Air Force

av8tor_assrope · Post by **av8tor_assrope** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:36 pm

a mate of mine sometimes lurks through avcanada. his name is mcrit. send a pm off to him. he has tons of civi time (aerobatic class 1 yadyadayada) and he's enrolled to be a pilot in the cf. he's currently in st jean doing basic.

cheers

mg777 · Post by **mg777** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 6:13 pm

Siggy wrote:So, if you don't get your wings, where does that leave you? Do they try to stick you in another trade? Are you on a contract already, or can you just say bye its been fun.

You can either pick another trade or release from the CF.

I put in my application, I have military experience (communications reserves), I got my CPL but took several years away from flying to polish off my degree, now its a question of waiting for the recruiters to get back to me or chasing ramp jobs etc. I'd love to fly for the CF, but if I cant get in as a pilot Ill go the civy road and enjoy my military adventures with the reserves.

Good plan. You should get a call. If you are in the comm reserves, you don't have to redo the CFAT unless you didn't qualify for Officer. (Not sure if you are NCM or Officer). So you might be ahead of the game. The only things that might prevent you from being accepted are the medicals and Aircrew Selection. If you fail aircrew and have a CPL or PPL, when you reapply, you have to have the next level up. If you went to a recognized aviation college, you bypass ASC. Just fly the instruments when in Trenton. "Do it the CF way" I heard it a lot.

Good luck. I watched a Herc here in Ottawa today (not sure why he was here) doing some approaches that were not what I was used to seeing Big Red do. (I live close to YOW) Makes me wish I was still in the game.

Oh well, maybe next year.

Invertago · Post by **Invertago** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:36 pm

Well, I PMed mcrit. Not that I am impatient with waiting for the CF, but this is the time of the year to go hunting for ramp jobs too, I'd hate to miss a summer on the ramp because I was waiting for the CF to call me, then again, Id hate to just get started on a ramp job then have to leave for CF testing etc. First jobs in aviation are important and if I end up going the civilian route I want to make a good first impression and stick around with the company a while.

Raybanman · Post by **Raybanman** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 1:44 pm

disco wrote: Pretty much all of our bases are in far-removed locations where there really isn't a ready supply of civvie pilots. Doubt there are many commercial pilots kickin' around in Cold Lake, Bagotville or even Trenton. I suppose Borden might be an exception but I think that is just whirly birds.

Hey, I live close to cold lake! It wouldn't take more than saay a week in an interrogation room to force me to fly a hornet or a Herc. I mean can't be much harder than a twin otter right?

Cheers,
PP

av8tor_assrope · Post by **av8tor_assrope** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:51 pm

be patient with mcrit. he may not answer right away. last time i talked to him they tossed the recruits into the forest for a few days. also be patient with the cf. i've been waiting a few months for my cic app to get processed and have yet to schedule an interview or a medical.

cheers

Invertago · Post by **Invertago** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:57 pm

Hmmm, any suggestions where a guy with a CPL (havent finished my multi IFR or instructor rating) can go for some work, sky diving, ramp etc, hopefully either on vancouver island or edmonton area. I might as well try to get my foot in the door somewhere while I wait for the airforce, incase the airforce doesnt work out.

mellow_pilot · Post by **mellow_pilot** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 1:36 am

Wow, seems there are alot of us waiting to hear from the boys in relish.

I was told that BC only had 4 slots for CEOTP this year. (fiscal year I think)
I know that atleast 1 has been taken. The race is on!!

I'm kinda unhappy about the no promotion til wings with CEOTP. It seems a bit rediculous to me. Could it be that this is only the case if you haven't gotten your degree? I can't imagine them holding back rank once you have a sheepskin.

I was also told that each CEOTP contract is more or less unique to your situation, i.e. they may take you for training right away, or if you could fininsh school in a year or so they'll have you do that first. Anyone else heard similar?

mg777 · Post by **mg777** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 6:32 am

mellow_pilot wrote:Wow, seems there are alot of us waiting to hear from the boys in relish.

I was told that BC only had 4 slots for CEOTP this year. (fiscal year I think)
I know that atleast 1 has been taken. The race is on!!

