Can I count Solo XC flights apart from 300NM XC for my Commerical Solo Requirement?

[nishranth]

For the 30 hour of Commercial Solo Requirement, I still have about 15 hours left as I completed my flight test with relatively less number of solo flights.
Is it possible for me to utilize the remaining 15 hours of the Commercial Solo requirment purely for Solo XC ?

I have heard that you can only do circuits? Is that true?

[Bede]

For the 30 hour of Commercial Solo Requirement, I still have about 15 hours left as I completed my flight test with relatively less number of solo flights.
Is it possible for me to utilize the remaining 15 hours of the Commercial Solo requirment purely for Solo XC ?

Of course.

I have heard that you can only do circuits? Is that true?

No. Who told you such a silly thing? I hope you didn't just do circuits for your last 15 hours of solo time. I'm also a bit surprised that you're short solo hours. Since you need 100 hours of PIC for the CPL, getting 30 prior to the flight test (which can be done at 150 hours) should be about the easiest requirement to get. How many PIC hours do you have currently?

I don't want to be a jerk, and I'm always happy to answer questions, but these are really basic questions that, as an aspiring CPL pilot, you should be able to look up the CAR, interpret the CAR, and answer your own questions.

[nishranth]

For the 30 hour of Commercial Solo Requirement, I still have about 15 hours left as I completed my flight test with relatively less number of solo flights.
Is it possible for me to utilize the remaining 15 hours of the Commercial Solo requirment purely for Solo XC ?

Of course.

I have heard that you can only do circuits? Is that true?

No. Who told you such a silly thing? I hope you didn't just do circuits for your last 15 hours of solo time. I'm also a bit surprised that you're short solo hours. Since you need 100 hours of PIC for the CPL, getting 30 prior to the flight test (which can be done at 150 hours) should be about the easiest requirement to get. How many PIC hours do you have currently?

I don't want to be a jerk, and I'm always happy to answer questions, but these are really basic questions that, as an aspiring CPL pilot, you should be able to look up the CAR, interpret the CAR, and answer your own questions.

Hi Bede, Thank you for your response.I understand how basic this question is but it is because of my school which has made it very complex for us to understand. They only count 300nm,training flights for flight test, night rating requirements and circuits for 30hrs commercial solo requirement and they ask us to put any thing else which we do as Time Building flights.

[Bede]

I understand how basic this question is but it is because of my school which has made it very complex for us to understand. They only count 300nm,training flights for flight test, night rating requirements and circuits for 30hrs commercial solo requirement and they ask us to put any thing else which we do as Time Building flights.

That is odd.

[tsgarp]

For the 30 hour of Commercial Solo Requirement, I still have about 15 hours left as I completed my flight test with relatively less number of solo flights.
Is it possible for me to utilize the remaining 15 hours of the Commercial Solo requirment purely for Solo XC ?

I have heard that you can only do circuits? Is that true?

The applicable regulation is here: https://tc.canada.ca/en/corporate-serv ... ars#421_30

(4) Experience

(a) An applicant for a commercial pilot licence — aeroplane shall
(amended 2006/12/14)
(i) have completed, subject to paragraph (b), a minimum of 200 hours flight time in aeroplanes, of which a minimum of 100 hours shall be pilot-in-command time including 20 hours cross-country pilot-in-command flight time, and
(amended 2006/12/14)
(ii) following the issuance of a private pilot licence — aeroplane by Canada or another contracting state, have completed 65 hours of commercial pilot flight training in aeroplanes consisting of a minimum of:
(amended 2006/12/14)
(A) 35 hours dual instruction flight time, under the direction and supervision of the holder of a Flight Instructor Rating — Aeroplane, including:
(amended 2006/12/14)
(I) 5 hours night, including a minimum of 2 hours of cross-country flight time;
(amended 2006/12/14)
(II) 5 hours cross-country, which may include the cross-country experience stated in subclause (I); and
(amended 2006/12/14)
(III) 20 hours of instrument flight time in addition to the experience stated in subclauses (I) and (II). A maximum 10 hours of the 20 hours may be conducted on an approved aeroplane simulator or synthetic flight training device.
(amended 2006/12/14)
(B) 30 hours solo flight time including:
(amended 2006/12/14)
(I) 25 hours solo flight time emphasizing the improvement of general flying skills of the applicant which shall include a cross-country flight to a point of a minimum of 300 nautical mile radius from the point of departure and shall include a minimum of 3 landings at points other than that of departure; and
(amended 2006/12/14)
(II) 5 hours solo flight time by night during which a minimum of 10 takeoffs, circuits and landings were completed.
(amended 2006/12/14)
(b) An applicant who is a graduate from an approved integrated course shall have completed the applicable experience requirements in section 426.75 of the Canadian Aviation Regulations.
(amended 2006/12/14)

So, after you have your PPL, you need 30 hours of solo dedicated to general skills improvement. The intention is that you use those hours to polish your skills in preparation for the flight test. I know some people just go out and burn them all as XC, but you aren’t doing yourself any favours if you do that. Use them to go out and really sharpen your aircraft handling; steep turns, slow flight (climbs, descents and turns in slow flight), advanced stalls (provided you’ve had good dual instruction on them). Precision landings and performance takeoffs.

