Tower closure predictions?

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A346Dude
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by A346Dude »

thenoflyzone wrote: Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:03 pm While I agree the airport layout of YHM and its traffic mix is not conducive to FSS only service (I think it's high time they build a full length parallel taxiway), there are ways to mitigate the loss of ATC service, while keeping things moving safely.
I'm sure it could be mitigated and made generally safe, and I'm also sure it would not be as efficient or as safe as it is now. Using all 4 runways strategically would largely be a thing of the past. There would be increased go arounds - you have to cross or taxi down a well-used runway to get to the longest runway, and FSS has no ability to force an aircraft to hold short.

It is not MEM, but delays in YHM fan out throughout the Canadian system, and there are a lot of companies that pay big money to have their shipment arrive next day. They would be complaining constantly if it consistently became a 2 day service.
thenoflyzone wrote: Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:03 pm YYZ - 465,400 t
YVR - 285,100 t
YUL - 121,700 t
YHM - 97,900 t
YYC - 88,900 t
YMX - 83,500 t (*Moved all that cargo with no control tower)
YWG - 58,200 t
Much of this is belly cargo, which is generally not as time sensitive and trickles in smoothly throughout the day (and of which YHM has none of to pad their numbers). YMX is the closest comparable, but it has a better layout (single main runway, close to full length parallel taxiway) and it does not have the same level of compressed arrival/departure banks (half the annual IFR movements, and they are spread out a little better).
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Top_Gun
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by Top_Gun »

Air traffic control services to continue for Canadian communities

https://www.navcanada.ca/en/news/news-r ... 50268.aspx

Looks like no tower closures happening now.
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RexKrammer
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by RexKrammer »

Fantastic news. Really, none of the control towers or FSS stations should have been put up for an LOS during these times.
I'm glad to hear that, certainly for now, they will remain open. That must be a huge relief for all the staff involved.
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Braun
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by Braun »

RexKrammer wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 5:35 pm Fantastic news. Really, none of the control towers or FSS stations should have been put up for an LOS during these times.
I'm glad to hear that, certainly for now, they will remain open. That must be a huge relief for all the staff involved.
100% first good new in a while. Next up....cancel all those ATC layoffs.
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Top_Gun
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by Top_Gun »

Braun wrote: Sat Apr 17, 2021 3:20 am
RexKrammer wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 5:35 pm Fantastic news. Really, none of the control towers or FSS stations should have been put up for an LOS during these times.
I'm glad to hear that, certainly for now, they will remain open. That must be a huge relief for all the staff involved.
100% first good new in a while. Next up....cancel all those ATC layoffs.
Any word on a financial aid deal for NavCanada with the government like Air Canada got?
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Braun
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by Braun »

Top_Gun wrote: Sat Apr 17, 2021 5:53 am
Braun wrote: Sat Apr 17, 2021 3:20 am
RexKrammer wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 5:35 pm Fantastic news. Really, none of the control towers or FSS stations should have been put up for an LOS during these times.
I'm glad to hear that, certainly for now, they will remain open. That must be a huge relief for all the staff involved.
100% first good new in a while. Next up....cancel all those ATC layoffs.
Any word on a financial aid deal for NavCanada with the government like Air Canada got?
Nothing at this time. Some rumours that it's coming but absolutely nothing official.
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RexKrammer
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by RexKrammer »

So, with the latest info from the Union, stating they're pushing Nav Canada to staff Towers to an adequate level before those that are there burn out, does anyone actually think training will recommence anytime soon(ish)?
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thenoflyzone
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by thenoflyzone »

RexKrammer wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 12:10 pm So, with the latest info from the Union, stating they're pushing Nav Canada to staff Towers to an adequate level before those that are there burn out, does anyone actually think training will recommence anytime soon(ish)?
Doubt it.

They will try to staff through cross-training and temporary deployments. I’m already seeing this at my TWR/FIR.

In my opinion, Ab-initio training at a national level won’t restart until 2022 at the earliest.
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RexKrammer
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by RexKrammer »

That's my fear, but I hope training can recommence in say September.
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Braun
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by Braun »

September is way too optimistic. It won't happen. There are several controllers with layoff letters. Not realistic to expect ab-initio training any time soon. Sorry to burst your bubble.
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16SidedOffice
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by 16SidedOffice »

Some of the units will have up to 40% retiring within 3-5 years and no trainees or replacements in sight.
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Braun
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by Braun »

16SidedOffice wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 10:17 am Some of the units will have up to 40% retiring within 3-5 years and no trainees or replacements in sight.
Yup, we are sort of screwed. That being said CATCA could never allow ab initio training to commence without all the laid off controllers being recalled and retrained if required. At least I hope so....
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RexKrammer
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by RexKrammer »

I agree, those with lay-off letters need those letters torn up by the company, yesterday. It's crazy that they're still looking to lay off licenced controllers.
If they don't start training both ab-initios and bids to other units soon, they're going to be so short staffed it's unfathomable.
The company needs to be ahead of the curve, not playing catch up in a few years' time whilst implementing serious flow delays because they don't have the staff to handle the number of flights everyone except higher management could see will be flying by then.
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Top_Gun
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Re: Tower closure predictions?

Post by Top_Gun »

Re: Nav Canada Training After Covid
NAV CANADA cancels surplus notices for air traffic controllers ​

https://www.navcanada.ca/en/news/news-r ... 55879.aspx
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