At least the Flight Attendants know what they are worth

[A310Heavy]

Air Transat Flight Attendants rejected their TA with a
98% "No" vote

I guess they aren't buying the management Kool-aid like us Transat pilots...

Looks like the back end leads this airline when it comes to knowing your worth

https://www.reuters.com/business/aerosp ... 2024-01-02/

[ShillBill]

Oh the $30k Bond Supportive Company Shills aren't going to like this one bit

Management is doing their best and we need to help out the company!!

[apetogetherstrong]

Yeah, those shills may increase the bond to $60k. I wouldn’t be surprised if the shills try to shill the idea of bonds to other companies management to undermine and lower our profession. I say we need to ban and blacklist these shills as pilots!

NO MORE SHILLS. HOLD THE LINE!

[Babar350]

https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-paci ... 024-01-02/

Now they'll have the public with them... People won't be mad at them if they go on strike.

[aeronauticaldisaster]

New Air Transat pilots will be cheaper than the FAs

But will been bonded like indentured servants

[TFTMB heavy]

Yeah, those shills may increase the bond to $60k. I wouldn’t be surprised if the shills try to shill the idea of bonds to other companies management to undermine and lower our profession. I say we need to ban and blacklist these shills as pilots!

NO MORE SHILLS. HOLD THE LINE!

They need to adjust the bond for inflation.

[Me262]

New Air Transat pilots will be cheaper than the FAs

But will been bonded like indentured servants

Why hire FA's when you can hire Co-pilots with the promise of the right seat after a few years. It's just like working for buffalo Joe on the ramp for a promise at the stick!

[digits_]

New Air Transat pilots will be cheaper than the FAs

But will been bonded like indentured servants

Why hire FA's when you can hire Co-pilots with the promise of the right seat after a few years. It's just like working for buffalo Joe on the ramp for a promise at the stick!

How else would they learn the operation

[RippleRock]

Does anyone know what going on with the FA's?

They apparently voted down a deal last week to the tune of 98%, now today they are reporting a deal has been reached and will be ratified.

How did the go from 98% NO, to a deal in a week? This seems very odd.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/travel/news/a ... 0a1&ei=123

[Tbayer2021]

Does anyone know what going on with the FA's?

They apparently voted down a deal last week to the tune of 98%, now today they are reporting a deal has been reached and will be ratified.

How did the go from 98% NO, to a deal in a week? This seems very odd.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/travel/news/a ... 0a1&ei=123

Where do you see that the deal will be ratified? The article you posted only mentions that a new TA has been achieved and IF ratified, will be in place for 5 years. The flight attendants still need to vote on the new TA.

[RippleRock]

Does anyone know what going on with the FA's?

They apparently voted down a deal last week to the tune of 98%, now today they are reporting a deal has been reached and will be ratified.

How did the go from 98% NO, to a deal in a week? This seems very odd.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/travel/news/a ... 0a1&ei=123

Where do you see that the deal will be ratified? The article you posted only mentions that a new TA has been achieved and IF ratified, will be in place for 5 years. The flight attendants still need to vote on the new TA.

I know it hasn't been ratified yet.

My question is, how do you go from a "98% rejection" to a solution in a week? How does a union feel so confident that the deal has been "fixed" that they present the "new solution" so quickly? Either they have had massive movement on concessions, or the union is detached and is offering close to the same thing. Which is it?

[Tbayer2021]

Does anyone know what going on with the FA's?

They apparently voted down a deal last week to the tune of 98%, now today they are reporting a deal has been reached and will be ratified.

How did the go from 98% NO, to a deal in a week? This seems very odd.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/travel/news/a ... 0a1&ei=123

Where do you see that the deal will be ratified? The article you posted only mentions that a new TA has been achieved and IF ratified, will be in place for 5 years. The flight attendants still need to vote on the new TA.

I know it hasn't been ratified yet.

My question is, how do you go from a "98% rejection" to a solution in a week? How does a union feel so confident that the deal has been "fixed" that they present the "new solution" so quickly? Either they have had massive movement on concessions, or the union is detached and is offering close to the same thing. Which is it?

I guess we'll just have to wait and see wheb details come out. I also find it curious that a new TA has been reached in such a short time. Maybe the company already had a substantially better offer ready to go and we're hoping the FAs would agree to the first one? One thing is certain, transat cannot afford a strike.

[727driver]

A possibility is that the threat of a looming flight attendant strike during the busy winter southern holiday season in the media is having an impact on future bookings as people may be exercising other options in order to hedge their bets in case of a strike? Timing = leverage in negotiations. When executed properly it can yield great results quickly. It does seem there is some strong motivation to resolve the impass quickly for an agreement to be achieved so soon after a failed ratification vote. .

