Need contract PA31-350 single pilot ASAP

turbo-prop · Post by **turbo-prop** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:08 pm

You guys shouldn't jump down his throat. 150 a day cash is: 7 days=1050 , a month 4200$ I can't see to many people making 50000 cash a year to fly a navajo. And for you guys that are going to jump down my throat for posting this, your all full of shit that you wouldn't take $4200 cash for flying. He didn't say anything about breaking minimums. Hes giving you a scenario you would find in any northern community in WINTER. You think Borek says its snowing outside all you guys stay home. Get a life this winter in Canada.

Doc · Post by **Doc** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:30 pm

I've got a quiet week comming up.....I could spend an all expence paid week in Red Gultch.....but my 'ho PPC lapsed about the time of the "big bang"! And you are correct....a buck and a half a day, and you're out of pocket nada would work for many.......with Christmass around the corner and all.....I mean, um, er, holiday right around the corner!!
And it is a tough road to hoe, or 'ho, or whatever...I thought of doing the same thing he is a few years back.....using Cherokee 6's.....no PPC's, and a lot less overhead? Hey, there's a thought? Trade in a 'ho on a "6"? You could really use 250 hour guys....hell, you could use 150 hour guys and really create a stepping stone? Start off in the "6" and move up to the 'ho.....give you a pretty good chance to really know you guys? Of course, that'd put an end to IFR with pax...but how many days would you really loose? Not to mention the cash in your jeans for the difference?

skyhigh · Post by **skyhigh** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:31 pm

Ya except your calculations are severly flawed because we don't work 30 straight days. Won't even come close to $4200 like you think.

turbo-prop · Post by **turbo-prop** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:38 pm

Ok say you worked 20 days a month $3000 cash is still pretty good for flying a ho. That would still be $36000 a year. Now tell me how many operators pay better then that. Sure there will be some higher but i bet you there are a lot that are lower.

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:41 pm

Well if he is paying $150.00 per day cash with no receipts or paper trail period that does put a slightly different slant on it.

However if you are worknig in the underground economy you still need more than that to justify it.

Anonymous1 · Post by **Anonymous1** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 6:01 pm

$150 day cash whether you fly or not. No breaking minimums but with enough sense not to depart if things look like you might miss (but if you misjudge, then no worries). Just do the job you are aksed to do, make the customers happy and bring the plane home in one piece and on schedule. Planes are well maintained, you don't fly over gross and you'll have lots of support. Why all the whining? Fast Air does not even pay close to this for a single pilot Captain. How much do any of you clear for a day of flying a Navajo? Try Borek....flying out of Resolute with 40kts across the runways with 24 hour darkness at -35C for about the same rate after tax. Some of you guys sound so pathetic I think you only complain because you have nothing better to do but criticize someone else's efforts. What have any of you ever accomplished in your life if you think this pay is such a joke? Have you ever hired a pilot yourself to fly for your company? If not, then please just shut your hole. Its only an offer to help out and it would be misleading to post as a full time position as the contract is not for a firm time period yet. Most operators would feed you a line and then in a month then tell you you're no longer needed. I try and be honest and you guys just want to piss me off. What's the deal?

BusDriver · Post by **BusDriver** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 6:08 pm

BA-ZING!!!!

trey kule · Post by **trey kule** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 6:08 pm

Anoynomous wrote:
I try and be honest and you guys just want to piss me off. What's the deal?

You answered your own question.....

BusDriver · Post by **BusDriver** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 6:11 pm

Cue: Flyinhigh.......you must be out flying dude. Cause I thought for sure you would be on this one, like a fat kid on smarties.

low n over · Post by **low n over** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 7:00 pm

I'm a single pilot Ho Capt with 3300tt and 2000 multi pic, and I make

$2400 month base

plus $30hr in the air

plus $35day per diem

plus 1.7hr mins flight pay per day weather I turn a blade or not.

20 days on 10 days OFF. If I agree to work during a day off chock on $120 more per day.

Great medical, dental, insurance ect.

low n over · Post by **low n over** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 7:07 pm

its a sweet pu$$y gig yeah, but theres lots of Ho's especialy survey ones in alberta with guys making the same or more. Even dynamic pays guys with my time $220 + per day.

One things for sure, my employer is gonna have me around for awhile.

Out of Control · Post by **Out of Control** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 11:47 pm

I work one month on and one month off flying single pilot IFR on a Ho. I get 280 per day plus a 40 bucka per day for perdium. 150 sounds pretty low to me. My other contracts run around 220ish per day. If your in a bind give me a shout and I would be glad to help you out. But I will not get out of bed for 150.

flyinhigh · Post by **flyinhigh** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:13 am

Alrighty, the Flucker brought me outta the wood works, yeah I was out flying when all this started.

