Canadian Air Force

Avro87 · Post by **Avro87** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 1:09 am

I was just wondering if there are any members of avcanada that are in the airforce? If there is, I would love to hear about what kind of life you lead, annual flying hours, the training experience, overseas experience etc.??? I'm planning to apply this fall for ROTP. I've nearly got my CPL and will be getting a diploma in commercial aviation and a degree in business.

Also, I'd like to hear other's opinons about the air force route for aviation.

Beacon Final · Post by **Beacon Final** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 8:50 am

Thanks to the Gov't you wont be in the airfore you will be in the Canadian Forces. You know like when the press calls airmen, "soliders".....

Another thing the gov't has done is make sure that my hot tube has more jet than our so called airforce....

But on a lighter note our men and women are the best in the world.... Always doing more with less... remember William Tell back in 96?

The only thing I would becareful of is that unless you have gone to Toronto for you medical and testing.... .you better watch out for what trade they will throw you in. I just hope that you have it in writing that your MOC (Military Occupation Code) is Aircrew.... or Pilot not NAV....

So watch out

But good luck, it must be great to be your age and have a great career ahead of you....

Congrats

Diddy · Post by **Diddy** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:05 am

Avro,

I joined up in '99 ROTP, did the RMC thing, graduated in '03, hit Moose Jaw September '03, got wing'd December '04. So, I'm pretty much a baby when it comes to experience/overseas stuff, but what I can tell you thus far is that its been awesome. Great people, great working environment, great pay... (http://www.forces.gc.ca/dgcb/dppd/pay/e ... sidecat=28)

Quality of life can be an issue, when it comes to postings that is. If you want to go the jet route, then either brush up on your french or be happy living in Northern Alberta. That being said, there are some pretty sweet postings for the maritime helicopter dudes (Halifax, Pat Bay near Victoria.) It all depends. And to be honest, you're there for the love of the job, and most dudes are quite happy living no matter where.

As for the flying hours thing, well that all varies. You could potentially log up to 300+ hours a year flying multi engine or rotary, (that may be underestimating,) while up to 200 or so in the jet community. If you stay in Moose Jaw to instruct on the Harvard or Hawk, that could be upwards of 500 a year.

What Beacon says is true, be careful with the recruiters. Be adament about wanting the pilot thing. Its been a few years since I went through the process, but don't let them convince you to put anything else down. They wanted three choices from me. That was too easy, they all began with P and ended with ilot. "Do you like long walks in the woods? How about camping?? Well, then we have a great job for you!" Ya not so much...

Haven't worked a day since I left RMC...

Good luck man, any other questions, PM me.

Goler

Diddy · Post by **Diddy** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:08 am

And that smiley face thingy at the end of the web link I put is supposed to be an 8...

groundpilot · Post by **groundpilot** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 11:35 am

As a DEO I wouldnt be too worried about being stuck in a different military occupation(MOC) because without obligatory service you can quit at anytime so don't feel like you can be trapped. ROTP on the other hand is a different story. If the pilot thing doesnt work you still owe them time for the education they gave you.

There is a lot of positives and negatives about the CF but I would say that a 200hr wonder is the ideal candidate. You have a good aviation background but at the same time you have minimal experience so you can handle the brainwashing of the military training system. If you look at some of the most successful CF pilots ie the Snowbirds you will find many with a similar background.

Avro87 Check your PMs.

Cheers, any questions let me know.

Lommer · Post by **Lommer** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:20 pm

Groundpilot, I'm not 100% sure what you mean, but are you trying to say that if I enter the CF the DEO plan, then there is no minimum length of service for pilots? Just checking b/c that's what I thought you said and its completely different from my current understanding of CF recruitment.

oates76 · Post by **oates76** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:39 pm

If you go DEO (Direct Entry Officer) meaning you already have a university degree, you don't have to commit to your military contract until you have been assured flight crew status. So if you don't make it for whatever reason (for me it was a problem with my eyes), you don't owe them anything.

And make damn sure you have super fantastic eyeballs. All my previous medicals I'd just barely snuck by with 20/20, but once I got to the screening test for the military, I was out, with apparent V2 vision. Go figure.

Avro87 · Post by **Avro87** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:03 pm

Thanx to everyone who gave me some input! It was very helpful.

Blakey · Post by **Blakey** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 7:15 pm

[quote="Beacon Final"]Thanks to the Gov't you wont be in the airfore you will be in the Canadian Forces. You know like when the press calls airmen, "soliders".....

http://www.airforce.forces.gc.ca/

groundpilot · Post by **groundpilot** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 7:40 pm

Lommer wrote:Groundpilot, I'm not 100% sure what you mean, but are you trying to say that if I enter the CF the DEO plan, then there is no minimum length of service for pilots? Just checking b/c that's what I thought you said and its completely different from my current understanding of CF recruitment.

Once your wings qualified you owe 7 years. Average time to get wings is about 3 years so count on a minimum of 10 years total.

Otter envy · Post by **Otter envy** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:52 pm

Just wondering what you'll have heard about the CEOTP program. Is it still active and if so how hard is adhearing to the requirements.

I have a application in process and am looking for feedback, or at least something other than the company line.

Glory. · Post by **Glory.** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:19 pm

oates76 wrote:If you go DEO (Direct Entry Officer) meaning you already have a university degree, you don't have to commit to your military contract until you have been assured flight crew status. So if you don't make it for whatever reason (for me it was a problem with my eyes), you don't owe them anything.

