They build Metros tough!!!!

[The Hammer]

https://www.airportia.com/news/key-lime ... collision/

[VSF]

But you can't tow it with the door open...

Glad everyone was okay!

[goldeneagle]

Another angle. Not damage to the vertical stab as well.

[boeingboy]

I just can't see how that thing stayed together...
On another note:

A Key Lime Air Swearingen SA-226TC Metro II, registration N280KL performing flight KG-970 from Salida,CO to Denver Centennial,CO (USA) with one crew, was on a visual approach to Centennial's runway 17L cleared for the approach and was descending through 6400 feet about 3nm north of the threshold runway 17L at about 11:24L (16:24Z).

A private Cirrus SR-22, registration N416DJ with two people on board, was cleared for a visual approach to runway 17R and was advised of the traffic landing on the parallel runway. The Cirrus descended through 6400 feet about 3nm north of the threshold of runway 17R, but overshot the centerlines of both runways 17R and 17L.

So on a crystal clear day this dingdong overshoots not only his centerline - but the parallel runway centerline as well?????
Where the hell was he going?

[The Hammer]

I just can't see how that thing stayed together...
On another note:

A Key Lime Air Swearingen SA-226TC Metro II, registration N280KL performing flight KG-970 from Salida,CO to Denver Centennial,CO (USA) with one crew, was on a visual approach to Centennial's runway 17L cleared for the approach and was descending through 6400 feet about 3nm north of the threshold runway 17L at about 11:24L (16:24Z).

A private Cirrus SR-22, registration N416DJ with two people on board, was cleared for a visual approach to runway 17R and was advised of the traffic landing on the parallel runway. The Cirrus descended through 6400 feet about 3nm north of the threshold of runway 17R, but overshot the centerlines of both runways 17R and 17L.

So on a crystal clear day this dingdong overshoots not only his centerline - but the parallel runway centerline as well?????
Where the hell was he going?

I'm definitely not defending the Cirrus but these are tight parallels with only one of them having approaches. The Cirrus was supposed to be lined up with the short VFR runway. It's tough to figure out exactly how far apart they are but it's approximately 6000 feet.

The tone of the pilots on the Key Lime is funny. "We'll taxi to the Signature"

[ATC_Anstey]

I just can't see how that thing stayed together...
On another note:

A Key Lime Air Swearingen SA-226TC Metro II, registration N280KL performing flight KG-970 from Salida,CO to Denver Centennial,CO (USA) with one crew, was on a visual approach to Centennial's runway 17L cleared for the approach and was descending through 6400 feet about 3nm north of the threshold runway 17L at about 11:24L (16:24Z).

A private Cirrus SR-22, registration N416DJ with two people on board, was cleared for a visual approach to runway 17R and was advised of the traffic landing on the parallel runway. The Cirrus descended through 6400 feet about 3nm north of the threshold of runway 17R, but overshot the centerlines of both runways 17R and 17L.

So on a crystal clear day this dingdong overshoots not only his centerline - but the parallel runway centerline as well?????
Where the hell was he going?

I'm definitely not defending the Cirrus but these are tight parallels with only one of them having approaches. The Cirrus was supposed to be lined up with the short VFR runway. It's tough to figure out exactly how far apart they are but it's approximately 6000 feet.

The tone of the pilots on the Key Lime is funny. "We'll taxi to the Signature"

Measuring them on google Earth centerline to centerline is about 700 feet. That seems crazy to me. I heard the guy was grounding 150 knots. 700 feet is less than 3 seconds flying time. Given how quick the controller was about asking the Cirrus if he was overshooting final I would guess this has been a problem at Centennial for a while and it was a matter of time before this happened. Wonder if they do anything about it.

[photofly]

How smart is it to be grounding 150 knots if you're trying to turn final and line up on centreline with traffic on final on a parallel runway 700' to the side?

[ATC_Anstey]

How smart is it to be grounding 150 knots if you're trying to turn final and line up on centreline with traffic on final on a parallel runway 700' to the side?

