Convert Canadian ATPL to FAA

[Otto Pilot]

Hello all! First time posting so go easy on me. I'm looking for someone who has recently converted Canadian ATPL to FAA. I was hoping to find someone to help walk me through the process. My own research makes this task seem difficult to understand.

Cheers

[JohnnyHotRocks]

Apply to FAA for TC validation
Take CTP week long course (TSA approval required)
Write conversion exam
Get FAA medical
Get FCC radio license (online)
Make appointment at FAA office where you will present all your documents and info. Temp ATPL will be issued, then the permanent one arrives in the mail.

I haven’t done the CTP yet. Reluctant to pay for it I guess

[Whiskey25]

The process is a lot more cumbersome since they changed the regs in 2014. If you already have an ATPL the CTP course will seem more like a week of frustration and boredom.The course does absolutely nothing to prepare you for the exams, it is simply a new FAA requirement in order to get the licence.

That being said here's a step by step to getting your FAA ATP.

1. Apply for Verification of Authenticity of Foreign License
A. The verification process allows the FAA to communicate with TC to verify you hold a valid Canadian license.
Go to http://www.faa.gov/licenses%5Fcertifica ... ification/
From that website click on the hyperlink named “Verification of Authenticity of Foreign License, Rating, & Medical Certification” complete the form & fax to Oklahoma City as per their instructions. This verification process can take 45 – 90 days. For your planning keep in mind this verification letter itself is only valid for 6 months.

B. As for selecting the “FSDO location where you intend to make application” on the above faxed form, use http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/field_offices/fsdo/ to find a close FSDO.
I took the CTP course in Dallas and wrote the exam there as well, so I chose to use the Dallas FSDO. It's very hard to change the selected FSDO afterwards, so plan appropriately otherwise you may need to apply for a new verification form.

Whichever FSDO you select, you’ll be visiting this location IN PERSON when all documentation & test results are completed & in-hand. It is important you contact this exact office & give them a heads up of who are, what you are doing. Get an in-office contact & speak directly to the person you plan on doing the final paperwork with. If you aren't an American citizen, you will need to get authorization to visit, so contact them directly to initiate the clearance. I was told to allow 4-5 weeks for clearance, but I think it took about 3.

2. FAA Radio License:
A. Do this concurrently with the Verification. It is simply an Internet exercise (no tests) only titles, addresses & a payment.

I think the website is http://wireless.fcc.gov/uls/index.htm?job=home The website is a bit of a pain to navigate and figure out which licence to get. You should receive you license in the mail with in 2 to 3 weeks.

3. FAA ATP CTP Course (Approx $5000 USD)
I did the course in Dallas, 4 days of classroom and 3 sims. There's no way to get around this course... it's designed for a 1500hr pilot who has no jet or multi crew experience. It has to be done by everyone getting an FAA ATP.

Conversion Exam (60 questions (I think it used to be 40)):

A. Preparation – Sheppard Air is the way to go http://www.sheppardair.com/trainingaids.htm ($75) There is also a course given by Gleim, which covers the same material. I prefer Sheppard as it’s just a database of about 1500 Questions. They’re still honing it for TC-to-FAA conversions, but if you find even 1 question on your exam that isn’t in their database, you’ll get your money back, so it’s a no lose option.

B. Exam Invigilation. ($150) The FAA outsources the exams and you have to go to an authorized centre to write it. I'm writing the exam in Dallas, but they do have locations in Canada as well, not sure about Europe. See http://faa.psiexams.com/faa.html for their info. Schedule an appointment at the location you choose & bring your CTP Completion #, you can't write the exam without proof of finishing the course. Also bring good Gov’t ID (Passport and DL). No need to bring any calculators, whiz wheels, or anything like that... They’ll give you a stamped and verified copy of your exam result on the spot. Don’t lose it!

4. FAA Medical:
A. I did the medical before attending the CTP course because I'm writing the exam and going directly to the FSDO otherwise you can wait until later to get the FAA medical
http://www.faa.gov/pilots/amelocator/ to locate the nearest approved doctor.