And make damn sure you have super fantastic eyeballs. All my previous medicals I'd just barely snuck by with 20/20, but once I got to the screening test for the military, I was out, with apparent V2 vision. Go figure.

Is that non-correctable to 20/20? Or correctable?

w squared · Post by **w squared** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:25 pm

To be a pilot in the CF? You need to have a V1 vision category. That means 20/20 or better vision in both eyes without glasses, as well as depth perception and colour vision.

Lommer · Post by **Lommer** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 3:25 pm

man, I'd heard the 10 years figure before, but I thought that was in connection to the ROTP? I'm only slightly worried about my vision, as I scored 20/15 last time I was tested (better than 20/20) so assuming my depth perception + colour are ok I think I'd be alright. Just out of curiosity, how many years do you owe total if you go the RMC route (it's too late for me to do that now as I almost have my degree from elsewhere)?

Jeeze, 10 years is long...

monkeyspankmasterflex · Mon Apr 03, 2006 4:29 pm

You owe 7 years once you get your wings. If you're a DEO (already have a degree) it'll probably take you 4 years to get your wings, and given that Portage has been transitioning to a new contract, 4 years might even be optimistic.

groundpilot · Post by **groundpilot** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:03 pm

w squared wrote:To be a pilot in the CF? You need to have a V1 vision category. That means 20/20 or better vision in both eyes without glasses, as well as depth perception and colour vision.

This isnt entirely true. Depending on how you look at it military vision requirements are actually less then civie street.

You need at least 20/20 in ONE eye and at least 20/30 in the other. I have absolute bare mins because this is what I have. The funny thing is on my civie medical I need glasses but when I fly military I don't. You think it would be the other way around considering we are cruising substantially faster and usually without any radar control.

There is no depth perception requirement because I would have failed and yes they do that stupid color test.

I will get my wings in 2.5 years in Moose Jaw and ALL my counterparts going to Portage will have done it less than 3 even with all this contract business. They are increasing the capacity of the training system because even as dumb as the CF can be sometimes they critically need trained pilots.

w squared · Post by **w squared** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:28 pm

I stand corrected. That's what I was told the requirements were for V1, but given that it was very obvious from day 1 that I was V2 (20/40 uncorrected in both eyes), I didn't look too hard at it.

Thanks for giving us the scoop.

Glory. · Post by **Glory.** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:33 pm

monkeyspankmasterflex wrote:You owe 7 years once you get your wings. If you're a DEO (already have a degree) it'll probably take you 4 years to get your wings, and given that Portage has been transitioning to a new contract, 4 years might even be optimistic.

If you're DOA in afghanistan then itll probably take you eternity to get your wings, given that God hasnt given you a new contract, eternity might even be optimistic

groundpilot · Post by **groundpilot** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:57 pm

Glory. wrote:
monkeyspankmasterflex wrote:You owe 7 years once you get your wings. If you're a DEO (already have a degree) it'll probably take you 4 years to get your wings, and given that Portage has been transitioning to a new contract, 4 years might even be optimistic.
If you're DOA in afghanistan then itll probably take you eternity to get your wings, given that God hasnt given you a new contract, eternity might even be optimistic

DOA?

They don't send untrained people anywhere out of the country. Your hired as a pilot and thats it. Don't worry, the fine personnel actually there want to be there and serve their country and not themselves. Imagine that.

red-neck · Post by **red-neck** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:57 pm

Dead On Arrival

Just like your drinking abilities on a Friday night at the mess.

Expat · Post by **Expat** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 12:07 am

red-neck wrote:Dead On Arrival

Just like your drinking abilities on a Friday night at the mess.

Yeah, And you are more likely to die here in vehicle accident than a plane crash...

oates76 · Post by **oates76** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 6:46 am

Nope, you don't need to maintain it. It's just for intial recruitment. Once you have your wings your vision can slip and they'll keep you flying... hell they've spent enough money training you. But I'm sure there is a limit that your vision can not degrade below before they'll pull you off the flight line, I just don't know what that is.

Lommer · Post by **Lommer** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 10:11 am

I've heard though that if you get fast jet and your vision degrades they may switch you to transport.

One other question, does having a civvie PPL or CPL or any ratings do you any good as far as cutting training time down?

monkeyspankmasterflex · Tue Apr 04, 2006 11:26 am

If you're DOA in afghanistan then itll probably take you eternity to get your wings, given that God hasnt given you a new contract, eternity might even be optimistic

I'm a little slow, care to explain.

I will get my wings in 2.5 years in Moose Jaw and ALL my counterparts going to Portage will have done it less than 3 even with all this contract business.

That's outstanding. A couple of buds went through a number of years back and it took them 4-5yrs from enrollment to wings.

TheCheez · Post by **TheCheez** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 1:00 pm

Lommer wrote:I've heard though that if you get fast jet and your vision degrades they may switch you to transport.

One other question, does having a civvie PPL or CPL or any ratings do you any good as far as cutting training time down?

Used to be that if you had a recognized aviation diploma you could bypass portage. Previous experience will also help immensely with the information you'll get at Moose Jaw. Not sure if the CEOTP entry plan is still going though.

Canadian Air Force

Canadian Air Force

ha ha

thanx

Re: ha ha