25% Tariff on all non US made Autos.

[cdnavater]

That's a bit shortsighted. High speed rail doesn't mean less pilots will be needed. It could very easily result in reduced airline flights and as a consequence increased charter/bizzjet traffic.

Please explain how more people moving by train will amount to an increase in bizjet flights! I’m not seeing it!

If we assume that building a railroad will result in less airline flights (which is the scenario that you're worried about), then we can realistically assume:
1) There will be less movements at CYYZ
2) This should be opening up more slots for other traffic
3) Tess frequent airline flights between different cities. Time sensitive travellers (business people) might consider looking for alternatives. Private flights or helicopters could be viable alternatives, especially combined with the more readily available slots.

First not worried, pissed off sums up my stand on the rail line up for me, another Liberal promise to get support in the Quebec and Ontario that does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR THE REST OF CANADA!
We, the rest of Canada don’t have a say in our country, even if every other province or territory went blue, Ontario and Quebec have more than enough seats for a majority, this is just plain wrong! Last two elections had majority vote for Conservatives, yet Liberals formed government, provinces should have equal say in elections, this way the money gets spread out!
If the people are using rail between YUL-YYZ, why wouldn’t they just charter from, you know, Montreal! You have no logic to your thoughts here, just the usual digits nonsense taking the opposite position of the topic!

[CpnCrunch]

another Liberal promise to get support in the Quebec and Ontario that does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR THE REST OF CANADA!

I guess you missed all the promises they made for the rest of Canada.

no logic...nonsense taking the opposite position of the topic!

Indeed.

[digits_]

You have no logic to your thoughts here, just the usual digits nonsense taking the opposite position of the topic!

One day, you'll find that nobody will oppose your position or your thoughts.

That's not something you should attempt to attain.

[cdnavater]

You have no logic to your thoughts here, just the usual digits nonsense taking the opposite position of the topic!

One day, you'll find that nobody will oppose your position or your thoughts.

That's not something you should attempt to attain.

I certainly don’t mind the opposite side of any argument but not when it’s just for the sake of argument, you presented utter nonsense and missed the point, this billions upon billions does not benefit the rest of Canada!

[‘Bob’]

I guarantee you that the east spends more per capita on transportation in the west than it does in the east. It’s not the Golden Horseshoe that has 100% federally funded airports and 100% federally funded flights.

And remember, just the GDP of Toronto exceeds that of all of Alberta.

[pelmet]

That's a bit shortsighted. High speed rail doesn't mean less pilots will be needed. It could very easily result in reduced airline flights and as a consequence increased charter/bizzjet traffic.

Please explain how more people moving by train will amount to an increase in bizjet flights! I’m not seeing it!

If we assume that building a railroad will result in less airline flights (which is the scenario that you're worried about), then we can realistically assume:
1) There will be less movements at CYYZ
2) This should be opening up more slots for other traffic
3) Tess frequent airline flights between different cities. Time sensitive travellers (business people) might consider looking for alternatives. Private flights or helicopters could be viable alternatives, especially combined with the more readily available slots.

Heck of an analysis.

There you go current and future AC pilots(and Porter). Vote liberal and apply to the helicopter and bizjet companies after half a trillion(or whatever the cost overrun will be) gets spent on train routes......or maybe vote for common sense.

Maybe look up California for high speed rail line success. We are now seeing how important it is to have pipelines. Too bad the fools in power squandered most of that potential. And we are told that they are the adults in the room. They are destructive.

https://www.latimes.com/california/stor ... speed-rail

[pelmet]

The dairy & cheese quota was put in place to give Canadian farmers a chance to make a living & have a stable income.
I guess you could say go ahead & get rid of it & while we’re at it let foreign pilots fly Canadian aircraft & non Canadian airlines service Canada because heck they could do it cheaper.
I could probably save hundreds of dollars on my travels if they paid the crew less.
Just a differing view.

Daryl

It may have made sense when farms were small but now dairy farms are massive operations and a lot of them corporations.
Dairy farmers literally have to dump milk in the sewer/ ditch if their cows are producing well because they are over their quota. In what world is that beneficial to people.