Obviously not very smart. That being said a more reasonable speed is only 5 or 6 seconds of flying time between the parallels. From what I've seen working at a training airport that's just asking for trouble. Again I'm not all that familiar with Centennial, and I would assume that would be one of the first things an instructor operating there would burn into his students brain, turn early, don't turn late, stay on your side. With how busy they are though, I can see it being a problem regardless of speed.

[rookiepilot]

Why wouldn't ATC offset the approaches of the 2 aircraft so they weren't going to be at the same altitude? Ie call the base turn for the Cirrus until the metro was lower?

Not excusing the Cirrus but 700 feet doesn't take long with a strong tailwind on base.

[ATC_Anstey]

Why wouldn't ATC offset the approaches of the 2 aircraft so they weren't going to be at the same altitude? Ie call the base turn for the Cirrus until the metro was lower?

Not excusing the Cirrus but 700 feet doesn't take long with a strong tailwind on base.

Probably because the Cirrus called traffic in sight when told about the Metro. In Canada at least, once that happens you have visual separation and you would think the guy who sees the Metro won't hit the Metro. That being said, listening to the recording I'm not all that certain if he saw the Metro or was just reiterating that he saw the traffic he was instructed to follow. That's probably more hindsight bias though, in the moment this sounds like he's got the Metro in sight.

ATC: "Cirrus 6DJ, traffic you're following just turned right base, they're ahead and to your right at 6600, Cessna"
Cirrus: "Traffic in sight 6DJ"
ATC: "Cirrus 6DJ, follow them, runway 17R cleared to land, additional traffic, north shore, it's a metroliner for the parallel"
Cirrus: Traffic in sight, cleared to land 17R, 6DJ"

Again, unfamiliar with Centennial and American procedures in general that if he didn't report the Metro in sight, I'm not sure what separation standard they're using. Given the Metro traffic pointout sounded more like additional information rather than him needing to see the Metro before he could turn I would guess that it's legal to use some sort of geographic separation where the aircraft is supposed to stay on their side. But with parallel runways 700 feet apart that sounds way too sketchy for me to trust. Forced offsets would slow the amount of traffic an airport like this could handle for sure. That's likely part of the consideration when making this operation legal, especially if there's a lot of faster traffic using the longer runway. Would for sure make it safer, and I wouldn't be surprised if the investigation results in that sort of action.

The only thing I would really say about the ATC here is the East Tower controller who was working the Metro on the other runway didn't get a chance to point the Cirrus out to the Metro. They did point out the Cessna who the Cirrus was following who wasn't a potential factor with the Metro until shorter final. Unsure if that would have done anything to help since it was entirely the Cirrus fault here but perhaps he could have sighted him and make a last second effort to avoid, I'm not sure.

[digits_]

This accident made me wonder if there is a dfiference in survivability statistically on aircraft running control cables through the floor vs through the ceiling.

[boeingboy]

Taken from someone holding short. This picture needs no words......

[goldeneagle]

Just saw another video on YouTube by the other plane on downwind when this happened. It was a student on first solo.

Memorable first solo for sure, good hangar tale for the rest of his life.

[rigpiggy]

Linky link please

[goldeneagle]

Linky link please

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xQSbTrmuko
============
This all happened during my first student solo at KAPA. I was flying in N65251 and reported pulled chute and location of downed cirrus
============

[all_ramped_up]

But you can't tow it with the door open...

Glad everyone was okay!

That was my first thought too!

"Can't tow it with the door open but you can fly it with that whole chunk missing???"

[DadoBlade]

..and yet other ground handlers clearly recount when loading freight on a SW Metroliner to near MTOW, the aft freight door would not close because of floor/fuselage flex. Even with the pogo stick in place, it took 3 men, (yes, men), to finesse, i.e. it took two (2) men to jack the tail up and down while the third guy tried to close the freight door. It worked.

The Merlin IIIB with winglets was nice.. a much better flying machine than the Metroliner.

LKF Metroliner stuff: provision for a small Rocket-Assisted Take Off (RATO) rocket in the tail cone was made, this being offered to improve takeoff performance out of "hot & high" airfields in the event of an engine failure. Flying out of La Paz, Bolivia comes to mind..