To get a full idea of what it is to work there check out the other tread that he started that I also posted in. Now on to the pay, it's $150 a day period, weather you sit at home playing on a play station or you actually go out, so as stated $4200 for a HO, come on goys thats pretty frickin good, I know guys that aren't making that on King Airs and Pilatus's.

My next thing is what he put for weather, LOLOL, even I wouldn't go in
that and he knows it, I and He new where and when I would go and that was it, as for who does take this job thats what will be expected of you, go when and if your comfortable.

Can't wait to see where this goes now.

split s · Post by **split s** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:32 am

more than likely the pilot will be on EI, no paper trail and a buck fiddy /day, accomodations, fly or not, I say shut your pie holes!

KAG · Post by **KAG** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 10:35 am

Anonymous1 wrote: Try Borek....flying out of Resolute with 40kts across the runways with 24 hour darkness at -35C for about the same rate after tax.

I work for Borek. Our copilots make around that after tax, the CPTS make consideribly more. Personally if I was to contract out for a short term work my rate would be $500/day fly or not.

I would think $250 with a guaranteed min of 2 weeks work under the table would be alittle better.

Cheers.

charlie_g · Post by **charlie_g** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 1:09 pm

Cat Driver wrote: There is something seriously wrong with your industry guys and girls.

And therein lies your low pay problem.

Cat

One obvious problem (there may be several) is that there are WAY too many pilots out there. Way too many. I don't know if that's because the qualification standards are too low, and/or too many people are willing to blow $40k for the faint hope of actually getting a job.

As long as the supply of pilots stays as high as it is (and has historically been), then these debates about money will carry on ad nauseum. "Future shortages" is clearly something invented by flying schools to drive demand, as "they" have been predicting shortages for years upon years.

Those who think they should be making 3-4 times what anonymous was offering are living in a reality that does not take supply and demand into account, plain and simple. You're worth what the market says you're worth, not what you think you should be worth.

cyyz · Post by **cyyz** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 1:18 pm

Just to finish this debate, how many PMs from applicants did you get?

Plenty, eh..

Questions answered

thread closed

talkinghead · Post by **talkinghead** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 1:21 pm

lets see 150 a day, 15 hr duty day in shitty WX. 10 bucks an hr. REALLY!

cyyz · Post by **cyyz** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 5:44 pm

talkinghead wrote:lets see 150 a day, 15 hr duty day in shitty WX. 10 bucks an hr. REALLY!

I'm to lazy to go and do the math for Air Canada and/or Jazz for the new hires....

Seems like some are hypocrites...

shankdown · Post by **shankdown** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 6:53 pm

I agree with KAG. Its short term & you want a guy with tons of experience to go to northern Ontario and .. around in crap? You're gonna have to pay. Good on ya if you get a guy for $150 a day, but no one is obligated to go because Turbo Prop or Split S say its good money. I'm guessing that (I'm not putting them down, just working on a hunch) they aren't getting paid much to fly right now, and they aren't qualified to be doing that contract, and wish they could be. $150/day is not good money for that, no matter what any of them say. The fact is, even though its a Navajo, guys holding the tickets to fly em can make some great money doin' it. Especially guys that are available to meet those demands (& over Christmas to boot!). I hold a PPC for it, and I'd go and do it if I had the time, and if we had a price worked out. And that price would be about $400/day, plus perdiems, lodging, and transportation. I think I'd go for time and a half for the holidays, too. If they didn't like the price, I'd stay home, happy as a clam, and they could find someone else. Supply and demand. If its full time work where I need them as much as they need me, I'll work for less than I stated. But we're talkin' about a contract in Red Lake here, not 8 weeks in the West Indies. My 2c.

Shankdown

TOGA Descent · Post by **TOGA Descent** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 7:36 pm

People! You have completely missed to ball on this one. Let’s look at the hypocrisy of this “Advertisement”

Initially this started with “…Please note there is no "learning curve" opportunity. You must be completely competent on day 1 in a "black hole" approach at night in heavy blowing snow with a high crosswind and ice covered runway. This opening is available only for someone who is current, experienced, hardworking, safe and can provide outstanding references…”

The contradiction here are the words “Experienced and Safe”. The approach this person discusses is simply dangerous in a Navajo. I don’t know any Experienced, Safe pilot who would plan an approach in such conditions.

Next, am I qualified to make this statement? 12700 hours, 3000 Navajo Hours, Current Airbus Captain with International Overseas Airline, and over 5000 hours in Northern Canada and Alaska. I believe the answer to this question is, categorically, yes.