I think there was 48 total slots. Talking to my MCC, apparently they were still short by around 35 last year despite CEOTP. I am not sure if they only make so many availble to a recruting centre or if they just take the most qualified candidates. If so, I really passed on a once in a life time opportunity.

To give you an application timeline, I applied last october. I had a conditional offer on March 13 for a BOTC date of April 15th. The recruiting centre was basically shut down for a month during the "Holiday" season. So you can do the math. I can tell you that at this time of the year, they are busy. It is fiscal end until April 1, the Reserves are swamped with applications from University/College students for summer jobs and they are processing a lot of ROTP applications as well. Not to mention, every element is on a hiring spree. BE PATIENT at the same time, don't put all of your eggs into one basket; go about looking for other jobs. Siggy's on the right track. Every so often, not every day, you can call and see if they received your file and where you stand etc.

I'm kinda unhappy about the no promotion til wings with CEOTP. It seems a bit rediculous to me. Could it be that this is only the case if you haven't gotten your degree? I can't imagine them holding back rank once you have a sheepskin. I was also told that each CEOTP contract is more or less unique to your situation, i.e. they may take you for training right away, or if you could fininsh school in a year or so they'll have you do that first. Anyone else heard similar?

I did have a few conversation's with a recruit on a different site that managed to get what he wanted. He had an aviation diploma from a college that the CF recognizes. He was then able to proceed as a normal DEO or ROTP applicant would. He also made more money in the reserves and under CANFORGEN, he was supposed to make close to his reserve salary though. Originally though, his offer was exactly the same as any other CEOTP applicant. I guess you can try and play with it should you receive an offer. How flexible are they with Joe CEOTP? I don't know. Maybe an actual CF'er can chime in on that. It might have to do with how many qualified applicants they have? I dunno. There is one good thing though. When you get your wings (if you do) you go from OCDT to LT and skip over 2nd LT.

You have to think about what you are getting though! It probably pays more than a ramp job and a ramp job most certainly won't pay for your university degree, give you officer training, survival courses, wip your ass into shape not to mention give you the best flight training available while paying you. OJT (on the job training) may take as long as a ramp job before you start training but you can start you correspondence for your BA in basket weaving, start making contacts, go for a flight in a CF aircraft. Where else can you go on to fly a Herc, Buff, Airbus, 188 or chopper right after training?

*sigh* - wish things were different for me. Maybe next year IF CEOTP is still open.

Anyway - good luck. Member stay positive. It is a long process but well worth the wait.

Invertago · Post by **Invertago** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 1:34 pm

Well, I just got my degree (basket weaving with honors

) so I’m aiming for the ROTP route, hopefully that helps my chances. My flight training was just through several non recognized flight schools. I don't want to pay to finish my Multi IFR incase I do get in the CF, but I'd love to fly sky divers or something while waiting to get in. Does anyone know of any schools on Vancouver island or in Edmonton that take new guys. Also, any advice on how I apply, do I do it formally w/ resume appointment etc, or just get in contact to see if they are looking for anyone right now? Dress casual? Or? Just wondering as they are less about the flying and more about the sport how is it best to approach them.

petite · Post by **petite** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 5:04 pm

Anyone gone through the recruiting process to be an a/c tech?

av8tor_assrope · Post by **av8tor_assrope** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 5:53 pm

nooo...but i had a chat with a guy by the name of maj.wellington who is co of some training sqn or something at cfb bordon. he said for reserves it can take as little as a few months to get you procesed or even up to a year. at the time i spoke to him a few months back they were looking for people. if you're thinking about going to trenton for reserves forget about it. they have a waiting list of like 50 people. your best bet is to target a smaller sqn at a smaller base or go reg force and than tranfer to any res unit you want once your reg force commitment is up.

cheers

Invertago · Post by **Invertago** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 6:50 pm

It took me about 6 months to get in the communication reserves in Nanaimo. I missed going on basic the first summer, and was a untrained private for a year, aka I made coffee and swept the floors at the base as a weekend job. Now 5 years later, trades qualified I am in charge of a HF radio detachment (when it isnt broken) and it can be quite fun. No idea how long it will take to get in to the AF as a a/c tec, in my experience I have seen them rush paperwork in a matter of weeks, or skip steps when they really want to get stuff done. I have gone on courses with out the necessary military drivers license, or security clearances, just because they wanted me to go, so the CF is unpredictable by nature. Don't put all your eggs in one baseket, I'm waiting on them right now and plan to try to start my own flying career incase they take a long time, or incase I don't make air crew. Best of luck with them

Looking4Higher · Post by **Looking4Higher** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 7:17 pm

Hey Guys and Gals

I am a CEOTP candidate living in Ontario with 3000+ hours flying a twin turboprop.

