F-18 Pilot gets a desk job

Federally · Post by **Federally** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 1:36 pm

http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?Cont ... d4a8db1b87&

I couldn't believe this when I read it. To be honest I have seen this all over the U.S. and Canada but never heard of so many complaints because of it, do people honestly have this much time on their hands?
The only reaction I ever see, from airport personnel (fuelers, students, pilots, instructors, passengers, etc) is a reaction of awe and inspiration, and it takes you away from whatever moment or day you are having and puts a smile on your face. Reminds me of being a kid again and being at an airshow for the first time.

2R · Post by 2R » Tue Oct 25, 2005 1:51 pm

No harm was done by his fly-by.
No one was hurt.
The joy of flight that he was sharing with the people of his home town.
Showing the Grace and Skill of a Defender of Freedom I hope the people of his home town show some support and appreciation for the skills that keep them free.
Some people should learn to appreciate those that are willing to fight to protect them,I hope he gets his plane back.Anyone who is willing to die for his country should be allowed some fun now and again.
God bless him and the other defenders of our freedom

Federally · Post by **Federally** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 2:19 pm

Well put.

Nark · Post by **Nark** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 7:21 pm

I guess that leaves a spot for me.

All kidding aside, after 4 years he's heading to a desk job anyways. It's called a "B" Billet. He just happened to speed that B billet up.

Thank you 2R

Cheers.

. . · Post by **. .** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 8:56 pm

anyone that would rat a guy out for something like that deserves a ball peen hammer to the face.

LostinRotation · Post by **LostinRotation** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:05 pm

Wow. Grounding the kid is pretty hash but lets face facts.

200kts is the speed limit in the control zone....this kid was doing over 600kts !

Rules are their for a reason...just because the person works for the military doesn't mean he should be allowed to transend those rules and possibly put other peoples lives in danger.

"Anyone who is willing to die for his country should be allowed some fun now and again."

Agreed...just do it where it's safe to do so....like a military training facility....not a GA airport.

I used to be a combat engineer....doesn't mean I came home on leave and took out the neigbours car with C-4 so they too could enjoy the wonders of high explosives.

There is a CF-18 that used to come into CYHM a fair bit. I could appreciate the aircraft and the pilot without him putting my ass in danger thinking he was above the rules of general aviation so he could showboat....if he asked the tower....traffic was clear and or alerted....fill your boots

Long story short, just because the guy flies a military bird, doesn't give him free reign to break the rules we all have to abide by and put others in harms way. With all the new VLJ's about to come on-line and anyone thinking the rules don't apply to them doing 300-400kt fly-bys, GA would become a very dangerous place to be....none the less, I'm sorry to see they guys wings get clipped.

-=0=LIR=0=-

The One · Post by **The One** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:20 pm

I think there is a sizable portion of the population that thrive on being rats. It's unfortunate this poor pilot didn't have a way out of the predicament these losers created for him. Best wishes to him for the future.

LH · Post by LH » Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:31 pm

"No one was hurt ". If someone would have been caught in his "vortex" and crashed or lost momentary control it would have been "it's about time that the navy gets their hot-shot pilots under control" and his peers also would have been branded with the same shitty paint-brush by the PR. THAT folks, is why he was grounded. Unless he has a personnel file filled with similar infractions, he'll be back flying again. His grounding was done, not only as a punishment to him, but as the warning to any of his peers that might contemplate the same action. This one involved no injury to anyone or anything............but the next time it might be damn ugly.

He did it knowing that it was against regulations, so he took his chances and he LOST. Unless he's been living on another planet, he is aware that it was another member of his same service who also disobeyed a given instruction and was responsible for killing 4 soldiers of a friendly nation not long ago who were serving in the same area as his own country's soldiers. The USAF doesn't need that kind of PR at all and doesn't need it on the heels of a recent happening that started because one his peers also disobeyed a known order or instruction. I can see the news papers in Canada now if they get wind of this story. They'd be on the USAF again like a fat kid on a Smartie.

Lommer · Post by **Lommer** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:35 pm

I don't think that byline at the top of the article actually means he wasn't cleared for the flyby; this is unfortunately not clarified elsewhere. I highly doubt that he didn't have clearance, and if he did, I see nothing wrong at all with his actions. The guy is described as a very competent aviatior, and his flyby could hardly have been said to endager other peoples' lives. The analogy to a military engineer blowing up his neighbour's car at home is totally off the mark. This didn't endanger anyone, didn't damage any property, and the fact is that many people honestly enjoyed it. I can see how the Navy wouldn't like pilots risking aircraft like that, but we all know that the only reason disciplinary action was taken was because the public complained.

LostinRotation · Post by **LostinRotation** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:37 pm

The One wrote:I think there is a sizable portion of the population that thrive on being rats. It's unfortunate this poor pilot didn't have a way out of the predicament these losers created for him. Best wishes to him for the future.

You mind telling me how " these losers " created the problem for him ?
Are you serious ? Did you just say this was caused by other people...?

I guess the kid screaming along at 600kts, 90 feet off the ground had nothing to do with it.

I've seen a couple seagulls cause a disaster in Lake Ontario that would look like a kid with matches compared to this brainchilds 600kt fireball.

...I wonder what the reaction time would be between a 600kt fighter and a 90kt 6 place single piston, less than 1 mile apart ?

-=0=LIR=0=-

The One · Post by **The One** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:44 pm

LostinRotation, you should work for Transport Canada.

Pugster · Post by **Pugster** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:52 pm

Yes, the kid shouldn't have been doing it (technically).

Yes, it caused increased risk in area for the time he was doing the low & over.

Yes, you're lying if you aren't jealous that you haven't had the chance to do the same.

