What to do when the buzz is gone?

N2 · Post by N2 » Mon Jul 03, 2006 7:39 am

After trying for years and years to land a job in aviation I have finally given up. Now I find myself very ho-hum about the whole aviation scene and to be honest I find it nothing more than big money pit and nothing else. I have never been invovled with a industry that takes, takes, takes and gives so little in return. If I could do it all over again I would have done my private and stopped, I would have been thousands upon thousands of dollars better off not to mention putting my focus into a career that actually would have paid off.

Anyone ever been in this situation before themselves?
Question is do I sell the planes and invest the money or keep them and hope this feeling passes?

ditshisturber · Post by **ditshisturber** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 8:08 am

One should should remember that the aviation industry is NOT a huge guaranteed money maker, whether you are an owner or a line pilot. If you had aspirations of not only a lofty high flying day to day job, but an equally giant paycheque... you're in the wrong place.

We subject ourselves to the daily grind of this thankless industry... because we found something we couldn't find in a "joe job". The tradeoff of less money and more hours is a byproduct of the industry having the ability to pay us less to do a job that we enjoy so much. When was the last time you saw doctors sign a training bond for 5 years and 50K and fight each other to do the same job, for less money???

With student loans biting at my toes, the frustration of countless roadtrips, jockeying for position on a ramp for a glimmer of hope of getting on the line, and a poor excuse for a paycheque... I still have something stoking the fires to keep going. It will be this determination that will set me apart from the others and allow me to reach my goal... All I know is that it will be better than any job in an office tower in a cubicle.

Don't give up, and best of luck

Luscombe · Post by **Luscombe** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 9:48 am

Keeping in mind that this is coming from a guy who chose aviation as a "second career" in his working life, I too have had regrets but I have also enjoyed myself in this dog-eat-dog industry.

I used to work in a "cubical maze" which makes those Dilbert cartoons seem normal. I hated the place and the tyranical boss who ran the place like some 1930's sweat-shop. I couldn't stand it anymore and decided to work in aviation as a pilot. That was back in 1998 and I was 37 at the time. Everyone thought I was foolish and maybe a little "nuts" for giving up a "sure thing" to strike it out in a precarious and heartless industry. After getting my instructor rating, I quit with no job to go to yet.

I earned crap pay, got treated like crap, but I had an office with one of the best views possible. I just didn't give up and continued with my career because I enjoyed it. After a couple of years of instructing, I had to leave my wife and home behind to work up north to gain some experience other than instructing. This really sucked being away from my family, but I realized that it was "short-term pain for long-term gain". My next job was as an S/O on a 727, followed with F/O on a King Air 200 and now F/O on a 737.

The process took 8 years and I am just now starting to see a return on investment. I just about packed it in about 3 times during the process, but didn't because of 2 people. My wife has always been extremely supportive, and I had an uncle with the wisdom that only a hard life could give. My uncle was a professional musician in a country band. He never made it big, but he and his friends made music and entertained thousands of people over the run of 3 decades. He was never rich, but he was usually comfortable and happy. He told me that in the music industry, there were 10,000 guys just like him for every Mick Jagger. He'd be lucky to break 25-30K a year, while Mick makes a million just for showing his face somewhere. I saw the similarities of the music industry with the aviation industry; we both do what we love and others are there to capitalize on this by paying us crap and treating us like crap.

I fully realize that if I put the same amount of money and effort into any other industry, I would be much further ahead than I am now. Had I taken the money I spent on flight training and invested it in anything, I would DEFINITELY be much further ahead. If I was to do it all over again, I would still have chosen to be a pilot, mostly because I knew the heartless nature of the beast and my chances of never making it were good, but at least I knew what I was up against. I feel bad for the ones that don't know what they're up against before they get "lied to" by flight schools who paint a really rosy picture of the industry just to get your dollars on their accounts.

My advise is to think it over well before throwing in the towel.

snaproll20 · Post by **snaproll20** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 10:29 am

Henceforth you'll hear sound from above,
Look up with interest, unfilled love
To see what passes in the sky
And never answer the question.... "Why?"

Rowdy · Post by **Rowdy** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:36 pm

I dream of pale blue skies through bright blue eyes, that wonderful feel of a control wheel as the clouds zip by. The eternal bliss from the flying kiss has kept me this long, yet it’s hard to keep going on when I don’t know if I belong anywhere but there, up in those pale blue skies. They hold me down, I might drown, it’s going to be too long before those engines sing my song as we climb high into that incredible blue sky. The beauty the sky flaunts also taunts. It’s not just the air, but a feeling I swear. ~ Michael Wimmer

Couldn't have summed it up any better myself

Aviation is NOT the brightest way to earn the big bucks or a highly regarded respected position. I remember the numbers being.. 1 in 20 finish a commercial licence.. 1 in 45 of those make atpl and 1 in 1200 make it to an airbus or boeing. Best of luck to anyone and everyone who gets to where they want to go.