“…150 a day cash is: 7 days=1050 , a month 4200$ I can't see to many people making 50000 cash a year to fly a Navajo…”

A “Competent” pilot would know that he (or she) could not work every day of the month. The law simply prohibits it.

I’m not going to discuss the pay issue, each of us gets paid (and accepts a pay commitment) based on what we think we are worth. If we accept a low paying position, we have simply accepted that this is what we are worth.

The simply fact here is, that this operator (Who’s name was not indicated in the initial “Advertisement,” rather disclosed later in this thread) is a hypocrite. Obviously, his (her) regard for safety is low. I can only imagine how long the term of employment will be if the successful candidate were to use his (her) experience, competence and safety consciousness to cancel the flight he describes above.

Jeeves · Post by **Jeeves** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 8:46 pm

Can't argue with that...

CHICAGO - A jetliner trying to land in heavy snow slid off a runway, crashed through a fence and slid into a busy street, hitting one vehicle and pinning another beneath it.

. . · Post by **. .** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:07 pm

I dunno, if I was a navajo guy looking for some quick money without a job I'd jump on this. Sure there are lots of places that pay more, but I promise there's more that pay less. BC anyone? To people say that the blackhole approach in blowing snow is unsafe. This is a reality anywhere in Northern Ontario. Believe it or not these reserves don't have lead in lights, and high intensity centre line lights. Everyone that flies into Northern Ontario flys into these places at night, if it's snowing they don't cancel the flights. If these guys are unsafe for doing this than why isn't everyone jumping on NAC, Bearskin, Wasaya, Thunder, Voyageur? Surely if it's safe for NAC to do in a PC-12, or wasaya to do in a Caravan than it's okay in a Navajo?

I'm not saying this is some amazing contract work, but surely it's not as bad as everyone is saying. Yes in a dream world the contract would be going out for $500/day with free everything and a thai hooker. Red Lake is a lot better than many places in Canada's north. Anyone actually been there? I've been there and thought it sure was nice to have an IGA, and a KFC.... ohh and the balmer burgers are great. Perhaps everyone lives in Vancouver, or Calgary and this would be a culture shock. I imagine there's still some guys out there that would consider Club Red a nice break from a crappier spot.

/rant

Anonymous1 · Post by **Anonymous1** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:45 pm

I'm just tired of all the crap here so I'll just do the damn flying myself. Its not really such a big deal that you guys make it out to be. I'm starting to think that quite a few of you really have nothing to do but complain. What did I hear at Georgian? Complaining. AC pilots? Complaining. Jazz? Complaining. Bearskin? Complaining....I really think if you were offered the Thai hooker, unlimited beer and $25K a month you'd still find something to bitch about. Thank God most pilots I've flown with and worked with are a far cry from the type of posters that write here otherwise I'd have quit long ago. I love flying at night in shit weather. It is challenging and satisfying to do. I'd probably blow my head off from borerdom if I had to do traffic patrol or fly a 340 across the Pacific for 15 hours. I put the contract thing in so if the work dried up, I wouldn't have misled the applicant. I know many other operators who even lay off before the ground school even starts but after you quit your last job. What about Westex? Hire and then bankrupt in a month. You want me to lie? If you want people to post here, then quit your Goddam bitching and stop finding the negatives in everything you read. I've never read so many pilots making $350 and more a day in a Navajo until this posting. Yet last month I read how Regency and Navair were at $100 a day. Goddam you guys piss me off! Bunch of Fu*king hypocrites. Won't fly a Navajo for less than $400 a day yet you'd sell your mother to a pimp for a shot at AC to fly for $110 a day.

turbo-prop · Post by **turbo-prop** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 10:20 pm

First of all shankdown I think i do qualify for that contract considering i have about 1800 hrs in a navajo with about 1300 of that as a captain flying around the north in the blowing snow and strong crosswinds into some crappy little strip. I done my time and am on to bigger and better now so get some facts before you shoot your mouth off about qualifications. I'am not saying i have the most experience as TOGA descent points all the valuable time he has, which is great some guys have tons and can have there opinions. TOGA I am sure you have a great job making lots of money and sure 3 or 4 guys posted how great they are paid, but thats is a small minority of navajo pilots out there, I can guarantee you there are lots more out there that don't make that much and wished they did. I didn't say anything about working 30 days in a row (even though under 703 you only need 3 off in 30), he said you would be paid if the plane moved or not so $4200 would be what you make a month (if the contract lasts that long since is just a SHORT term contract).

Need contract PA31-350 single pilot ASAP

Hypocrite