Why do pilots keep taking concessions?

[FelixGustof]

So I see another deal with concessions from pilots that Fly the Flag:

- decrease of flow to 30%

- increase of max credits for remainder of 2023 & all of 2024. Work extra days

- contract instructors

- loss of CRJ 200s

I'm just thankful I'm pursuing another career instead of aviation

Yikes!!

[crashpadcommute]

Canuckistan...

Can't blame you...no one is even entering the profession anymore

[JustaCanadian]

As if paying thousands for training, and low pay is not enough. Icing on the cake was watching crew members confined to hotel rooms and navigating some very restrictive policies in 2020-2022. Pilots took a huge hit, reducing pay and disrupting quality of life. Meanwhile government workers WFH, save on gas, never missed a pay cheque. Trades are in such high demand if you are good at your job you will never miss a days work and the pay is rewarding.

Why the heck would anyone aspire to work in this industry?

[TalkingPie]

Canuckistan...

Can't blame you...no one is even entering the profession anymore

As much as it would be to my and my cohort's advantage if it were the case, I don't think there was really an appreciable decline in new pilots in the pipeline. For the past 4+ years I've been around flight schools while slowly chipping away at my hours, and if anything the schools have only gotten busier, including through the pandemic. Of course, while aviation was shut down you had 2,000 hour guys with nowhere to go but to instruct circuits in Cessnas, while today there are viable jobs for 250 hour wonders, putting pressure on flight schools to retain instructors. That has changed. But student enrollment has been robust throughout.

What I think actually happened from 2020-2022 is that Transport Canada effectively shut down its licensing offices. Of course you won't have new licenses issued if TC isn't issuing licenses, but the pilots are there. It wouldn't surprise me at all if 2023 figures show higher than average licenses issued as the backlog gets cleared out.

In my observation, new Air Canada pilots are less experienced than in at least 12 years, definitely. "Less experienced" amounts to 2,000 hour, ATPL-rated new-hire FOs and RPs, though. Unless I'm mistaken, legally they could be hiring 250 hour FOs, and we're a very long way from that. From what I understand, for the most part even Jazz isn't quite that desperate (yet).

[CPU2000]

Latest batch had a recently "upgraded" PC12 FO who was a FO on a Caravan

AC's training program is not designed for PC12 FOs

The experience levels are a serious concern but they seem happy recklessly destroying their network by not keeping up with the times with a serious industry pilot shortage

[jesse99]

From my perspective, Pilots might agree to concessions for various factors such as Industry Uncertainty, Cost-Cutting Measures, Avoiding Job Losses, Market Pressure, etc. crossover grid

[crashpadcommute]

From my perspective, Pilots might agree to concessions for various factors such as Industry Uncertainty, Cost-Cutting Measures, Avoiding Job Losses, Market Pressure, etc. crossover grid

20 yrs of it!

Canadian aviation is no stranger to it

Always an excuse for a concession

Key is having the resolve to say "No"

[Dias]

AC's training program is not designed for PC12 FOs

This is a bigger issue than the company knows. Revamping and significantly extending the entire training program is going to cost way more than just paying more for experienced pilots.

[Inverted2]

Latest batch had a recently "upgraded" PC12 FO who was a FO on a Caravan

AC's training program is not designed for PC12 FOs

The experience levels are a serious concern but they seem happy recklessly destroying their network by not keeping up with the times with a serious industry pilot shortage

Are you talking AC or Jazz? AC can’t seriously be hiring PC12 FO now? On the other hand a PC12 FO would be considered a high time score for Jazz these days!

[Mobius_09]

Latest batch had a recently "upgraded" PC12 FO who was a FO on a Caravan

AC's training program is not designed for PC12 FOs

The experience levels are a serious concern but they seem happy recklessly destroying their network by not keeping up with the times with a serious industry pilot shortage

Are you talking AC or Jazz? AC can’t seriously be hiring PC12 FO now? On the other hand a PC12 FO would be considered a high time score for Jazz these days!

I’ve heard of PC12 pilots ending up at Transat nowadays so I wouldn’t be surprised if the same is happening at AC

[smooth]

Yes he's talking about AC, we do have couple 703/704 ATR FO/Dash FO and recently upgraded to PC12 CA before they join AC

Latest batch had a recently "upgraded" PC12 FO who was a FO on a Caravan

AC's training program is not designed for PC12 FOs

The experience levels are a serious concern but they seem happy recklessly destroying their network by not keeping up with the times with a serious industry pilot shortage

Are you talking AC or Jazz? AC can’t seriously be hiring PC12 FO now? On the other hand a PC12 FO would be considered a high time score for Jazz these days!

[flyingcanuck]

Latest batch had a recently "upgraded" PC12 FO who was a FO on a Caravan

AC's training program is not designed for PC12 FOs

The experience levels are a serious concern but they seem happy recklessly destroying their network by not keeping up with the times with a serious industry pilot shortage

Are you talking AC or Jazz? AC can’t seriously be hiring PC12 FO now? On the other hand a PC12 FO would be considered a high time score for Jazz these days!

it is interesting that Jazz does a sim eval and may turn down someone from a PC12 operation but AC will take them with no evaluation. Not claiming the sim eval is the most accurate tool but still, AC claims they have no issue hiring, but they are sure running out of candidates they want