Hoser · Post by **Hoser** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 2:09 pm

So there's a chance!

bob sacamano · Post by **bob sacamano** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 2:30 pm

Hoser wrote:So there's a chance!

pianodude · Post by **pianodude** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 5:13 pm

i gave up flying totally five years ago and became a musician(how $#@$^ up is that?!). i still make more than i ever did flying and am having way more fun. i am now 45, also with an extremely supportive spouse. it's hard to say when to pack it in. for me it was being told to do one more flight on a 200' and a half mile vis day on a clapped out p.o.s. for less than i make playing a single gig versus a week of flying. something snapped and i just said ENOUGH!

McPhoo · Post by **McPhoo** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 4:02 pm

Luscombe. I couldn't have said it better. Each one of us has to decide when. Some will regret others will not. There has been several times I almost packed it in. One time the only reason I didn't was a very supportive phone call from my wife, God bless her, cause we all know what our families have sacrificed for our dreams.

Some of my best friends, trying to be helpful, were certifiable 'dream stealers'. I just had to follow my heart and do what was right for me. Money I have not much of but compared to the other dozen or so(literaly) types of work I have done. This is the one I truly love. Everyone needs enough money but when is enough? At some point I just had to decide where I was gonna put my carreer and not have regrets when I get old and tired. So far. I made the right choice. I love the work and fortunatly I have perhaps the best company at which to ply my trade which makes all the differance I know.

Not every one is meant for any one type of work. There is no dishonour in that. I spent a lot of money at college for something that turned out I didn't like. A waste? Nope. I found my wife there. Worth every penny! My point. We all must find our own path. It takes some detures sometimes but that is just the way it is.

I wish you best of luck in whatever life passes your way. If you decide to stay in aviation. Great. If not. Press on with whatever you find to turn your crank.

The only real secret here is: Find your passion and turn it into a profit.

Cheers
SM

P.S. HOSER. that was way too funny! OMG

Pete · Post by **Pete** » Thu Jul 06, 2006 4:45 pm

Aviation is NOT the brightest way to earn the big bucks or a highly regarded respected position. I remember the numbers being.. 1 in 20 finish a commercial licence.. 1 in 45 of those make atpl and 1 in 1200 make it to an airbus or boeing. Best of luck to anyone and everyone who gets to where they want to go

Is this an actual Statistic? Pretty neat to look at it like that.

yycflyguy · Post by **yycflyguy** » Thu Jul 06, 2006 8:23 pm

Pete wrote:
Aviation is NOT the brightest way to earn the big bucks or a highly regarded respected position. I remember the numbers being.. 1 in 20 finish a commercial licence.. 1 in 45 of those make atpl and 1 in 1200 make it to an airbus or boeing. Best of luck to anyone and everyone who gets to where they want to go
Is this an actual Statistic? Pretty neat to look at it like that.

Sure, 72.4% of all pilots know that.

JigglyBus · Post by **JigglyBus** » Thu Jul 06, 2006 8:34 pm

They've done studies, you know. 60% of the time, it's true every time.

Nark · Post by **Nark** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 12:20 am

I said 'screw it' to the Aviation scene in Canada.
I joined the Marine Corps. I have a steady paycheck, and a crapload of benefits. I havn't given up on flying though, as I've applied for a flying program with in the Corps.

Good luck.

niss · Post by **niss** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:53 am

If I may impose some poetic thought for a moment:

All our times have come
Here but now they're gone
Seasons don't fear the reaper
Nor do the wind the sun or the rain (we can be like they are)
Come on baby (don't fear the reaper)
Baby take my hand (don't fear the reaper)
We'll be able to fly (don't fear the reaper)
Baby I'm your man
La-la-la-la-la la-la-la-la-la

Valentine is done
Here but now they're gone
Romeo and Juliet
Are together in eternity (Romeo and Juliet)
40,000 men and women everyday (like Romeo and Juliet)
40,000 men and women everyday (redefine happiness)
Another 40,000 coming everyday (we can be like they are)
Come on baby (don't fear the reaper)
Baby take my hand (don't fear the reaper)
We'll be able to fly (don't fear the reaper)
Baby I'm your man
La-la-la-la-la la-la-la-la-la

