Recall of MEC Chair & Vice Chair

[BigGreen]

Anyone have any details? Is it true?

Do we get to vote?

[rudder]

Whether true or not, under the ALPA Constitution a recall of an MEC Officer is not voted on by the membership. It is the status reps that have the votes.

[BigGreen]

Whether true or not, under the ALPA Constitution a recall of an MEC Officer is not voted on by the membership. It is the status reps that have the votes.

The same status reps that brought forward this deal?

[rudder]

Whether true or not, under the ALPA Constitution a recall of an MEC Officer is not voted on by the membership. It is the status reps that have the votes.

The same status reps that brought forward this deal?

Under the ALPA Constitution, members have the right to recall status reps. Why? Because it is members that elect status reps.

Same methodology for recalling MEC Officers. Elected by status reps so subject to recall by status reps.

[Launchpad1]

Recalled for what reason?

[Man_in_the_sky]

Whether true or not, under the ALPA Constitution a recall of an MEC Officer is not voted on by the membership. It is the status reps that have the votes.

The same status reps that brought forward this deal?

it got voted for by 67% of the group...

don't forget, company aims for 50+1% while union aim for 80% . who was the closest ?

[Mr. North]

Ask anyone pushing for a recall what they hope to accomplish? I've yet to hear a constructive argument for doing so.

[thepoors]

Ask anyone pushing for a recall what they hope to accomplish? I've yet to hear a constructive argument for doing so.

This Chair and MEC have zero legitimacy after the TA sell job and "I'll quit" threats. Are these losers who threw in the towel at the critical moment really the people you want representing you in the next round of negots? Why would anyone believe anything they say? - "world class contract," "strike ready," "no penny left on the table," "let's f***ing get them" - all a bunch of lies and posturing with no spine to back it up. It's over. Their time is up and if they had any morals they would have voluntarily stepped down already.

Plus look at it from the company's pov: why would they take ALPA seriously if it's the same cucks who capitulated sitting at the negotiating table?

[Bede]

Ask anyone pushing for a recall what they hope to accomplish? I've yet to hear a constructive argument for doing so.

This Chair and MEC have zero legitimacy after the TA sell job and "I'll quit" threats. Are these losers who threw in the towel at the critical moment really the people you want representing you in the next round of negots? Why would anyone believe anything they say? - "world class contract," "strike ready," "no penny left on the table," "let's f***ing get them" - all a bunch of lies and posturing with no spine to back it up. It's over. Their time is up and if they had any morals they would have voluntarily stepped down already.

Plus look at it from the company's pov: why would they take ALPA seriously if it's the same cucks who capitulated sitting at the negotiating table?

Could you do better? If not, fair enough, but do you know anyone who could and would step up to take on the role?

[thepoors]

Ask anyone pushing for a recall what they hope to accomplish? I've yet to hear a constructive argument for doing so.

This Chair and MEC have zero legitimacy after the TA sell job and "I'll quit" threats. Are these losers who threw in the towel at the critical moment really the people you want representing you in the next round of negots? Why would anyone believe anything they say? - "world class contract," "strike ready," "no penny left on the table," "let's f***ing get them" - all a bunch of lies and posturing with no spine to back it up. It's over. Their time is up and if they had any morals they would have voluntarily stepped down already.

Plus look at it from the company's pov: why would they take ALPA seriously if it's the same cucks who capitulated sitting at the negotiating table?

Could you do better? If not, fair enough, but do you know anyone who could and would step up to take on the role?

I agree this is a big problem. No one wants that job, so you get people who are ill equipped sitting in those positions. I don't know what the solution is but that's up to ALPA leadership to figure out, not me.

[Launchpad1]

I was always surprised that the team doing the negotiations are not professional negotiators employed by ALPA. Sure have Pilot representatives in the room but not doing the actual negotiations.

[Bede]

I agree this is a big problem. No one wants that job, so you get people who are ill equipped sitting in those positions. I don't know what the solution is but that's up to ALPA leadership to figure out, not me.

But that's the thing. You are ALPA. You decide. It's not some big union boss telling you how to do things. It's a fellow pilot that you and your colleagues elect.

