chief pilot

intel · Post by **intel** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 6:38 pm

Does it help being a chief pilot in your pilot career?

Will it make you more marketable in the future and will it help getting work at an airline?

These questions and many more to come.

intel

cloudrunner · Post by **cloudrunner** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 6:46 pm

And for those with an opinion/knowledge on the subject... what is the procedure for getting approved as CP.

Thanks

phillyfan · Post by **phillyfan** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 7:01 pm

Be approved by transport, write an exam, do a face to face interview and away you go.

intel · Post by **intel** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 7:17 pm

how hard can the exam be?..... right

and the interview?... easy? or hard?

but will future employers look at your resume differently when you have been a chief pilut?

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 7:47 pm

You may also consider what effect being chief pilot for Sonic Blue will have on the future of present chief pilot that was there when the OC was pulled.

And there are probably a few more Sonic Blues still operating.

Look at the risk exposure and weigh that against any possible advantage to accepting the position.

Cat

Bede · Post by **Bede** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 7:52 pm

I personally would not do it again unless I would recieve a substantial pay increase. You carry a lot of responsibility on your shoulders, and if something happeneds, you're going to be the fall guy.

Ask Nick Chapman (Regency) what it's like when the poop hits the fan.

co-joe · Post by **co-joe** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 8:02 pm

Goodness grascious me, the CFI interview for me was 3 inspectors (2 PLT and 1 M&M) lambasting me with questions. They encircled me in the cauldron and begain firing away with a barrage of artillery intermixed with small arms fire. Ready to curl up in a ball and start crying, I did what any body would do. I pulled out my laptop, opened the trusty old CARs and returned fire.

God only knows what purgatory awaits the unsuspecting chief pilot at the hands of these mercinaries.

Okay I got nothin. Carry on...

HO Driver · Post by **HO Driver** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 8:04 pm

intel · Post by **intel** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 8:10 pm

yes to be the chief pilot at Sonic Blue would have bad for the career.

What I want to know is if you are a good C.P for a good company and you walk away with a good reference. Nothing major happens on your shift so to say.

Then it must be good for your career right!

Cmon the sonic Blue problem is a side issue. keep to the thread please!!

Intel

oldtimer · Post by **oldtimer** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 8:15 pm

I have done the CP/Ops Mgr exam twice. Once for North American Airlines and once for Westex. It is basically testing you ability to wade through the CARS and you company Ops manual. It is all open book. It has been suggested that you use the paper copy of the CARS supplied by TC as opposed to a laptop or computer because it is faster. All depends on how much of a nimble-fingered switch flicker you are.

intel · Post by **intel** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 8:20 pm

How long does the whole process take from applying to getting accepted?
How much study is involved to do the exam?
Thanks for the reply Oldtimer

Intel

heropsychodreamer · Post by **heropsychodreamer** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 9:05 pm

The process is fairly simple. If a company is in need of a CP, TC will generally give them 30 days to replace the outgoing CP. If you meet the requirements (PIC, ATPL - for 2 eng IFR...) then TC will send you a letter that will allow you to write the exam. The exam consists of 60 questions selected from the 100 in the study guide. You need 80% to pass. It's the easiest exam you will ever write. Once the exam is done you do the TC interview. My experience is that they asked questions from the same study guide as the written exam. In the next couple of days you will get a letter saying that you are approved for CP.

I think having CP on your resume helps just like any other qualification or type rating you might have. The question is; do you want to deal with the headache?

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 9:27 pm

Is it an advantage to have been chief pilot?

I am not sure, I was in that position for 5 companies two were 705 two were my own and one was 703/ 704 both fixed and helicopters.

Did it ever give me an advantage with an employer? I don't know

Looking back I guess it was experience, would I do it in todays world of CAR's?

Not a chance, the personal exposure is not worth it.

Cat

CAPGEN · Post by **CAPGEN** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 11:33 pm

I had a business prof in university that gave me a new impression on management. He came from poverty in India and climbed his way up the ladder through educational scholarships put up by companies and other institutions. I’m sure it has a lot to do with his upbringing, but I think I learned more from him about the ethics and responsibilities of good management than I did about whatever it was I was supposed to be there for.

A good manager is carrying on his/her shoulders the jobs & livelihoods of his employees and their families. They are staying on the ball and trying to make the decisions that are in the best interests of the company; what’s good for the company should be good for the employee.