Here is what the National Post had to say about the parties support of Dairy quotas under a dumb idea article:

3. Sacred supply management: All the leaders swear they’ll maintain a system that gives a few thousand dairy and poultry producers monopoly power over the supply and therefore price of (ahem!) basic foodstuffs for 40 million people. That’s nutty enough. But Donald Trump has made supply management Target One in trade talks. We’re really going to sacrifice aluminum, steel, lumber, autos and all the rest to keep the food cartels going?

Anybody care to answer the question in the last sentence?

[pdw]

It is really kind of crazy. But we got to be extra carefull about further jeapordizing our food security right now if he’s hell bent on messing us up with ‘all the rest’ anyway.

[pelmet]

I knew there was a reason beyond saving the kids to keep a few thousand farmers in a system making us pay more and restricting our cheese options while our steel and car industry whither.

Now it is food security too. I don’t want to starve.

Any other important reasons?

[The Brantford Boomer]

I read in the newspaper that insect protein is the next big thing. Any investment tips?

[goldeneagle]

We’re really going to sacrifice aluminum, steel, lumber, autos and all the rest to keep the food cartels going?[/i]

Anybody care to answer the question in the last sentence?

Sure.

Somebody has confused a bunch of issues. Lumber is not part of any recent discussions, was subject to the softwood lumber agreements decades ago, agreements the US has pretty much never honored and been charging exhorbitant tariffs on it for ,amu years. If you want to talk about 'sacrifice lumber', that happened a long time ago.

Aluminum and steel are subject to other agreements made in the past, also now unilaterally torn up and tossed in the bin without even so much as a 'lets talk about this', just wild threats.

But I get it, you dont like the supply management system in place, so you are going to rail on and on about our dairy systems. But I haven't heard a peep about poultry, which has essentially the same system around the production of eggs. due to how that system works, our egg production is spread out over many smaller locations, average chicken barn in 20 thousand birds. Look to the south, the industry has become concentrated into much larger facilities running upwards of a million or two birds at a location. Enter a round of bird flu, which arrives like clockwork every year as migratory birds head north, and you end up with a few infected flocks that are culled.

This last round, in the US they got hit in a few of the very large operations, which created a huge shortage of eggs, which is ongoing and will take a good while to recover from. The reason they cant recover quickly, the hatchery system cant produce a million extra chicks on short notice. Once chicks arrive, it takes months to grow them out to an age where they will start laying eggs. In Canada, our chicken flocks are smaller and spread out thanks to the way the quota system works. Yes, some flocks were lost again in the recent round of avian flu, but, it's not enough to have a huge bump in the supply, and the hatchery systems can indeed pick up the slack for a few thousand extra birds on relatively short notice, that's 2 orders of magnitude less impact than trying to restock a barn with over million birds.

The end result, supply and price for eggs in Canada has remained relatively stable. And that is the goal of supply management, stable supply and price. The key word there is stable. I was in Costco the other day, bought a flat of 5 dozen for 20 bucks, so about $14us equivalent. In some parts of the US, that will barely buy a dozen, and in some areas it'll get 2 dozen, but nowhere in that country today will $14 buy 5 dozen eggs at retail. That is just one example of our supply managment system doing exactly what it is supposed to do.

It's very much along the same lines as cabotage laws, which came about to ensure that in times of geopolitical changes or problems, there would be a viable domestic transportation industry to depend on. Without cabotage laws in place, most of our domestic aviation industry would be non existant. Supply management is about ensuring there is a reliable food supply.

But I get it, you dont see how the system puts dollars in your pocket, so you feel it is a bad system. But not everything is about dollars, supply management is about ensuring there is food to go on the table. In the end game, if there is no food, the dollars dont matter anymore, they only have value if there is something to buy with them. And in an unconstrained system, when supply becomes scarce, eggs get expensive.

This document is old, goes back a number of years, put out during the time when TPP was a big discussion point, addresses misinformation on it at the time, it's a quick and easy read, but still relevant today.

https://www.chickenfarmers.ca/media-roo ... anagement/

[pelmet]

We’re really going to sacrifice aluminum, steel, lumber, autos and all the rest to keep the food cartels going?[/i]

Anybody care to answer the question in the last sentence?

