WESTJET ultrabasic

[rookiepilot]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/westjet- ... -1.7227809

Tore up my knee a few days ago shovelling soil. So write a post…..

I find the responses here more interesting than WJ doing what lots of discount airlines are doing. I don’t have a problem with it, market a la carte , I don’t care. Porter does the same, more or less.

The public anger over inflation though, here or Loblaws, is really, really high. Everyone on Twitter tells me “the consumer is fine” but I don’t think so. Consumers are stressed IMO and getting more so every month. I feel bad for folks these days.

[Ruger Princess]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/westjet- ... -1.7227809

Tore up my knee a few days ago shovelling soil. So write a post…..

I find the responses here more interesting than WJ doing what lots of discount airlines are doing. I don’t have a problem with it, market a la carte , I don’t care. Porter does the same, more or less.

The public anger over inflation though, here or Loblaws, is really, really high. Everyone on Twitter tells me “the consumer is fine” but I don’t think so. Consumers are stressed IMO and getting more so every month. I feel bad for folks these days.

I did find this interesting because it was almost exactly the same time AC announced their drink menu.

It's a good experiment to see which garners more revenue. $

[7ECA]

The better question is, which fare structure brings in the most ancillary revenue - the standard fare(s) or this "ultrabasic" thing?

I would hazard a guess that the ultrabasic sucks in the travelling public looking for a "deal", only to hit them with exorbitant fees at the gate for carry-ons and gate checked luggage. It's hardly any different than what many a ULCC and ULCC-lite airline does, charge low initial fares and then make up for it by nickel and dime-ing pax for every single service after the initial fare - checked luggage fees, seat selection fees, etc.

[Canadaflyer46]

https://www.thebeaverton.com/2024/06/we ... hem-money/

[boeingboy]

I don't get the surprise and backlash really - this is what the public wanted. It was part of WestJet's plan all along when they folded Swoop into mainline. I said it long ago that all they would do is the same that Air Canada did with Tango...fold it up and make it a fare.

Everyone was in an uproar when the closed Swoop and now they can get the same thing - but they are upset???

I'll never understand the public....always complaining even when they get what they want.

[Old fella]

I don't get the surprise and backlash really - this is what the public wanted. It was part of WestJet's plan all along when they folded Swoop into mainline. I said it long ago that all they would do is the same that Air Canada did with Tango...fold it up and make it a fare.

Everyone was in an uproar when the closed Swoop and now they can get the same thing - but they are upset???

I'll never understand the public....always complaining even when they get what they want.

The public complains regardless. They demand airfares from YHZ to YYZ to be the same as a taxi fare from downtown Halifax to Stanfield International. Give them what they want and they will find reason to bitch.

[TylxrG]

I don't get the surprise and backlash really - this is what the public wanted. It was part of WestJet's plan all along when they folded Swoop into mainline. I said it long ago that all they would do is the same that Air Canada did with Tango...fold it up and make it a fare.

Everyone was in an uproar when the closed Swoop and now they can get the same thing - but they are upset???

I'll never understand the public....always complaining even when they get what they want.

The public complains regardless. They demand airfares from YHZ to YYZ to be the same as a taxi fare from downtown Halifax to Stanfield International. Give them what they want and they will find reason to bitch.

I saw some comments where some folks mentioned how flying now is different than flying in the 60’s. I literally laughed so hard. The cheapest Pan Am ticket in their prime (67’) would be around $4K CAD in todays valuation. The people complaining about ultra basic now couldn’t even dream of flying back in the, “golden days”. The non aviation affiliated public has to be the most delusional crowd I’ve ever seen. They want Emirates service for $70, LOL. They must think running an airline is cheap.

[digits_]

I don't get the surprise and backlash really - this is what the public wanted. It was part of WestJet's plan all along when they folded Swoop into mainline. I said it long ago that all they would do is the same that Air Canada did with Tango...fold it up and make it a fare.

Everyone was in an uproar when the closed Swoop and now they can get the same thing - but they are upset???

I'll never understand the public....always complaining even when they get what they want.

It's not that hard to understand really.

