the 200 hours total time) in Canada because none of them were obtained post-PPL.

So my 40 in Australia are 35 dual and 5 solo.

Assume I get the PPL in Canada for 30 dual and 15 solo without counting my previous experience.
Then I will need an extra 80 solo to meet the min 100 solo requirement (80+15 from ppl+5 in Aus=100) and extra 35 dual (35+30 from ppl+35 from Aus+100 solo =200) to meet the 200 for CPL.

i.e. 80 solo + 35 dual + 45 from PPL + 40 in Aus = 200

Is that correct?

[pilotfromhk]

As a general comment Transport Canada will accept training certified by any recognized ICAO authority. That is the training was carried out pursuant to the flight training regulations of the country where the flying occurred and there was a way to ascertain the validity of the training with a logbook endorsement, signed pilot training record, letter from the regulator etc etc. I once had a student that had 20 hours of dual and a Botswana Student Pilot Permit. All his time was accepted by TC

The first thing that needs to happen is a Canadian Flight school needs to go over the training you have and decided what meets the Canadian Aviation Regulations and what does not, then do a gap analysis and see what exercises are missing, for example instrument flying instruction. You then do what is needed to fill the gaps, any additional flying to prove competency and get recommended for a flight test, write the exam and then get a PPL. after that continue training and building time to meet the requirements of the Canadian Aviation Regulations. Of note some of the requirements for the CPL only apply to flying after the award of the PPL

Google Canadian Aviation Regulation Standard 421.26 and 421.30 to see all of the requirements.

I see! I will soon discuss with the flight school. Thanks for your help!

[digits_]

I'm not familiar with the Australian training system, but if you are planning on using some of those hours to satisfy specific requirements for the CPL, other than the general 200 hours, you'll have to be able to proof the experience. There are for example requirements for night flying, cross country, instrument flight etc. Not all of those might be logged or documented in your logbook at this time.

None of the hours will count towards any of the specific CPL requirements (other than the 200 hours total time) in Canada because none of them were obtained post-PPL.

So my 40 in Australia are 35 dual and 5 solo.

Assume I get the PPL in Canada for 30 dual and 15 solo without counting my previous experience.
Then I will need an extra 80 solo to meet the min 100 solo requirement (80+15 from ppl+5 in Aus=100) and extra 35 dual (35+30 from ppl+35 from Aus+100 solo =200) to meet the 200 for CPL.

i.e. 80 solo + 35 dual + 45 from PPL + 40 in Aus = 200

Is that correct?

Sounds like that would be correct yes.

[Bede]

I'm not familiar with the Australian training system, but if you are planning on using some of those hours to satisfy specific requirements for the CPL, other than the general 200 hours, you'll have to be able to proof the experience. There are for example requirements for night flying, cross country, instrument flight etc. Not all of those might be logged or documented in your logbook at this time.

None of the hours will count towards any of the specific CPL requirements (other than the 200 hours total time) in Canada because none of them were obtained post-PPL.

So my 40 in Australia are 35 dual and 5 solo.

Assume I get the PPL in Canada for 30 dual and 15 solo without counting my previous experience.
Then I will need an extra 80 solo to meet the min 100 solo requirement (80+15 from ppl+5 in Aus=100) and extra 35 dual (35+30 from ppl+35 from Aus+100 solo =200) to meet the 200 for CPL.

i.e. 80 solo + 35 dual + 45 from PPL + 40 in Aus = 200

Is that correct?

Something to be aware of: PIC and solo time are not the same thing. You need 100 hrs PIC (feel free to take wife, friend, etc along). Solo is defined as the sole occupant of the aircraft. You need 30 hrs of supervised solo for CPL.

[ahramin]

I'm not familiar with the Australian training system, but if you are planning on using some of those hours to satisfy specific requirements for the CPL, other than the general 200 hours, you'll have to be able to proof the experience. There are for example requirements for night flying, cross country, instrument flight etc. Not all of those might be logged or documented in your logbook at this time.

None of the hours will count towards any of the specific CPL requirements (other than the 200 hours total time) in Canada because none of them were obtained post-PPL.

So my 40 in Australia are 35 dual and 5 solo.

Assume I get the PPL in Canada for 30 dual and 15 solo without counting my previous experience.
Then I will need an extra 80 solo to meet the min 100 solo requirement (80+15 from ppl+5 in Aus=100) and extra 35 dual (35+30 from ppl+35 from Aus+100 solo =200) to meet the 200 for CPL.

i.e. 80 solo + 35 dual + 45 from PPL + 40 in Aus = 200

Is that correct?

No. As an exercise, go to the CARs and print out all the requirements for a CPL. For each requirement, it will be obvious if your Australian time counts. If a CPL needs 200 hours total, all of your Australian time counts. If you need 100 hours total PIC, all of your Australian PIC time counts. If you need 30 hours PIC post PPL under supervision of a flight instructor, only the Australian time spent PIC post PPL under the supervision of a flight instructor will count (so in your case: 0).