Our old CP stepped up from senior line captain because, I believe, he thought he could improve the situation for the both the pilots and the company. He was a great communicator, humble, and well respected. Most guys in his situation in the same company make the company very aware about what they won’t do: work on days off, stay in that hotel, sign that bond, etc…and he never makes enough money.

I’m not saying that the CP isn’t compensated accordingly for his/her role, but this guy took what I’d say is a 20-25% increase in salary with about a 150% expansion of his previous job. These guys, whether it’s the CP, the Ops Manager, or whoever are the ones who take the calls at 2AM when the a/c has a snag away from base with clients on board and has to make the decisions that will have a direct effect on safety, customer service, and therefore the bottom line.

I can’t say I like or admire every CP I’ve ever met, but I do respect them for the role that they play.

In the words of the Indian professor, “A good manager is the one who says “no”. The one who says “yes” all the time isn’t looking out for the best interests of the company or you as the employee.”

Dust Devil · Post by **Dust Devil** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 11:53 pm

Actually now that they have created the accountable executive position there is not as much liability as people like to think they have.

bezerker · Post by **bezerker** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 12:35 am

I thought the 704 CP exam (closed book) was hard as hell. Many ridiculous questions.

eg: Which of the following requires an OC?

a) a farmer, spraying his crops within a 25nm radius of his home
etc, etc....

I thought the closed book was not very pertinant to reality, as I have not recently seen anyone from TC make a judgement call without scrutinizing the CARs.

Wasn't Me · Post by **Wasn't Me** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 5:30 am

Just so we get the requirements on one page.

For a 703 multi you need an ATPLurrent IFR current PPC on one of the aircraft.

Have at least 250 PIC multi in the last 3 years, passed a written exam that the company PI reccomends you for and pass a verbal exam. the company owner has to then nominate and appoint you.

If you do the job properly it's a good thing to have on a resume but if you let the boss use you , then you'll be busy hiding for a very long time. Don't forget the junior pilot to is the captain of tomorrow and he has a good memory.

Check out cars 703 and 723 for further.

right now I'm busy hiding

flyinthebug · Post by **flyinthebug** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 5:52 am

Intel.. Ive been a CP twice in my career thus far. It all depends on what avenue you are pursuing in aviation. Whether or not you are considering management as a career or a line position? If you are like many and want to fly the big tin and progress as a line pilot then i`d say dont waste your time and energy (LOTS is required) to be a CP. There is ALOT of crap that goes with the title and Cat Driver was correct in saying that the exposure that a CP/Ops Mgr gets via the CAR`s just doesnt seem worth the personal risk.

For me personally, being a CP was important as I was seeking management positions further down the road. For most though, unless you are aspiring to management, then dont take the risks involved with wearing the hat.

The process has been explained well above. Apply to air service. Get job offer for CP. Company sends in a nomination form via fax (takes 5 mins to get to inspectors desk) TC sends back a date (usually within requested time frame) to air service for you to write and do your oral (usually same day service for this one). Get 80% on written and know how to get where your going in the CAR`s and bang, your the next CP for that op. The exam couldnt be easier, but the oral can be intense espically if they dont know you they will grill you a bit. Just know your way through the CAR`s and all will be fine.

Good Luck to you.
Fly safe, Cheers

185_guy · Post by **185_guy** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 7:40 am

but the oral can be intense espically if they dont know you they will grill you a bit. Just know your way through the CAR`s and all will be fine.

I've done the interview twice now. (703 VFR single ops) and the interviews were mostly based on the ops manual, and mostly on the training program section. Any of the CARS questions they ask will mostly be in your ops manual anyways. However to be a cp for this type of op is probally just a drop in the bucket compared to the multi/ifr stuff.

Good Luck.

the professional · Post by **the professional** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 7:43 pm

I think it would all depend weather you did a good job or not. Getting the position is easy - doing well is slightly more challenging.

snaproll20 · Post by **snaproll20** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:33 pm

If you want to be a Chief Pilot, just be aware that, like a professional sports coach, you are hired to be fired.

There are few companies who are good to work for.
You will work your ass off for some ingrate who will drop you like a hot potato if TC comes around and finds the slightest thing wrong. In other words, you are responsible to everyone. Your name, and therefore your ass is on the OC. Anyone can lie about you and drop you in the glue.

You will be stuck between the pilots and management, shovel the shit for everyone. You will be given no time, support, equipment or understanding from upper management.

Be sure to demand the most possible money as you will be worth every dime and what you save will carry you to the next disastrous hiring you may contemplate.

Other than that, it's not too bad................