Sure.

Somebody has confused a bunch of issues. Lumber is not part of any recent discussions, was subject to the softwood lumber agreements decades ago, agreements the US has pretty much never honored and been charging exhorbitant tariffs on it for ,amu years. If you want to talk about 'sacrifice lumber', that happened a long time ago.

Aluminum and steel are subject to other agreements made in the past, also now unilaterally torn up and tossed in the bin without even so much as a 'lets talk about this', just wild threats.

But I get it, you dont like the supply management system in place, so you are going to rail on and on about our dairy systems. But I haven't heard a peep about poultry, which has essentially the same system around the production of eggs. due to how that system works, our egg production is spread out over many smaller locations, average chicken barn in 20 thousand birds. Look to the south, the industry has become concentrated into much larger facilities running upwards of a million or two birds at a location. Enter a round of bird flu, which arrives like clockwork every year as migratory birds head north, and you end up with a few infected flocks that are culled.

This last round, in the US they got hit in a few of the very large operations, which created a huge shortage of eggs, which is ongoing and will take a good while to recover from. The reason they cant recover quickly, the hatchery system cant produce a million extra chicks on short notice. Once chicks arrive, it takes months to grow them out to an age where they will start laying eggs. In Canada, our chicken flocks are smaller and spread out thanks to the way the quota system works. Yes, some flocks were lost again in the recent round of avian flu, but, it's not enough to have a huge bump in the supply, and the hatchery systems can indeed pick up the slack for a few thousand extra birds on relatively short notice, that's 2 orders of magnitude less impact than trying to restock a barn with over million birds.

The end result, supply and price for eggs in Canada has remained relatively stable. And that is the goal of supply management, stable supply and price. The key word there is stable. I was in Costco the other day, bought a flat of 5 dozen for 20 bucks, so about $14us equivalent. In some parts of the US, that will barely buy a dozen, and in some areas it'll get 2 dozen, but nowhere in that country today will $14 buy 5 dozen eggs at retail. That is just one example of our supply managment system doing exactly what it is supposed to do.

It's very much along the same lines as cabotage laws, which came about to ensure that in times of geopolitical changes or problems, there would be a viable domestic transportation industry to depend on. Without cabotage laws in place, most of our domestic aviation industry would be non existant. Supply management is about ensuring there is a reliable food supply.

But I get it, you dont see how the system puts dollars in your pocket, so you feel it is a bad system. But not everything is about dollars, supply management is about ensuring there is food to go on the table. In the end game, if there is no food, the dollars dont matter anymore, they only have value if there is something to buy with them. And in an unconstrained system, when supply becomes scarce, eggs get expensive.

This document is old, goes back a number of years, put out during the time when TPP was a big discussion point, addresses misinformation on it at the time, it's a quick and easy read, but still relevant today.

https://www.chickenfarmers.ca/media-roo ... anagement/

The argument goes that I am supposedly opposed to the dairy marketing board because of dollars in my pocket. Admittedly, I can afford the extra expense. But what about the 10% of Canadians living below the poverty line? Do their pockets count?

This article is old as well but it does discuss the effect on low income canadians of the Dairy board...

https://www.iedm.org/63228-viewpoint-su ... en-poorer/

Is it really too much too ask the farmers to simply let in European cheeses as we want. How is that going to interrupt stable food supply? Will there be less food on the table? Some of the arguments seem to be statements like "no food on the table" or it is all about the kids being fed. And now avian flu is being used as an argument to defend the dairy marketing board.

[pdw]

Would it help to compare a successful farm operation nowadays to a flight training outfit, where if you can’t keep order and discipline it falls apart?

[digits_]

The end result, supply and price for eggs in Canada has remained relatively stable. And that is the goal of supply management, stable supply and price. The key word there is stable. I was in Costco the other day, bought a flat of 5 dozen for 20 bucks, so about $14us equivalent. In some parts of the US, that will barely buy a dozen, and in some areas it'll get 2 dozen, but nowhere in that country today will $14 buy 5 dozen eggs at retail. That is just one example of our supply managment system doing exactly what it is supposed to do.

