Porter slides off the taxiway in YHM

[Sulako]

A Porter Airlines Embraer E195 arriving from Edmonton slid off the taxiway at John C Munro Airport on Wednesday Feb 18th.

This is the second taxiway excursion in a week for Porter - they had one in YHZ a few days ago.

[Speedbrakes]

In addition to runway condition codes we might need to start taxiway conditions codes.

Cargojet went off a taxiway too. And they went off B. So both C and B (the only two ways of getting to the ramp) were in such bad condition that two planes slid off the taxiways.

[Orion's Fannypack]

Agreed on the enhanced reporting requirements for taxiways. I was out on the east coast recently and asked about the taxiways and was basically given a "what you see is what you get". We definitely crept along and with 30-40kt wind gusts, it was not a fun feeling at all.

Looking at the YHM picture, looks comparable to the short track speed skating course in Milan. Yikes.

[pelmet]

If the taxiways turn out to be glare ice, might want to stop and get the sweeping(or urea vehicles) to go ahead of you first. Could take a while. Residual engine thrust could be an issue of really slippery. Maybe have the APU already running in case you decide to shut down engines quickly. Then again, maybe they can be used in windy conditions to maintain control. Maybe get towed in.

To be honest, the only widespread smooth glare ice that I have ever been on in a wheeled aircraft was a C172 after the big ice storm. It was like a hockey rink and I could taxi around with the brakes on and the wheels not moving. yet, I did have enough friction to be able to control the aircraft at one or two mph but there was no wind, which can make things much worse. In addition, it was cold enough that the smooth ice was dry. If smooth ice is wet, all bets are off.

[Donald]

I came really close to hitting the rhubarb in YHM off a taxiway before. It went from slush to ice with no warning. Afterwards I found out that the airport only maintains some taxiways, for example the one that goes to the CJ hangar doesn't get much treatment.

[oldnbold]

Would you hit the reversers?

[Donald]

Every situation is different.

If you can maintain directional control, then yes use reverse thrust. When it's that slippery, you will likely have to use a balancing act of assymetric reverse thrust, forward thrust, tap dancing on the brakes, maybe some tiller if you're lucky.

In my case, I was able to get the aircraft tracking sideways down the middle of the taxiway, and stopped before the straightaway ended.

[digits_]

In addition to runway condition codes we might need to start taxiway conditions codes.

How would that work in practice though, 15 minute long ATIS messages?

Did these planes do something different than all the others who did not slide off? Or was it just pure luck?

[Dry Guy]

Yes, you have to keep 'flying' the plane while on the ground. There are enough control surfaces, forward, reverse, and asymmetric thrust that you don't actually need surface friction at all to taxi an airplane around. Would I willingly do this in a transport category jet? Absolutely not but the skills I learned on those early spring water-covered ice strips could hopefully keep me off the news if I get surprised by a low friction surface. I'd imagine some pilots have never seen snow or ice before their first winter here.

[goingnowherefast]

In my experience, it can be largely luck. Liquid water on the surface turns to ice very quickly. One airplane taxis across 1/8" liquid water with great traction. 5 minutes later, the next plane gets a sheet of ice. Even with chemical applied in active precipitation, more snow adds more water content and dilutes the chemical. Suddenly the chemical concentration isn't enough to keep everything liquid, and the next plane gets a sheet of ice.

I've certainty taxied onto a ramp, and seen the nice reflective sheen of ice everywhere and gone "oh shit". Luckily, I was able to slow down before anything bad happened.