Brace for impact

[kiaszceski]

News shortly.

[pilot4life]

Can’t say i didn’t see this coming

[flyingpilot]

What does that mean for hiring?

[Tbayer2021]

For anyone wondering what it is. The Westjet MEC just released a communique stating that it is their intention to eliminate the Pilot Transfer Agreement, also known as "the one list". A vote will be brought to the WJ and Swoop pilots shortly so they can vote on whether to strike it down or keep it.

[mmm..bacon]

Sad, for those who'd staked their future on 'flow' to mainline..

OTOH, Jazz, Flair, Porter, and AC are hiring; the door to the USA has been cracked open with the recent Brookfield posting, and if WEN wants to keep and attract people, they'll probably have to boost pay somewhat..

[lownslow]

The Westjet MEC just released a communique stating that it is their intention to eliminate the Pilot Transfer Agreement

For what purpose?

[canadian_aviator_4]

What is the sentiment with Westjet and Swoop pilots? Do you think they will vote to strike it down or not.

[daedalusx]

What is the sentiment with Westjet and Swoop pilots? Do you think they will vote to strike it down or not.

Why would any of these guys vote against their own interests ?

Remember the old union adage "We don't negotiate for the unborn" ?

[digits_]

Can the WestJet pilot group destroy the PTA without management approval?

[Maritimer]

Can the WestJet pilot group destroy the PTA without management approval?

Yes. Any of the involved parties can.

[seriousflyer]

ALPA will be organizing a vote to cancel the PTA among the WestJet mainline and swoop pilots. The outcome will be the outcome. More to follow.

Eliminate isn't the right word to describe the situation, if the PTA gets cancelled it can be renegotiated.

[Apestogetherstrong]

Woah! Look at the pay increase!!!

[Aspiredtofly]

Woah! Look at the pay increase!!!

Looks genuine but it's edited and the real photo was for Horizen pilots and teamsters

[lownslow]

ALPA will be organizing a vote to cancel the PTA among the WestJet mainline and swoop pilots.

Again, why? Is the theory that severing a source of new hires will lead to a labour shortage that they can use in negotiations this fall? Or is it some other thing?

Seems odd to already be saying, “Gee I sure am glad we were all on one list so I didn’t get furloughed last year. Anyways, I’m back at work now so @#$! ‘em.”

[Bede]

Sad, for those who'd staked their future on 'flow' to mainline..

OTOH, Jazz, Flair, Porter, and AC are hiring; the door to the USA has been cracked open with the recent Brookfield posting, and if WEN wants to keep and attract people, they'll probably have to boost pay somewhat..

Existing Encore pilots are grandfathered in to the seniority list.

I heard a rumour (unsure how true) that the encore MEC support this.

[skyhighh]

Seems odd to already be saying, “Gee I sure am glad we were all on one list so I didn’t get furloughed last year. Anyways, I’m back at work now so @#$! ‘em.”

Exactly… Encore literally saved the day during the pandemic. Encore pilots lost their jobs or went right seat so that WJ pilots could take their place thanks to the PTA. Now that it’s over they decide to strike it and screw even more the guys and girls who already suffered the most for the past 2 years?
Let’s see how the vote turns out. I understand it’s all in preparation for the next negotiations but screwing your coworkers that way is self sabotage.

[.80@410]

Seems odd to already be saying, “Gee I sure am glad we were all on one list so I didn’t get furloughed last year. Anyways, I’m back at work now so @#$! ‘em.”

Exactly… Encore literally saved the day during the pandemic. Encore pilots lost their jobs or went right seat so that WJ pilots could take their place thanks to the PTA. Now that it’s over they decide to strike it and screw even more the guys and girls who already suffered the most for the past 2 years?
Let’s see how the vote turns out. I understand it’s all in preparation for the next negotiations but screwing your coworkers that way is self sabotage.

This wasn’t “screw WEN “ .. Those pilots still have a number on the one list .

This is : WJ no longer has a carrot to dangle . There is no reason to go to WEN anymore . They want pilots ? Better negotiate a better carrot . WEN should be thanking our MEC.

[truecolours]

Seems odd to already be saying, “Gee I sure am glad we were all on one list so I didn’t get furloughed last year. Anyways, I’m back at work now so @#$! ‘em.”