What WestJet claims:
"We have a new no frills cheaper ultrabasic service ticket"

What the public perceives (and I suspect they are right):
"The ultrabasic ticket costs the same as the previous economy ticket and the economy ticket has now become more expensive"

[ozone]

It’s been in the works for months…I really don’t get the hysteria. Typical these days. People latch onto the headline and it goes viral without anyone actually educating themselves. It will all be forgotten about in a couple days and onto the next social media craze we go…

https://skiesmag.com/features/westjet-p ... tegration/

Estimated reading time 5 minutes, 51 seconds.
WestJet Group’s decision to integrate its ultra-low-cost carrier (ULCC) Swoop into its mainline operations will lead to seating changes in the narrow-body Boeing 737s in the fleet.

Swoop operated its final flight on Oct. 28, 2023, marking its end after five years and four months as a separate WestJet unit. Now, the ULCC’s 10 Boeing 737-800s and six Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft will be folded into WestJet’s fleet and repainted with the mainline’s teal brand colour — retiring Swoop’s signature magenta livery.

Consumer groups have cautioned that “ULCC” refers to airlines striving to control operating costs and doesn’t necessarily connote bargain-basement airfares.

Still, WestJet chief executive officer Alexis von Hoensbroech said seating changes in the 737 cabins mean WestJet will be adding an extra row of seats at the back of the plane in an effort to offer more affordable tickets.

“We decided that instead of offering 16 Swoop airplanes and the pure play, ultra-low-cost offering, we will actually offer ultra-low-cost fares and products on all our 180 airplanes,” said von Hoensbroech in a phone interview.


Galen Burrows Photo
“So we will go from 174 to 180 seats, and this densification will happen mainly at the back of the plane,” he continued. “The idea is that those seats are then offered to those people that are actually looking for an ultra-low-cost offering.”

While the seat pitch would be reduced in economy class, WestJet is emphasizing the design of the new seats will ensure passengers have enough leg room. The airline’s regional Encore fleet of 47 De Havilland Dash 8-400 turboprops will not be part of the process of reconfiguring seats. Noteworthy is the fact that WestJet also placed orders in 2022 for at least 50 Boeing 737 Max 10s, the largest model in the Max family.

WestJet and former Swoop pilots represented by the Air Line Pilots Association, International, ratified a four-year collective agreement in June, retroactive to the beginning of 2023. Soon after pilots ratified the contract, WestJet announced plans for Swoop’s shutdown.

The Calgary-based carrier is also integrating Sunwing Airlines into the mainline operations, aiming for completion by October 2024. Sunwing Vacations is being kept as an operating brand, with marketing alongside the smaller WestJet Vacations.

“Together, this is going to be the vacation and tour operator powerhouse for Canada,” said von Hoensbroech, who became WestJet CEO in February 2022. The previous CEO, Ed Sims, retired at the end of 2021, and Harry Taylor filled in briefly as interim CEO.

Canada’s large geographic area and widely dispersed population have proven to be challenging for the airline industry. There are eight major population centres in Canada, and once airlines go beyond them, making the economics work in smaller markets can be difficult, said von Hoensbroech.

“The stage lengths are really long, so the costs of flights are usually higher in Canada than they are in other countries,” he said.

He noted taxes, airport fees, and other levies contribute to the total ticket price paid by consumers, making it harder for airlines to stimulate budget-conscious travelling in Canada.

Though plans call for retiring the Swoop brand name, the general concept of WestJet having a discount fare class is reminiscent of a move by Air Canada two decades ago.

Air Canada shut down Tango as a low-cost carrier and retired its purple brand colour in the fall of 2003. Air Canada operated Tango for less than two years before closing the unit, but offered Tango as the name of its lowest-cost fare class of seating for consumers buying tickets from 2003 to 2018.

Bob Cummings, who started as Swoop’s president in April 2022 and served in that role until the final flight 18 months later, said in a phone interview that he is “very proud of the company and passing the baton.”

He was no stranger to WestJet when he took over as Swoop president, having previously served as an executive vice-president at WestJet.

Swoop played an important role in WestJet’s history, including operating during the tumultuous times of the pandemic, said Cummings, who describes Swoop as “the first true ULCC model” in Canada.

“It paved the way, and it was a big influence into WestJet’s strategy and where it has ended up,” said Cummings.

He was the executive responsible for helping start up Swoop, before he first left WestJet in late 2018. The first Swoop president was Steven Greenway, followed by Charles Duncan.

During Duncan’s tenure as Swoop president, flight attendants represented by the Canadian Union of Public Employees ratified a five-year collective agreement in September 2021, which took effect on Oct. 1. The deal remains in effect until Sept. 30, 2026.