Look at each requirement individually and determine if your time qualifies towards that specific requirement. Don't try to find a general rule that will explain all the specific requirements.

[photofly]

Something to be aware of: PIC and solo time are not the same thing. You need 100 hrs PIC (feel free to take wife, friend, etc along). Solo is defined as the sole occupant of the aircraft. You need 30 hrs of supervised solo for CPL.

Are you sure that's how TC interprets it, in practice? Come to that, how would TC know? You don't enter passengers in your PTR.

[digits_]

None of the hours will count towards any of the specific CPL requirements (other than the 200 hours total time) in Canada because none of them were obtained post-PPL.

So my 40 in Australia are 35 dual and 5 solo.

Assume I get the PPL in Canada for 30 dual and 15 solo without counting my previous experience.
Then I will need an extra 80 solo to meet the min 100 solo requirement (80+15 from ppl+5 in Aus=100) and extra 35 dual (35+30 from ppl+35 from Aus+100 solo =200) to meet the 200 for CPL.

i.e. 80 solo + 35 dual + 45 from PPL + 40 in Aus = 200

Is that correct?

No. As an exercise, go to the CARs and print out all the requirements for a CPL. For each requirement, it will be obvious if your Australian time counts. If a CPL needs 200 hours total, all of your Australian time counts. If you need 100 hours total PIC, all of your Australian PIC time counts. If you need 30 hours PIC post PPL under supervision of a flight instructor, only the Australian time spent PIC post PPL under the supervision of a flight instructor will count (so in your case: 0).

Look at each requirement individually and determine if your time qualifies towards that specific requirement. Don't try to find a general rule that will explain all the specific requirements.

What's wrong with his numbers? It seems to be the most optimal solution, using his ppl assumption.

[digits_]

Something to be aware of: PIC and solo time are not the same thing. You need 100 hrs PIC (feel free to take wife, friend, etc along). Solo is defined as the sole occupant of the aircraft. You need 30 hrs of supervised solo for CPL.

Sounds logical, until you look at the requirements for the float rating:

(B) a minimum of 5 takeoffs and landings as sole occupant of the aeroplane, except for two crew aircraft, in which case the takeoffs and landings shall be done as pilot-in-command.

So apparently we have PIC, solo and sole occupant options.

And solo flight time definition:

solo flight time means, with respect to the flight time necessary to acquire a permit, licence or rating,

(a) in the case of a pilot, the flight time during which the pilot is the sole flight crew member, and

(b) in the case of a student pilot permit holder, the flight time during which the holder is the sole occupant of an aircraft while under the direction and supervision of the holder of an instructor rating for the appropriate category of aircraft; (temps de vol en solo)

A ppl holder and cpl student qualifies under (a) and can bring passengers.

[ahramin]

So my 40 in Australia are 35 dual and 5 solo.

Assume I get the PPL in Canada for 30 dual and 15 solo without counting my previous experience.
Then I will need an extra 80 solo to meet the min 100 solo requirement (80+15 from ppl+5 in Aus=100) and extra 35 dual (35+30 from ppl+35 from Aus+100 solo =200) to meet the 200 for CPL.

i.e. 80 solo + 35 dual + 45 from PPL + 40 in Aus = 200

Is that correct?

No. As an exercise, go to the CARs and print out all the requirements for a CPL. For each requirement, it will be obvious if your Australian time counts. If a CPL needs 200 hours total, all of your Australian time counts. If you need 100 hours total PIC, all of your Australian PIC time counts. If you need 30 hours PIC post PPL under supervision of a flight instructor, only the Australian time spent PIC post PPL under the supervision of a flight instructor will count (so in your case: 0).

Look at each requirement individually and determine if your time qualifies towards that specific requirement. Don't try to find a general rule that will explain all the specific requirements.

What's wrong with his numbers? It seems to be the most optimal solution, using his ppl assumption.

Whoops. My apologies. It's my numbers that are wrong.

[pilotfromhk]

None of the hours will count towards any of the specific CPL requirements (other than the 200 hours total time) in Canada because none of them were obtained post-PPL.

So my 40 in Australia are 35 dual and 5 solo.

Assume I get the PPL in Canada for 30 dual and 15 solo without counting my previous experience.
Then I will need an extra 80 solo to meet the min 100 solo requirement (80+15 from ppl+5 in Aus=100) and extra 35 dual (35+30 from ppl+35 from Aus+100 solo =200) to meet the 200 for CPL.

i.e. 80 solo + 35 dual + 45 from PPL + 40 in Aus = 200

Is that correct?

Something to be aware of: PIC and solo time are not the same thing. You need 100 hrs PIC (feel free to take wife, friend, etc along). Solo is defined as the sole occupant of the aircraft. You need 30 hrs of supervised solo for CPL.

Sure got it thanks!