[tsgarp]

I understand how basic this question is but it is because of my school which has made it very complex for us to understand. They only count 300nm,training flights for flight test, night rating requirements and circuits for 30hrs commercial solo requirement and they ask us to put any thing else which we do as Time Building flights.

Your school is wrong. In accordance with the reg I posted earlier, any solo flight where you practice general aircraft handling after your PPL counts towards your 30hrs. Usually the sticky point is “solo” vs “pilot in command”. Solo is where you are the only person on the aircraft whereas PIC means you could have another person with you, but you signed for the aircraft. The strictest interpretation of the reg is that you can’t count anything other than solo time towards the 30 hrs solo. Looser interpretations of the regulation allow you to count PIC time for the 30 hrs. When you consider that the intent of the regulation is that you practice aircraft handling for building proficiency the later interpretation makes more sense.

[NotDirty!]

Just find a nice quiet airport where you can get some nice tight circuits, and bang off 300 smash and goes! Should only take a day or so!!

[khedrei]

Open your logbook and copy any flights where you were PIC and worked on your skills into your PTR. It helps to know what you did each flight so I put a small note in my logbook. I can generally remember if I have a note.

If they have an issue with that, take your PTR (its your property) and find another school.

[photofly]

You don't need to find another school; you need only find another Authorized Person to sign off your CPL application at the time you meet the requirements. The authorized person acts as a delegate of the Minister, not as a representative of the school and the school's policies must play no part whatsoever in the AP's determination that you meet or don't meet the requirements for a CPL.

If you're willing to do some good for the flight training industry, find out who the school's AP is (usually the CFI) and send an email to the TC licensing office in your region asking that that person be reminded of how correctly to interpret the CPL requirements.

[Fly0nTheWall]

I understand how basic this question is but it is because of my school which has made it very complex for us to understand. They only count 300nm,training flights for flight test, night rating requirements and circuits for 30hrs commercial solo requirement and they ask us to put any thing else which we do as Time Building flights.

Your school is wrong. In accordance with the reg I posted earlier, any solo flight where you practice general aircraft handling after your PPL counts towards your 30hrs.

In my opinion this isn't exactly true. Not all solo flight time counts towards the 30h of Solo Flight Time being discussed (though it would count towards the 100h PIC). Obviously I'm just interpreting the CARs like everyone else, but CAR 421.30(4)(ii) states it has to be Commercial Pilot Flight Training. Furthermore, CAR 405.31 states that:

"405.31 No person shall commence a training flight unless the trainee has received from the flight instructor
(a) a pre-flight briefing; and
(b) where new flight exercises are to be conducted during the flight, preparatory ground instruction."

And if you reallllllly want to dig into the weeds a little more, CAR 425.21 discusses the qualifications of said flight instructor mentioned in 405.31

So for any solo flight time to count towards the 30h Solo Flight Time requirement in CAR 421.30(ii)(B) and be written into the PTR, there has to be (at a minimum) a pre-flight briefing from a qualified flight instructor.

[Big Pistons Forever]

Like for every flight, flights for the solo skill building part of the CPL course should be planned. The best way is to, at the beginning, sit down with your instructor and establish objectives. These should be a mixture of cross country flights to different airports, air work in the practice area and circuit practice. Treat every flight like it was a commercial flight with a W & B calculation fuel log, passenger brief etc.

[photofly]

In my opinion this isn't exactly true. Not all solo flight time counts towards the 30h of Solo Flight Time being discussed (though it would count towards the 100h PIC). Obviously I'm just interpreting the CARs like everyone else, but CAR 421.30(4)(ii) states it has to be Commercial Pilot Flight Training. Furthermore, CAR 405.31 states that:

"405.31 No person shall commence a training flight unless the trainee has received from the flight instructor
(a) a pre-flight briefing; and
(b) where new flight exercises are to be conducted during the flight, preparatory ground instruction."

And if you reallllllly want to dig into the weeds a little more, CAR 425.21 discusses the qualifications of said flight instructor mentioned in 405.31

So for any solo flight time to count towards the 30h Solo Flight Time requirement in CAR 421.30(ii)(B) and be written into the PTR, there has to be (at a minimum) a pre-flight briefing from a qualified flight instructor.

It might seem "obvious" that all flights counted towards the 30h Solo Flight Time (part of the 65 hours commercial pilot flight training) are all "training flights" for the purposes of 405.31, but it's at least arguable that they aren't.

By way of example, the cross-country requirement is part of the same paragraph. Many people have nominated as their 300nm cross country trips that they made absent the attentions of a flight instructor; I'm not aware this has caused any issues.

Alternatively, while the student should have received a pre-flight briefing, the intention of the regulation is to allow an enforcement action against the instructor if the student had not received such a briefing. But there is nothing to suggest it would invalidate the flight as a "training flight" if they had not. In other words, all training flights must have a preflight briefing, but that does not mean that a flight without a briefing cannot be a training flight.

Going further, you could argue that the existence of 405.31 means that it must be possible to have a training flight without a pre-flight briefing; for if it was impossible for such a flight to exist, there would be no circumstance under which 405.31(a) could be meaningful. If the intention was as you state then it would be sufficient for a standard to say that only a flight with a pre-flight briefing counted as a training flight and then there would be no purpose for 405.31(a).

[Fly0nTheWall]

Hmm, interesting I never thought of it that way before. But ya that actually makes a lot of sense. Clearly I need to work on my jurisprudence XD Thanks for the insight and education