[Bede]

I was always surprised that the team doing the negotiations are not professional negotiators employed by ALPA. Sure have Pilot representatives in the room but not doing the actual negotiations.

I hear this a lot. I can assure you that you are better off with pilot negotiators supported by negotiators/lawyers rather than the other way around. Professional negotiators will always get you a deal, but they don't need to work under that contract and will spend all their time convincing you what's good for you.

[pelmet]

This Chair and MEC have zero legitimacy after the TA sell job and "I'll quit" threats. Are these losers who threw in the towel at the critical moment really the people you want representing you in the next round of negots? Why would anyone believe anything they say? - "world class contract," "strike ready," "no penny left on the table," "let's f***ing get them" - all a bunch of lies and posturing with no spine to back it up. It's over. Their time is up and if they had any morals they would have voluntarily stepped down already.

Plus look at it from the company's pov: why would they take ALPA seriously if it's the same cucks who capitulated sitting at the negotiating table?

Could you do better? If not, fair enough, but do you know anyone who could and would step up to take on the role?

I agree this is a big problem. No one wants that job, so you get people who are ill equipped sitting in those positions. I don't know what the solution is but that's up to ALPA leadership to figure out, not me.

Why would anyone want the job when this is how you are treated by much of the pilot population. Seen it before in union ops. I never joined the MEC despite people saying I should. It's a thankless job and they probably hate the membership more than the management because of the way they are treated.

[Bede]

Why would anyone want the job when this is how you are treated by much of the pilot population. Seen it before in union ops. I never joined the MEC despite people saying I should. It's a thankless job and they probably hate the membership more than the management because of the way they are treated.

Union work is very rewarding. The overwhelming majority of pilots that you serve are smart, respectful and ask decent questions. It's an honour to serve them. It's really only 1%...

[cdnavater]

Why would anyone want the job when this is how you are treated by much of the pilot population. Seen it before in union ops. I never joined the MEC despite people saying I should. It's a thankless job and they probably hate the membership more than the management because of the way they are treated.

Union work is very rewarding. The overwhelming majority of pilots that you serve are smart, respectful and ask decent questions. It's an honour to serve them. It's really only 1%...

You are correct, slight correction, it’s always 5% of a group that is problematic!
With regards to AC, because they were convinced they could have the moon and the stars but only got the moon, they think they were sold out!
This speaks to maturity and quite frankly common friggen sense, that’s how negations work! You want a 100million, they say the can only afford a neutral agreement, we will give this but take that and you meet somewhere in the middle!

[FelixGustof]

Why would anyone want the job when this is how you are treated by much of the pilot population. Seen it before in union ops. I never joined the MEC despite people saying I should. It's a thankless job and they probably hate the membership more than the management because of the way they are treated.

Union work is very rewarding. The overwhelming majority of pilots that you serve are smart, respectful and ask decent questions. It's an honour to serve them. It's really only 1%...

You are correct, slight correction, it’s always 5% of a group that is problematic!
With regards to AC, because they were convinced they could have the moon and the stars but only got the moon, they think they were sold out!
This speaks to maturity and quite frankly common friggen sense, that’s how negations work! You want a 100million, they say the can only afford a neutral agreement, we will give this but take that and you meet somewhere in the middle!

Aren't you at Jazz on some crazy ass 17 yrs deal which is probably the most absurd thing I've ever heard from a labour contract perspective

[737Drver]

Could you do better? If not, fair enough, but do you know anyone who could and would step up to take on the role?

I agree this is a big problem. No one wants that job, so you get people who are ill equipped sitting in those positions. I don't know what the solution is but that's up to ALPA leadership to figure out, not me.

Why would anyone want the job when this is how you are treated by much of the pilot population. Seen it before in union ops. I never joined the MEC despite people saying I should. It's a thankless job and they probably hate the membership more than the management because of the way they are treated.

If you did a good job, wouldn't the membership appreciate that & respect you?

[Dry Guy]

You want a 100million, they say the can only afford a neutral agreement, we will give this but take that and you meet somewhere in the middle!

They could afford it.

[cdnavater]

Union work is very rewarding. The overwhelming majority of pilots that you serve are smart, respectful and ask decent questions. It's an honour to serve them. It's really only 1%...