Today’s workforce stands in contrast to the non-union roots of WestJet, which launched in 1996 with three planes and five destinations. Over the years, WestJet gradually expanded to become the country’s second-largest commercial carrier, after Air Canada. In late 2019, months before travel restrictions were imposed during the Covid-19 pandemic, Toronto-based Onex Corp. acquired WestJet for $3.5 billion.

While Cummings has left WestJet for a second time, he said the aviation industry remains near and dear to his heart.

“I don’t think I’m done yet,” he shared.

[fish4life]

It will never make any sense to me but people expect to fly across the country for less than it cost them to put gas in there car/truck and drive one province over.

[rookiepilot]

It will never make any sense to me but people expect to fly across the country for less than it cost them to put gas in there car/truck and drive one province over.

They don’t.

They are angry they will never afford a single family house.

Just a place to vent.

[itsgrosswhatinet]

I don't think I've ever been a passenger on a plane with zero carry on. Is there a market for this?

[CpnCrunch]

I don't think I've ever been a passenger on a plane with zero carry on. Is there a market for this?

You're still allowed the "personal item", which has to fit under the seat, and (in theory) must fit in the sizing device at the gate. In reality, however, the gate agents are very hit and miss about checking the sizes of carry-ons at the moment. On a recent flight they asked one guy to put his bag in the sizer, and he managed to squeeze it in, but then another person brought a massive roller bag on board which didn't fit in the q400 lockers and had to be put into the hold.

I'm just wondering how/who is actually going to police this. If you wait until the people with the massive carry-on get onto the plane, it wastes a lot of time. If they police every single person at the gate, that will slow check-in. Easyjet charges for overhead bins, but they don't seem to give a damn anytime I've flown with them recently.

My guess is they do it the Easyjet way and not really give a crap what people do for the most part. If sufficient cheapskates buy the ultrabasic fares it will hopefully reduce overhead bin usage enough that it will all go smoothly.

[newlygrounded]

I don't think I've ever been a passenger on a plane with zero carry on. Is there a market for this?

You're still allowed the "personal item", which has to fit under the seat, and (in theory) must fit in the sizing device at the gate. In reality, however, the gate agents are very hit and miss about checking the sizes of carry-ons at the moment. On a recent flight they asked one guy to put his bag in the sizer, and he managed to squeeze it in, but then another person brought a massive roller bag on board which didn't fit in the q400 lockers and had to be put into the hold.

I'm just wondering how/who is actually going to police this. If you wait until the people with the massive carry-on get onto the plane, it wastes a lot of time. If they police every single person at the gate, that will slow check-in. Easyjet charges for overhead bins, but they don't seem to give a damn anytime I've flown with them recently.

My guess is they do it the Easyjet way and not really give a crap what people do for the most part. If sufficient cheapskates buy the ultrabasic fares it will hopefully reduce overhead bin usage enough that it will all go smoothly.

Frontier gives the gate agents $10 of the $100 at the gate fee

[Ruger Princess]

I don't think I've ever been a passenger on a plane with zero carry on. Is there a market for this?

You're still allowed the "personal item", which has to fit under the seat, and (in theory) must fit in the sizing device at the gate. In reality, however, the gate agents are very hit and miss about checking the sizes of carry-ons at the moment. On a recent flight they asked one guy to put his bag in the sizer, and he managed to squeeze it in, but then another person brought a massive roller bag on board which didn't fit in the q400 lockers and had to be put into the hold.

I'm just wondering how/who is actually going to police this. If you wait until the people with the massive carry-on get onto the plane, it wastes a lot of time. If they police every single person at the gate, that will slow check-in. Easyjet charges for overhead bins, but they don't seem to give a damn anytime I've flown with them recently.

My guess is they do it the Easyjet way and not really give a crap what people do for the most part. If sufficient cheapskates buy the ultrabasic fares it will hopefully reduce overhead bin usage enough that it will all go smoothly.

Frontier gives the gate agents $10 of the $100 at the gate fee

Seriously?! That's handy-dandy. Both Spirit and Frontier do offer about 1k if you give up your seat because of overbooking. So that's nice too. And the perk of paying (at a booth) to fast track myself through security is a nice feature. Although both of those Ultra Ultra low cost are exactly what they say they are. Did get me from Denver to Minn and back for 90 bucks though.