5. FSDO Visit:
Finally, when all documentation is in hand:
FAA Medical
FAA Radio License
ATP Exam Results
Verification letter for TC license
Passport
TC License (ATPL)
If you bring your logbook you may be able to transfer other ratings
Don't forget the Visit Clearance Request


Good luck

Whiskey

[Whiskey25]

A little more information from when I converted my TC to FAA. There is no way around the CTP course; ANY pilot who wants an FAA ATP must take the course, including all US citizens. When I did the course, there were a number of new hire pilots for US Regional airlines who were completing the CTP prior to commencing training. When you finish the CTP course you are given a course completion certificate and completion number; In order to write the exam, you need this number.Thankfully it's only 60 questions for the conversion (TC - FAA only... no other countries)

After I wrote the exam I went to the FAA FSDO in Dallas where I took the course. The FSDO rep will review all the paperwork and forms and if everything is correct they will issue a Temporary ATP and send your application to Oklahoma for final approval, who will then mail the actual certificate to you (I believe the FSDO is the only one who can review your application since it's TC to FAA - I've heard that DPE can issue a Temp ATP, but only for US Citizens). Depending on the type of aircraft you are flying, you will require FAA sim training prior to actually using your licence. In my case, I had type ratings on my TC licence which transferred to my new FAA licence, but I needed to complete a re-current sim prior to flying the aircraft using my FAA privileges.

All my type ratings transferred over and are on my FAA ATP. In my situation, I was transferring to another aircraft for which my TC rating had lapsed (3 years since last flight). Under the FAA rules, all I required was a re-current sim whereas in Canada I needed to complete the full Initial course again.

If you read FAA Advisory Circular 61-135A, para 11, it states that prior to exercising the privileges of the FAA ATP you must meet the requirements of 61.56, 61.57 or 61.58. The 61.58 is a normal recurrent sim session under FAA which I completed to regain my currency. If I wanted to reactivate my 737 type rating I would need to do a recurrent on that as well. My understanding is that under FAA (unlike TC) the ratings never expire and all you need to do is get current again. I’m operating under FAA Part 91, which is very liberal with rules to maintain currency. I’m sure it’s more stringent for airline ops.

Also, It can take a while to get a FSDO appointment and you will have to submit a request to visit if you aren't a US citizen.Again, I was doing all this in Dallas and had to plan everything in advance so I scheduled my appointment for day after writing the exam.

[Chaxterium]

I've heard that DPE can issue a Temp ATP, but only for US Citizens

My case was a bit different as I already had an FAA CPL but after I did my FAA ATP ride the DPE gave me a temp ATP certificate right away and I'm not a US citizen. This was in 2013 though; before the CTP stuff came in. Not sure if that changes anything or not.

[priscillachen]

Does anyone know if it's a better idea to convert TC CPL to FAA or get the TC ATPL and then convert it to FAA ATPL? I am deciding if I should do the exams and get the TC ATPL first or just do it in the states?

[Texasdeathpencil]

Hoping for a bit of clarification, for those in the know:

Trying to do the licence conversion, and some schools are quoting me a price that includes doing an initial type rating/ATP check ride after the ATP-CPT course and written? Is this still necessary, or are TC ATPL holder exempted from this under the IPL agreement?

[Chaxterium]

Hoping for a bit of clarification, for those in the know:

Trying to do the licence conversion, and some schools are quoting me a price that includes doing an initial type rating/ATP check ride after the ATP-CPT course and written? Is this still necessary, or are TC ATPL holder exempted from this under the IPL agreement?

You don't need to do a type rating, but you will need to do an ATP checkride.

[Texasdeathpencil]

Hoping for a bit of clarification, for those in the know:

Trying to do the licence conversion, and some schools are quoting me a price that includes doing an initial type rating/ATP check ride after the ATP-CPT course and written? Is this still necessary, or are TC ATPL holder exempted from this under the IPL agreement?

You don't need to do a type rating, but you will need to do an ATP checkride.

Is that the case for Canadians who already hold an ATPL? The FAA AC dealing with this indicates "No additional practical test is required" under ATP Certificate ((1)(g)(1)). The regulations for this begin on page 9.

https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/med ... 1-135A.pdf

As far as I can tell, all that is needed is an FAA medical, ATP-CTP, and completion of the ACM exam.

