RVSM Testing

ahramin · Post by **ahramin** » Wed Jul 14, 2004 6:42 pm

Heard a couple aircraft that were doing RVSM test flights yesterday. Anyone know what this involves?

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Wed Jul 14, 2004 6:59 pm

Lower seperation over the Atlantic.

Cat

ahramin · Post by **ahramin** » Wed Jul 14, 2004 7:47 pm

Wow, when was the last time you flew anything other than a Cat Cat?

. Must be nice not to have to pay any attention to changes in Class A airspace. RVSM transition airspace now covers most of Canada below the 60th, including all of BC. The change was done concurrently with implementation of the U.S. domestic RSVM, which is everything from FL 290 to FL 410 over the contiguous U.S.

What i want to know is:

1. Why is a test flight necessary for an aircraft to be RVSM certified.
2. What does the flight test consist of.

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Wed Jul 14, 2004 7:57 pm

Hey, don't be to hard on me I let my instrument rating lapse last year and have not bothered to read up on something I don't use.

Actually most of our ferry flights are done VFR and if we need to file we file on US licenses.

How do I put a picture in a post from my desk top?

Cat

ahramin · Post by **ahramin** » Wed Jul 14, 2004 8:01 pm

You need to upload it somewhere. Mail it to me and i can put it up on my server, or you could upload it to the photo gallery if it passes the administrator's strict taste in photos.

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Wed Jul 14, 2004 8:11 pm

What do you mean mail it.. e-mail it?

What is your e-mail and Ill e-mail a couple of real neat PBY pictures from our Africa trip.

Cat

oldtimer · Post by **oldtimer** » Wed Jul 14, 2004 8:25 pm

I am not an expert in any way shape or form but the test, as I have read, involves the autopilot's ability to hold altitude to within 65 ft. at the aircraft's maximum certified ceiling. I believe it is a case of altitude reporting accuracy, alitiude holding ability and failure warning.

MWadham · Post by **MWadham** » Wed Jul 14, 2004 8:46 pm

Is RVSM being implemented world-wide? I read on some other forum its already in place over most of Africa....yes, Africa.

pushy boss · Post by **pushy boss** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 7:06 am

There are two ways an aircraft can be certified for flight in RVSM airspace. The first way is to carry the appropriate testing equipment in the aircraft that can verify the altitude reporting instruments are accurate within the the prescribed RVSM parameters. This requires a special test flight. The second way is to overfly certain designated RVSM testing VOR's that can confirm the aircraft's altitude, again within RVSM parameters. There are several of these facilities world wide. Once the aircraft has "passed" the particular requirements, an RVSM certificate is sent to the operator of the aircraft and is to be carried on board the aircraft with the aircraft documents.

Mostly Harmless · Post by **Mostly Harmless** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 8:35 am

The pilots also need RVSM training.

FamilyGuy · Post by **FamilyGuy** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 8:04 pm

RVSM is NOT implemented over the domestic USA. Not even close. In Canada RVSM is generally only available north of 57N with transition from 52N to 57N. There are some exceptions where it goes further south and that can be found in the AIP. Transition is for non-certified aircraft to still get through basically. When and if the US goes RVSM, there will be NO transition airspace!!! Which means if not certified NO flights above FL 280 period! That is the only way it can work. I doubt the US will be ready to do that by the target date of Jan 05.

control_man · Post by **control_man** » Fri Jul 16, 2004 7:20 am

Familyguy is correct. I work RVSM airspace as a controller. North of 52 degrees Lat is RVSM transition airspace. All aircraft certified or not fly at RVSM altitudes between FL290 and FL410. Certified aircraft can fly with 1000 ft spacing less than 5 miles radar separation. Any other combination (certified vs. non certified) still require 2000 ft spacing. Although the cruising altitudes for RVSm airspace are being apllied. Example: RVSM certified aircraft cruising eastbound at FL330. Westbound aircraft NON-CERTIFED enters transition airspace at FL350. This aircraft get moved to FL360 and can pass the certifed a/c because we now have 3000 ft. Or he can decend to FL300. FL 320 is NOT an option here as the NON-CERTIFED aircraft would only pass with 1000ft spacing with the certifed. Confusing? You bet it is for the controller. working transition airspace really keeps you on your toes when there is a big mix of certifed and non-certifed aircraft in the airspace. Hence the reason it is called transiton. North of 57 degrees lat, it is pure RVSM aircraft. Non-certifed aircraft must file FL280 or below unless they have prior approval to operate within its confines. (eg, state aircraft, miltary, photo, etc.)
European airspace is RVSM. North America is lagging behind. Canada took the initiative and is pushing the FAA to go RVSM. There have been several ongoing meetings over the issue with the FAA looking towards Canadian input into the implementation. I know of several controllers that have been down to the States to give briefings on RVSM and how it is implemented on a daily basis in Canadian airspace.
Canada will push for RVSM in domestic airpace all the way to the 49th parallel from FL290 to FL410 inclusive with a target date of January 2005. This is regardless of if the USA is ready or not. If carriers have not converted all there fleets by then they will be restricted to operate at lower altitudes. The stall in this issue is the USA. You guys might not believe me but the skies are getting quite crowded. This is a step in the right direction. These cruising levels help alleviate some of the congestion for controllers when we sart getting jammed up. Its cost effective for the airlines because of the options availabe for altitudes and optimal fuel burn. Step climbs for the long haulers are only quick hops of 2000ft verses attempts to jump 4000ft which usually resulted in requests for cruises at wrong way altitudes for some time until they were able to climb to an appropriate altitude for direction. This is win win for controllers and pilots. At least Canada understands this. The USA is only worried about the initial cost of all this and can't seem to look at the long term benefits of RVSM implementation. ICAO pressure from leading countries such as Canada is driving the US machine towards RVSM.

CONTROL_MAN

ahramin · Post by **ahramin** » Fri Jul 16, 2004 10:10 am

Thanks control man. The NavCanada website gives the impression that Canada is implementing RVSM consequently and concurrently to the U.S. doing so.

Petec · Post by **Petec** » Sun Jul 18, 2004 5:51 pm

I was on a Falcon 50 that was doing the RVSM testing. Basically after all the mods were done to the aircraft a Technician from some company in the states flew into Toronto and hooked up a laptop and several antennas inside the aircraft. He had a very accurate GPS system hooked to the computer that recorded everything. To do the test he needed to collect data for about 1 half hour in level cruise flight. I believe that we were at FL410. After the data is collected they also retrieve the radar data from Nav Canada or the FAA and they evaluate all of the information to see if the aircraft altitude has stayed with in limits and that the flight instruments and auto pilot are accurate.