You are correct, slight correction, it’s always 5% of a group that is problematic!
With regards to AC, because they were convinced they could have the moon and the stars but only got the moon, they think they were sold out!
This speaks to maturity and quite frankly common friggen sense, that’s how negations work! You want a 100million, they say the can only afford a neutral agreement, we will give this but take that and you meet somewhere in the middle!

Aren't you at Jazz on some crazy ass 17 yrs deal which is probably the most absurd thing I've ever heard from a labour contract perspective

Yes and how we got there has tons of history, given you just graduated high school, I wouldn’t expect you to understand!
I will say this, the long term contract gave us the stability to absorb our competitors that were created to put pressure on us, with 12 years remaining in the contract I got a 31% increase in my take home pay. The original negotiated amount was rumoured to be 42%, I expect the outcome of the CIRB ULP filling to remedy that.
You are way too young to be pondering these adult problems and I’m sure when you grow up you will hear many more absurd things, a 17 year labour agreement to a group that really had no leverage being low on the absurdity scale.

[CGFCK]

Ask anyone pushing for a recall what they hope to accomplish? I've yet to hear a constructive argument for doing so.

It's funny, I have a tough time with the idea of letting this shit show continue.

A MEC Chair that had a hissy fit at V1 decision point, "You're either with me or against me".

A Vice Chair who from what I can tell is more interested in power & control than the actual product.

While propping up a chaotic mess of a strike committee that the Toronto guy running stuff was removed than ultimately won the base rep spot. Apparently the firings didn't even follow the alpa policy manual so it's literally a bunch of thugs running around shooting pistols from their hip.

No real leadership since the TA debacle and now it is realized that Air Canada pilots will be the only pilot group without a bonus while airlines make record profits.

At least we left the company some money for their share buyback program! But hey, we got every penny

[cdnavater]

You want a 100million, they say the can only afford a neutral agreement, we will give this but take that and you meet somewhere in the middle!

They could afford it.

Ok, let’s say they give the pilots 100mil, because, “they could afford it”.
How does that work with the next three groups negotiating with the company, bottom line they were never going to give you 100mililion no matter what you did.
The union reps decided the gamble on getting more with all the available information was not worth the risk of what could have happened, then 67% of the pilots also decided the risk was not worth it. End of story!
The only real mistake I see is the chair statement of her resignation if the TA doesn’t pass, all the good she did to rally the troops, undone by one mistake, yah no wonder no one wants the job.

[ALPAisAwesome]

Isn't she and he up for re-election anyway? Why the recall any specifics? Are they being charged under the ALPA constitution for something nefarious?
Why not just wait for the election to take place?
Seems unnecessary and damaging.

[FelixGustof]

You want a 100million, they say the can only afford a neutral agreement, we will give this but take that and you meet somewhere in the middle!

They could afford it.

Ok, let’s say they give the pilots 100mil, because, “they could afford it”.
How does that work with the next three groups negotiating with the company, bottom line they were never going to give you 100mililion no matter what you did.
The union reps decided the gamble on getting more with all the available information was not worth the risk of what could have happened, then 67% of the pilots also decided the risk was not worth it. End of story!
The only real mistake I see is the chair statement of her resignation if the TA doesn’t pass, all the good she did to rally the troops, undone by one mistake, yah no wonder no one wants the job.

Maybe if Air Canada pilots signed a 17 yrs deal they could have!

And get a big pay check like Jazz

[cdnavater]

They could afford it.

Ok, let’s say they give the pilots 100mil, because, “they could afford it”.
How does that work with the next three groups negotiating with the company, bottom line they were never going to give you 100mililion no matter what you did.
The union reps decided the gamble on getting more with all the available information was not worth the risk of what could have happened, then 67% of the pilots also decided the risk was not worth it. End of story!
The only real mistake I see is the chair statement of her resignation if the TA doesn’t pass, all the good she did to rally the troops, undone by one mistake, yah no wonder no one wants the job.

Maybe if Air Canada pilots signed a 17 yrs deal they could have!

And get a big pay check like Jazz

Fu ck o f f kid!