[JHR]

Hoping for a bit of clarification, for those in the know:

Trying to do the licence conversion, and some schools are quoting me a price that includes doing an initial type rating/ATP check ride after the ATP-CPT course and written? Is this still necessary, or are TC ATPL holder exempted from this under the IPL agreement?

You don't need to do a type rating, but you will need to do an ATP checkride.

Did you?

[Chaxterium]

Hoping for a bit of clarification, for those in the know:

Trying to do the licence conversion, and some schools are quoting me a price that includes doing an initial type rating/ATP check ride after the ATP-CPT course and written? Is this still necessary, or are TC ATPL holder exempted from this under the IPL agreement?

You don't need to do a type rating, but you will need to do an ATP checkride.

Did you?

Yep. But I did my conversion in 2013 before all this ATP-CTP crap came into effect.

[Chaxterium]

Hoping for a bit of clarification, for those in the know:

Trying to do the licence conversion, and some schools are quoting me a price that includes doing an initial type rating/ATP check ride after the ATP-CPT course and written? Is this still necessary, or are TC ATPL holder exempted from this under the IPL agreement?

You don't need to do a type rating, but you will need to do an ATP checkride.

Is that the case for Canadians who already hold an ATPL? The FAA AC dealing with this indicates "No additional practical test is required" under ATP Certificate ((1)(g)(1)). The regulations for this begin on page 9.

https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/med ... 1-135A.pdf

As far as I can tell, all that is needed is an FAA medical, ATP-CTP, and completion of the ACM exam.

In that case I'm not entirely sure. I only had a TC CPL when I did the conversion. I'm pretty confident you need to do an ATP checkride regardless though but I'll defer to others with more knowledge on it.

[schnitzel2k3]

Doing the CPL is a cheaper process and gets your foot in the door. The ATP is what's typically required for any position down there that have two turbofans, even the small ones.

I figured for the NIW - having the CPL gives me a few points and I'll wait until an operator picks me up and covers the cost to upgrade my license (fairly common).

At this point being out of pocket several thousands of dollars without an ability to capitalize on the license is not tangible for me - plus the time required to do the course (a week of vacation doing some dogsh*t ATP/CTP course isn't my idea of fun).

Good luck to all of you guys and girls considering this process - I just finished my CPL/Instrument - and the total cost was about $875 USD between exams, study guide and pilot examiner costs.

Feel free to reach out if I can be of any assistance avcolleagues.

[JHR]

If you are converting a Canadian ATP to FAA a practical test is not required.
Here is a good write up on the process

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/skiesmag.co ... ate/%3famp

[schnitzel2k3]

If you are converting a Canadian ATP to FAA a practical test is not required.
Here is a good write up on the process

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/skiesmag.co ... ate/%3famp

The only difference J that I saw that we had discussed was the DPE versus the FSDO. Working out of Rochester - the office outsourced all document validation to a DPE (designated pilot examiner) who reviews all the documents and issues the temporary airmens certificate. I wrote my exams at the Rochester Air Center, which was the closest driveable PSI exam site to my home. PSI is who the FAA outsources all exam invigilating to. All in all I'd say it's a fairly straight forward and well managed approach. Took me a minute to figure it out, because the person who briefed me on the process flat out lied about their progress and what was required. Jamie's article is modestly out of date already as well due to changes caused by COVID.

Only a few DPEs out of the lot are experienced with converting foreign licenses. I think the charge is like 325, plus a bunch of specific type rating costs - 50 for the first and 25 thereafter. All in all it was 475 - which I thought was a bit rich, but it was more justifiable in my eyes over an ATP/CTP course right now.

Doing the CPL/IPC, you require a 61.56 flight to exercise the priviledges of the license, which is a logbook sign off from an flight school instructor. It's a 1 hour ground brief and 1 hour instrument practical flight - essentially a baby version of the ATP/CTP course. You can also do a 61.58 ride which is a PPC and it counts for the same. So just do the ride when you get a job offer under the 61.58 and save your Canadian pesos. The ride is not required to hold the license, just exercise the priviledges.

The process now should look like:

- IACRA foreign license validation letter (10-30 days if you fill it out correctly).
- Take a Gleim conversion or similar course - just the practice exam ones for either the CPL and Instrument (2 exams) or ATP is fine. It may seem easy, but they word these exams funny. The more questions you see ahead of time means a higher chance of seeing those exact ones on your test.
- Crank out medical (Class 1 for ATP or CPL, Class 2 for just CPL)
- Schedule exams and DPE for same day (its a long day but saves you a drive) - don't fail or live with egg on your face.
- DPE issues Temp Airmen Certficate.
- Full license arrives within 90 days.