And for the record, speed limitations get broken ALL the time - maybe not by a factor of 3, but when was the last time that you guys slowed to 200 every time you were entering a control zone?

roundenginesmakemyday · Tue Oct 25, 2005 10:54 pm

I agree with some of the above......who does he think he is?? Rules do not apply to military?? Bullsh*t.

mellow_pilot · Post by **mellow_pilot** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 11:51 pm

I don't think the Navy canned him for breaking civillian regs...
I was told by a CF-18 driver they do circuits at over 300, that's what the book calls for as safe speeds, that's what you do. There are provisions for that in the CARs.

This guy broke Navy regs. That's probably what they broke him for. What he did was against Navy rules. I believe they call it "flat-hatting". They get kinda serious about that sort of thing, since they had a few CFIT and similar accidents. Most "self-respecting fighter pilots" as this guy calls them, probably have ripped around at low-level. But they didn't do it at an airport with people to report them. Remember folks, it ain't illegal till you get caught.

He was show-boating and got caught. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, hell i'm guilty of it too a couple times. But I didn't show-off in a jet infront of all sorts of people I didn't know and trust. That doesn't make it right, and looking back now, it was stupid.

Did it deserve a wing clipping, maybe, maybe not. But to claim you're getting a raw deal, when you know you're guilty is not taking responsibility for your actions. If you f-up, own up. (especially if you're busted anyway) Crying 'rat' is just a pansy-assed excuse to deflect critisism.

Nightshiftzombie · Post by **Nightshiftzombie** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 12:44 am

Number one phrase I don't want to hear in an airplane - "Want to see something cool?"

Nark · Post by **Nark** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 2:10 am

I'm not an 18 driver, yet. My office over looks an airfeild where theres 2 squadrons of F-18's. There is no way in hell they enter the pattern at 300 knots. 250 would be pushing it.

I work very close to our airfeild operations CO, close enough to know we get calls all the time complaining about the noise, speed etc... Even at a military base it never stops.

I highly doubt this "kid" will ever fly his 18 again. This kid is also probably pushing thirty, not a kid in my book.

hazatude · Post by **hazatude** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 3:05 am

YHM Tower usualy will request a low and over when the F18 guy comes in. It's the only airborne joy in my dreary day of watching big lumbering crap come in. The best of the best should push the limits so they stay on the cutting edge.

rigpiggy · Post by **rigpiggy** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 4:00 am

google buddy's telephone # and call him tell him what you think

Federally · Post by **Federally** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 8:21 am

I've seen F-18's, Hawks and even the Snowbirds (a pair of) do passes well over 200 kts, if the tower clears it what is the problem? I used to work at a field in SW Ontario and a F-18 driver used to come home on the odd weekend and would do some passes, etc to 'burn off fuel'.
----And what about when a city is hosting a Airshow and the aircraft show up one or two days early to practice, sorry but aerobatics and just under mach passes are not unusual. Actually the day they leave is usually quite the show in comparrison.

bumffs · Post by **bumffs** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 8:54 am

We are fortunate to live in a part of the world that when we see Warplanes overhead that the planes are on our side.

So what the big deal .
Give the guy his plane back,after all he is on our side.
Now if he had of straffed the town i could see someone getting upset ?
This is no way to treat Hero's

Driving Rain · Post by **Driving Rain** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:46 am

If you're worried about getting "ratted" out flying then I suggest you never ever fly a 215/415 for a living. Shit we can't make a move without
JQ public sticking their noses in. Bomb a bald rock island for practice that happened to have 1 shit hawk on it your busted for destroying bird habitat.

Circle a suitable scooping area in the inter-urban setting and complaints poor in about low flying. Fly over some livestock on final for a forest fire and they'll come after you for spooking the horses, goats chickens, turkeys or what ever. I fought one fire that was lapping at the guys siding and he complained the load tore off part of his rain gutter! We saved his house and what thanks do you get? He actually wanted me to pay damages

Last year we were fighting a fire in a remote area that had an outpost camp on it. There was a boat with 2 fishermen watching us. To get a closer look they came over and parked themselves under our final established scooping flight path. After we returned to base I get this call from some snotty lodge owner complaining that we scared the 2 occupants in the boat. One of the boat people had a private pilots licence and wanted to have us busted for endangering. I thanked him and gave him enforcements phone number and that's the last I heard of it. Most of the shit don't stick but it's never ending. One very stupid woman (from TO no doubt) phoned 911 and the Ministry to complain after she watched us scoop 4 or 5 loads that we must have been drunk because we were letting the plane touch the water! She had no idea that there was a thing called a water bomber.

mellow_pilot · Post by **mellow_pilot** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 11:41 am

I'm all for high speed passes that are authorized, but unless I miss read the aritcle this Navy guy wasn't. If you've got permission, go nuts. But if you break regs without covering your ass and get busted, it's your own bloddy fault, no matter how harmless it was.

ozone · Post by **ozone** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 12:21 pm

I think a lot of you guys are jealous. Put your feet in the pilots shoes. If I was an F-18 pilot and had the chance to do a pass like that I probably would.

Driving Rain · Post by **Driving Rain** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 12:54 pm

Or you could be this guy who wanted a free ride on a ticket because he flies a Nimrod in the RAF. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4379244.stm

SplitS · Post by **SplitS** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 3:28 pm

Showing the Grace and Skill of a Defender of Freedom I hope the people of his home town show some support and appreciation for the skills that keep them free....God bless him and the other defenders of our freedom

What a pile of crap....

Defenders of the oil barons, protectors of Haliburton's greed more like it...

Grace and skill of a defender of Freedom? Pleeeeeeeeeeeezzzzzzzzzzzze...

Thats the lamest post ever....