[RippleRock]

A possibility is that the threat of a looming flight attendant strike during the busy winter southern holiday season in the media is having an impact on future bookings as people may be exercising other options in order to hedge their bets in case of a strike? Timing = leverage in negotiations. When executed properly it can yield great results quickly. It does seem there is some strong motivation to resolve the impass quickly for an agreement to be achieved so soon after a failed ratification vote. .

Just a guess, but it may have to do with "rising tides" in the industry, an eager travelling public and a 98% "go f-yourself play".

Upper management might have thought it not worth fighting a battle that would ultimately be lost to some degree. Give them what they want and just be done with it.

Good guess likely that the first TA might have been a "hail Mary" first down play that widely missed the receiver.



FWIW, never underestimate a strong NO vote in this climate. If they know you're serious, beyond any doubt, less chance you'll get dicked around. ARE you listening pilots??? YES ALL OF YOU.

[Tbayer2021]

A possibility is that the threat of a looming flight attendant strike during the busy winter southern holiday season in the media is having an impact on future bookings as people may be exercising other options in order to hedge their bets in case of a strike? Timing = leverage in negotiations. When executed properly it can yield great results quickly. It does seem there is some strong motivation to resolve the impass quickly for an agreement to be achieved so soon after a failed ratification vote. .

Just a guess, but it may have to do with "rising tides" in the industry, an eager travelling public and a 98% "go f-yourself play".

Upper management might have thought it not worth fighting a battle that would ultimately be lost to some degree. Give them what they want and just be done with it.

Good guess likely that the first TA might have been a "hail Mary" first down play that widely missed the receiver.



FWIW, never underestimate a strong NO vote in this climate. If they know you're serious, beyond any doubt, less chance you'll get dicked around. ARE you listening pilots??? YES ALL OF YOU.

A flight attendant friend at TS showed me the new offer. It is substantially better than what they were initially offered. Big take aways are 27% increase over 5 years (back dated to late 2022 when their contract expired) over the 18% which was the initial offer. This salary increase supposedly makes them the best paid FA's in the country, not sure of the validity of that since I don't know AC/WJ FA pay. First year is $38.09/h and 10th year is $68.23/h. Flight director starts at $53.96/h and tops out at $84.13/h.

Other monetary gains include substantial increases in perdiem; $7.62/h in Europe, $6.73/h South and $5.23/h Canada. Gains in draft pay with a $250 premium on top of their hourly pay.

Multiple other gains, but there seems to be a sticking point with the company wanting to not give them crew rest seats on flights under 7 hours and 1 FA being removed from the 330. My friend tells me the group recognizes its a better offer, but isn't exactly thrilled with it. Considering the strong "NO" vote on the first TA, I could see this being turned down as well.

[TalkingPie]

A possibility is that the threat of a looming flight attendant strike during the busy winter southern holiday season in the media is having an impact on future bookings as people may be exercising other options in order to hedge their bets in case of a strike? Timing = leverage in negotiations. When executed properly it can yield great results quickly. It does seem there is some strong motivation to resolve the impass quickly for an agreement to be achieved so soon after a failed ratification vote. .

Just a guess, but it may have to do with "rising tides" in the industry, an eager travelling public and a 98% "go f-yourself play".

Upper management might have thought it not worth fighting a battle that would ultimately be lost to some degree. Give them what they want and just be done with it.

Good guess likely that the first TA might have been a "hail Mary" first down play that widely missed the receiver.



FWIW, never underestimate a strong NO vote in this climate. If they know you're serious, beyond any doubt, less chance you'll get dicked around. ARE you listening pilots??? YES ALL OF YOU.

A flight attendant friend at TS showed me the new offer. It is substantially better than what they were initially offered. Big take aways are 27% increase over 5 years (back dated to late 2022 when their contract expired) over the 18% which was the initial offer. This salary increase supposedly makes them the best paid FA's in the country, not sure of the validity of that since I don't know AC/WJ FA pay. First year is $38.09/h and 10th year is $68.23/h. Flight director starts at $53.96/h and tops out at $84.13/h.

Other monetary gains include substantial increases in perdiem; $7.62/h in Europe, $6.73/h South and $5.23/h Canada. Gains in draft pay with a $250 premium on top of their hourly pay.

Multiple other gains, but there seems to be a sticking point with the company wanting to not give them crew rest seats on flights under 7 hours and 1 FA being removed from the 330. My friend tells me the group recognizes its a better offer, but isn't exactly thrilled with it. Considering the strong "NO" vote on the first TA, I could see this being turned down as well.

As a point of comparison, the current, widely despised 10 year contract which expires in 2025, at AC has FAs starting at $29.43, 10th year $61.83, service director starting at $62.95 and maxing on widebody at $85.30. These rates go up 2% in April.