I started the application process the begining of October '05. Even as a serving Officer in the Reserves I had to go through the recruiting centre and the interview process.

Aircrew Selection was the end of Feb '06, and yes with a ATPL and the time I have I still had to do the sim eval and medical. Got the job offer a week and a half ago, and start IAP/BOTC the 8th of April.

Because I don't have a degree the enrolement contract that I had to sign was for 12 years. 2yrs = Wings (In a perfect world), 7yrs commitment, 3yrs = education. For some reason DND adds 3 years for you to get your degree. Apparently this only happens if your between courses, they may send you to school for a semester. But most complete their degree through correspondence.

As far as promotion, through CEOTP you are an OCDT until you get your wings. That being said, once you recieve your wings you become a Lt. and you recieve retro pay as a 2Lt. from the time you completed Basic training until wings. Which really sucks cause it is a lump sum and you get dinged big time on tax. You can throw it into an RRSP to cut down on the tax hit.

Hope this helps for you guys waiting for a call. If you have any questions don't hesitate to ask.

Cheers

Looking

Invertago · Post by **Invertago** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 11:59 pm

So where are they doing the Officer Basic for the airforce right now, and anyone know how often they run the course? Once you finish Basic, do you go right on to the french training?

Looking4Higher · Post by **Looking4Higher** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 6:17 pm

With SLT (Second Language Training), it IS suppose to come after IAP/BOTC.

That being said, when I went in to the CFRC and signed all the papers that I was required to sign, my job offer had a final paragraph that stated "Applicant is to be reminded that normally he/she will be required to undergo up to 33 consecutive weeks of SLT at CFLS St. Jean following successful compeletion of IAP/BOTC. SLT will normally be completed prior to the commencement of any MOC training."

So how I interpret that and how it has been explained to me is that becasue of the "shortage" of pilots currently in the CF, SLT will either be completed sometime during my career or not at all. Worst case for me is that I do the SLT, no harm no faul. They are going to pay me to learn to speak french...fine.

Looking

mg777 · Post by **mg777** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:16 am

Looking,

Did they give you an idea as to how long you would have to wait for advanced flight training in MJ?

Looking4Higher · Post by **Looking4Higher** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:09 pm

As far as the flight training end of things, I have been in the military long enough to know that until you are actually there doing it, don't count on it.

I have heard three different versions of "Your training will follow this path". I am just planning on the long plan. Military courses seldom run concurrently. That being said, I figure 3 years to wings.

What I have heard that the new contractor (or consortium) that is providing the PFT in Portage la Prarie (Headed by Kelowna Flightcraft) is behind on training and that they got rid of the Slingsby and purchased new Grob 120's and are currently having a class go through the program as "Guinea Pigs" to sort out any flaws. So it is FUBAR'd right now in the training end of things until they get everythings sorted out. Its gotta be tough taking over a program of this magnitude.

If anyone else out there is heading to St. Jean this weekend for IAP give me a shout.

Looking

Pyleosnow · Post by **Pyleosnow** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 3:19 pm

As someone in the slt now i wouldnt count on bypassing it right now. I was fed the same stuff from my recruiting center. Also they said 2.5 years to 3 for wings. Right now ive heard that the earliest POSSIBLE is june 07, for MJ more than likely longer though. There are currently 30 pilots on the slt course, with i assume more finishing botp next week. so ill let you do the math there. That being said the SLT course is pretty easy as far as hours go, and you make good money doing it. My advice if at all possible try not to live in the mega or at least get out as much as you can. Even with the delays i still dont regret leaving the civy side of things. 7.25 an hour as opposed to around 25 - 30. Anyhow thats all, any questions on botp iap or slt feel free to ask.