Enjoy your new license, and if you've been succesful in pairing it with a sponsorship or NIW, enjoy your new non-flat pay, non balless, non-bonded, non-ACPA industry destroying - WAWCONs.

Cheers guys, happy hunting.

[nitram767]

Doing the CPL is a cheaper process and gets your foot in the door. The ATP is what's typically required for any position down there that have two turbofans, even the small ones.

I figured for the NIW - having the CPL gives me a few points and I'll wait until an operator picks me up and covers the cost to upgrade my license (fairly common).

At this point being out of pocket several thousands of dollars without an ability to capitalize on the license is not tangible for me - plus the time required to do the course (a week of vacation doing some dogsh*t ATP/CTP course isn't my idea of fun).

Good luck to all of you guys and girls considering this process - I just finished my CPL/Instrument - and the total cost was about $875 USD between exams, study guide and pilot examiner costs.

Feel free to reach out if I can be of any assistance avcolleagues.

That is a great idea. Was it just a written exam you needed to complete to convert your TC-CPL to FAA-CPL?

[schnitzel2k3]

Doing the CPL is a cheaper process and gets your foot in the door. The ATP is what's typically required for any position down there that have two turbofans, even the small ones.

I figured for the NIW - having the CPL gives me a few points and I'll wait until an operator picks me up and covers the cost to upgrade my license (fairly common).

At this point being out of pocket several thousands of dollars without an ability to capitalize on the license is not tangible for me - plus the time required to do the course (a week of vacation doing some dogsh*t ATP/CTP course isn't my idea of fun).

Good luck to all of you guys and girls considering this process - I just finished my CPL/Instrument - and the total cost was about $875 USD between exams, study guide and pilot examiner costs.

Feel free to reach out if I can be of any assistance avcolleagues.

That is a great idea. Was it just a written exam you needed to complete to convert your TC-CPL to FAA-CPL?

Yes, likely you want the instrument to carry over, so 2 exams. 40 questions each, plus medical and get your docs reviewed and signed off.

[sagabwoy]

Any advice for a current 705 FO to do this process?

[JHR]

I linked skymag in this thread. The article is very accurate. Easy process but takes time. Worst part is getting FAA to sign off or pay a DFE to do it. Just got mine in the mail nearly three months after the sign off

[Chaxterium]

I linked skymag in this thread.

FYI that link seems to be broken.

[Scuderia]

If you are converting a Canadian ATP to FAA a practical test is not required.
Here is a good write up on the process

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/skiesmag.co ... ate/%3famp

The only difference J that I saw that we had discussed was the DPE versus the FSDO. Working out of Rochester - the office outsourced all document validation to a DPE (designated pilot examiner) who reviews all the documents and issues the temporary airmens certificate.

Is this a new change or specific to the Rochester FSDO?

Seattle did everything in-house for me in 2020, did not have to pay a DPE to do my documents.

[negative_g]

No FSDOs are doing conversions right now you have to find a DPE that will do it for you. It's all FSDOs.

[schnitzel2k3]

If you are converting a Canadian ATP to FAA a practical test is not required.
Here is a good write up on the process

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/skiesmag.co ... ate/%3famp

The only difference J that I saw that we had discussed was the DPE versus the FSDO. Working out of Rochester - the office outsourced all document validation to a DPE (designated pilot examiner) who reviews all the documents and issues the temporary airmens certificate.

Is this a new change or specific to the Rochester FSDO?

Seattle did everything in-house for me in 2020, did not have to pay a DPE to do my documents.

Unsure, and it seemed to be business as usual mid winter 2022.

[JHR]

In June Rochester was still work from home due to covid. I managed to get an FAA signoff using zoom. DPE in Rochester wanted $700USD for ATP and all my types

[negative_g]

In June Rochester was still work from home due to covid. I managed to get an FAA signoff using zoom. DPE in Rochester wanted $700USD for ATP and all my types

That's absurd.

I paid $75 to do it over zoom with a dpe.