So the claim that FAs would be paid materially better than at AC does hold some water, although again we're comparing with a 9 year old contract and FAs that are also angry for improved WAWCON. SDs are paid better from bottom to top at AC as it stands.

[Tbayer2021]

Just a guess, but it may have to do with "rising tides" in the industry, an eager travelling public and a 98% "go f-yourself play".

Upper management might have thought it not worth fighting a battle that would ultimately be lost to some degree. Give them what they want and just be done with it.

Good guess likely that the first TA might have been a "hail Mary" first down play that widely missed the receiver.



FWIW, never underestimate a strong NO vote in this climate. If they know you're serious, beyond any doubt, less chance you'll get dicked around. ARE you listening pilots??? YES ALL OF YOU.

A flight attendant friend at TS showed me the new offer. It is substantially better than what they were initially offered. Big take aways are 27% increase over 5 years (back dated to late 2022 when their contract expired) over the 18% which was the initial offer. This salary increase supposedly makes them the best paid FA's in the country, not sure of the validity of that since I don't know AC/WJ FA pay. First year is $38.09/h and 10th year is $68.23/h. Flight director starts at $53.96/h and tops out at $84.13/h.

Other monetary gains include substantial increases in perdiem; $7.62/h in Europe, $6.73/h South and $5.23/h Canada. Gains in draft pay with a $250 premium on top of their hourly pay.

Multiple other gains, but there seems to be a sticking point with the company wanting to not give them crew rest seats on flights under 7 hours and 1 FA being removed from the 330. My friend tells me the group recognizes its a better offer, but isn't exactly thrilled with it. Considering the strong "NO" vote on the first TA, I could see this being turned down as well.

As a point of comparison, the current, widely despised 10 year contract which expires in 2025, at AC has FAs starting at $29.43, 10th year $61.83, service director starting at $62.95 and maxing on widebody at $85.30. These rates go up 2% in April.

So the claim that FAs would be paid materially better than at AC does hold some water, although again we're comparing with a 9 year old contract and FAs that are also angry for improved WAWCON. SDs are paid better from bottom to top at AC as it stands.

Sounds like TS management may be gunning for the junior vote. I wonder what the demographic is like on the FA side. Also, does SD pay vary per aircraft or narrow vs wide body at AC?

[TalkingPie]

Sounds like TS management may be gunning for the junior vote. I wonder what the demographic is like on the FA side. Also, does SD pay vary per aircraft or narrow vs wide body at AC?

If the demographics at TS are anything like they are at AC (where supposedly the majority have 5 years or less seniority), they're wise to focus on the juniors. Additionally, at least at AC, the current starting pay is less than someone working a 40 hour per week job at minimum wage. Judging by the fact that AC has removed their requirement for a high school diploma, I'd guess that they've begun to struggle to hire and retain applicants.

At AC the SD pay rate is dependent on the aircraft. Top pay narrow body is currently $71.60, with the exception of the A321, where it's $74.29. Wide body ranges from $82.25 to $85.30, depending on which type and whether one or two SDs are working the flight.

[Me262]

So how does the FA payscales work? Are they similar to Pilots? (flight hours only with a MMG)? Unlike a pilot which timer starts at engine startup and shutdown, FA's timer starts at door closing and opening? Starting with <$30/flight hr seems poverty pay and can be below min wage for actual duty hours.

Lastly, why would any FA's work for regionals? There are no minimum hrs and licences like pilots required correct? So for example, why would a FA choose to work for Jazz instead of AC straight?

[CaptDukeNukem]

So how does the FA payscales work? Are they similar to Pilots? (flight hours only with a MMG)? Unlike a pilot which timer starts at engine startup and shutdown, FA's timer starts at door closing and opening? Starting with <$30/flight hr seems poverty pay and can be below min wage for actual duty hours.

Lastly, why would any FA's work for regionals? There are no minimum hrs and licences like pilots required correct? So for example, why would a FA choose to work for Jazz instead of AC straight?

First of all: most pilots are paid block time. That means brakes off, doors closed until brakes on, door open. I believe you work at jazz so that’s how it would be there. So yes they are paid the same way as pilots.

Most FA contracts have a MMG. A lot of them enjoy the travel perks and seem to make good use of it. I know for some it can be a transient job to travel when you’re young. For others, it can be a career.

Some airlines, namely AC, requires FAs to know two languages and well if you only know English, then maybe jazz is the other option. Possibly also a location thing.

Just like us, there’s a lot of variance in contracts, not only in terms of pay and I have no idea how they choose where to work, but I’m gonna go with they know friends who work there, and it’s good enough.