Exactly… Encore literally saved the day during the pandemic. Encore pilots lost their jobs or went right seat so that WJ pilots could take their place thanks to the PTA. Now that it’s over they decide to strike it and screw even more the guys and girls who already suffered the most for the past 2 years?
Let’s see how the vote turns out. I understand it’s all in preparation for the next negotiations but screwing your coworkers that way is self sabotage.

I don’t think this post will age well. Cancelling the PTA may end up helping Encore. Time will tell.

And like Bede mentioned - no one presently at encore is being screwed in any way.

[Canadaflyer46]

So you start at Encore tomorrow, and endure 8 or so years of shitty pay and conditions before you can flow. When you flow you start at the bottom again at year 1 pay. So what in gods name was the point in that whole exercise? Oh ok, so you’re closer to an upgrade at WJ because those 8 years count towards it. Well virtually all upgrades are gonna be at Swoop because that’s the direction the company wants to move in now. Might as well just apply to Flair/Lynx right away and not put up with all the years flying a Dash.
The PTA has become a small carrot on an incredibly long stick. Time to tear up the agreement and let the company decide how important attraction/retention actually is to them for the Encore group. No one is getting screwed if the ‘grandfather clause’ is legally enforceable.

[sarg]

ALPA will be organizing a vote to cancel the PTA among the WestJet mainline and swoop pilots.

Again, why? Is the theory that severing a source of new hires will lead to a labour shortage that they can use in negotiations this fall? Or is it some other thing?

Seems odd to already be saying, “Gee I sure am glad we were all on one list so I didn’t get furloughed last year. Anyways, I’m back at work now so @#$! ‘em.”

There are numerous problems around the PTA and the implementation during Covid. The PTA should never have been approved in the first place and didn't pass the first vote and most likely only passed the second because of an attached unrelated money issue.

The PTA and it's "one list" complicates any merger discussions and contrary to the company position the "reserved" seniority numbers are not likely to stand the challenges of the merger.

The company clearly showed that it really only intended for the PTA to be a one way street.

The Encore MEC did its job, ensuring that it looked after the needs of it's current members, but after doing so asking the WestJet MEC to look after the needs of future members while ignoring or harming current members is an unrealistic expectation by the Encore group.

[lownslow]

Existing Encore pilots are grandfathered in to the seniority list.

It’s subtle details like this that really take the fun out of the juiciest of rumours. Booooo!

[Canadaflyer46]

Existing Encore pilots are grandfathered in to the seniority list.

It’s subtle details like this that really take the fun out of the juiciest of rumours. Booooo!

The company has declared they’re committed to ‘grandfathering’, but I believe there’s some legal concerns on whether it would still stand up if the PTA is canceled/declared invalid. Especially as the PTA motion likely only passed the vote because there was money being attached to it.

[JBI]

Existing Encore pilots are grandfathered in to the seniority list.

It’s subtle details like this that really take the fun out of the juiciest of rumours. Booooo!

The company has declared they’re committed to ‘grandfathering’, but I believe there’s some legal concerns on whether it would still stand up if the PTA is canceled/declared invalid. Especially as the PTA motion likely only passed the vote because there was money being attached to it.

Nothing is black and white, but the concerns are more wishful
thinking from a small few hoping to gain seniority or settle a grudge than actual legal issues.

[Bede]

The company has declared they’re committed to ‘grandfathering’, but I believe there’s some legal concerns on whether it would still stand up if the PTA is canceled/declared invalid.

There is absolutely no way the PTA would ever be declared invalid de novo (meaning at inception) by an arbitrator. No one is getting a windfall.

Especially as the PTA motion likely only passed the vote because there was money being attached to it.

Which would strengthen the argument that the PTA is valid. There was consideration for the agreement from both parties.

[Apestogetherstrong]

Guys and gals not all things are bad. While other companies offer better WAWCON and some are offering retention bonuses, apparently Encore offered a free hot/cold beverage from Tim Hortons on Saturday. So at least they’re doing something! Really appreciate the kind gesture. Makes me want to work at a company where employees are valued. Can you name any other company that does that?