We might control the eggs, but we don't control all the products created with eggs. You can still import cookies and cakes etc.

The crucial difference, for me then, is that the dairy board limits also apply to derived products such as cheeses. Not to offend the egg and milk aficionados, but the difference between Canadian and European eggs and milk is much smaller than the difference between Canadian and European cheeses. Both in taste and cost.

[goldeneagle]

but the difference between Canadian and European eggs and milk is much smaller than the difference between Canadian and European cheeses. Both in taste and cost.

Guess it depends where you are buying the cheese I guess. We buy a lot of European cheese here, it doesn't cost much more than domestic, the delta is small enough that simply shipping costs can explain it. FWIW, it does arrive here without a tariff applied, even tho most will likely try tell you otherwise. the CETA deal with Europe allows for 16 million kilograms of cheese to be imported annually. I have an aquaintance in that line of business, he brings in a few thousand kilos of Dutch cheese every year for sale in his deli. After figuring in the currency conversions etc, it's actually cheaper to buy 500grams in his shop than it is in the tourist trap cheese shops on the streets in Amsterdam, I've done both. I find it interesting that he is able to sell it at those prices, yet go into the Loblaws larger grocery stores just up the road from here, same cheese, 5x the price and packaged up in 50 and 100g packets.

But there is domestic cheese available that's pretty much the same as many of the European types, if you know where to look for them. My parents had friends in Alberta near Sylvan Lake, every time they came home from visiting them, brought home a large wheel of cheese produced by a dutch dairy farmer in that area, full size wheel of essentially the same as a Gouda out of Europe. There is another one, farm a little ways out of Kelowna we discovered a couple years ago driving by in the motorhome. Same deal, milking their own cows and making cheese using the European methods, producing essentially the same stuff domestically. I'm sure there are plenty of operations doing similar farther east in the country, but most folks dont know about them because it's a product not available in Superstore.

I'm sure it's like many other products folks say 'not available', but it is available, if you just know where to look for it.

Anyways, not much point in carrying this conversation any farther, you folks want something to complain about, and this is the hill you have chosen, so be it.

[pelmet]

I think the key line in the previous response is that European cheese(or at least a good selection of it) is available if you know where to look for it.

So, for millions of Canadians without a car, you have to walk far or or maybe take a bus or taxi somewhere to a specialty shop, as an extra trip, instead of getting it at your convenient grocery store. If you want convenience, you have to buy the Canadian made stuff, and supposedly, it is similar to the European cheese. A good example of how it works.

[CpnCrunch]

I think the key line in the previous response is that European cheese(or at least a good selection of it) is available if you know where to look for it.

So, for millions of Canadians without a car, you have to walk far or or maybe take a bus or taxi somewhere to a specialty shop, as an extra trip, instead of getting it at your convenient grocery store. If you want convenience, you have to buy the Canadian made stuff, and supposedly, it is similar to the European cheese. A good example of how it works.

Superstore, Country Grocer, etc. all have lots of European cheeses. Not really hard to find, and I don't think people are protesting on bridges about it.

[pelmet]

I think the key line in the previous response is that European cheese(or at least a good selection of it) is available if you know where to look for it.

So, for millions of Canadians without a car, you have to walk far or or maybe take a bus or taxi somewhere to a specialty shop, as an extra trip, instead of getting it at your convenient grocery store. If you want convenience, you have to buy the Canadian made stuff, and supposedly, it is similar to the European cheese. A good example of how it works.

Superstore, Country Grocer, etc. all have lots of European cheeses. Not really hard to find, and I don't think people are protesting on bridges about it.

Great. I have no superstore or country grocer anywhere near me. I do have a car but what about the people in the apartment buildings bear me that don't have a car?

And protests on bridges(or lack of) are an irrelevant argument.

[pdw]

Protesting on bridges

Some groups are still up there on bridges occasionally (QEW) although I thought that was still from when we were praising the truckers so highly (ie thank you truckers for your service) thru covid, then way later relentlessly not caring about their vaccine objection before it got out of hand.

Maybe the specialty cheese can also be delivered to our doorsteps like so much else that’s showing up there these days?

As for the OP, definitely gotta buy Canadian now … whether car or pickup truck ..