Love of two is one
Here but now they're gone
Came the last night of sadness
And it was clear she couldn't go on
Then the door was open and the wind appeared
The candles blew then disappeared
The curtains flew then he appeared (saying don't be afraid)
Come on baby (and she had no fear)
And she ran to him (then they started to fly)
They looked backward and said goodbye (she had become like they are)
She had taken his hand (she had become like they are)
Come on baby (don't fear the reaper)

. ._ · Post by **. ._** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:58 am

Good post, niss, but I thought it needed something...

confuzed · Post by **confuzed** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 4:51 pm

Hey N2 sorry to hear that you're packing in the towel...if it's any consolation to you I've been in the game now for 11 years, and have recently been doing some long and hard thinking about giving it all up as well. The whole industry has lost its luster to me, and the past 8 months haven't really helped. What really hits home in the decision to push on comes to do with the realization that attaining the dreamed airline job is no longer a possibility. We'll see, I still have a little bit of fight left but it's fading fast, lol... Oh well, I'm sure there's lots of other cool careers out there and flying on the side would still be fun. I do wish you good luck in whatever venture you seek and may the roads ahead be smooth ones

Take care.

Kelowna Pilot · Post by **Kelowna Pilot** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:05 pm

N2,

Why don't you sell the plane and buy yourself a job so you can get some commercial flying experience, instead of just beating around the bush in Cessna.

The question is where can a man buy a job in Canada these days now that Regency is gone?

N2 · Post by N2 » Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:30 pm

2 things wrong with that...first off I don't fly a Cessna and second of all I would never "buy' myself a job.

Kelowna Pilot · Post by **Kelowna Pilot** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 8:27 pm

Why not become an instructor?

There is no dishonor in buying a job. I know a guy who bought a job (non aviation) at video store so he could learn how to run a video store.

He was an immigrant and needed the break.

Now he owns the video shop (and other businesses) and makes good money.

N2 · Post by N2 » Thu Jul 13, 2006 8:36 pm

KP with all due respect that topic has been beaten to death and I don't feel I would be doing any fellow aviators a favour by offering to buy my way in. Once it starts (buying jobs) it would only lead to a further decline of an already depressed market for pilots looking for that elusive break into the business.

ca787546 · Post by **ca787546** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 8:46 pm

I don't think buying a job is good at all. Buying training maybe... but buying a job sounds too much like taking a job from someone that needs it so that you can get ahead of them simply because you have the cash available.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding what was trying to be said.
Cheers,
DNB

Wilbur · Post by **Wilbur** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 8:13 am

The key to making this kind of career decision is to sit down and right up a list of what is important to you in life. Be honest with yourself and avoid selectively writing down things that support a preconceived notion. For example, money, job stability, love of flying, type of community to live in, family, quality of life for kids/spouse, career options for spouse, proximity to extended family, etc, etc.

You may, or may not, find that inspite of a love for flying, an aviation career is simply not going to provide the overall quality of life you want. Depending on your age or marital status, you may have to do this exercise with a bit of forward thinking. For example, "I would like to be married and start a family in 5 years, where can I reasonably expect to be in my career by then?"

If it doesn't look like aviation will work for you, don't be afraid to bail out and find another career. You can always fly privately or professionally part-time. I made that decision at a fairly young age after 3 years in aviation, and while I sometimes have the "what if" thoughts, I really don't regret my choice at all. I've had good success in my non-aviation career, have always been able to fly on the side, will retire in a few years (early fifties), and will probably return to aviation as a second 10 year or so career. I know a number of people who have done exactly this.

co-joe · Post by **co-joe** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 9:43 am

Oh I thought this was a thread about drinking or doing drugs. Usually when the buzz is gone I take a nap and start over. Alternatively you could just keep drinking but that only prolonges the pain (hair of the dog you know?).

xsbank · Post by **xsbank** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 10:01 am

As a pilot who has been doing this thing for way too long, my advice is to get your ducks in a row financially, for when you retire. If you don't make the airlines and that fat pension, you will be eating KD (overcooked - without benefits you won't have teeth!) and living in a trailer park in Fort St. John.

cow-tipping-in-the-night · Fri Jul 14, 2006 8:23 pm

when the buzz is gone?
then (in my opinion): GET OUT

do yourself a favour, don't be the victim.
don't take to complaining and falling into bitterness.
spare everyone the episodes where you go about as if you are trapped in your own life with no options.

Life is too short. if money is all you care about and it makes you unhappy that you are not making more of it, then move along and make way for those people who really enjoy flying and consider it a priveledge.

otherwise, make a choice to get up tomorrow and appreciate what you've got.