Comair crash in Lexington, KY (Cockpit Voice Recording Trans

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:24 pm

The Transcript:

http://www.kentucky.com/multimedia/...ease/361245.pdf

For those who are not familiar CRJ, headstart flight, overran runway, crew departed from incorrect runway. (RW26 instead of RW22)

Golden Flyer · Post by **Golden Flyer** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:32 pm

The link that you provide does not work.

wingspan · Post by **wingspan** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:25 pm

http://wcpo.com/news/2007/local/01/17/morn/comair.pdf

wanpaku-ed · Post by **wanpaku-ed** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:42 pm

Quote from transcript:

"06:06:16.3
HOT-2 dat is weird with no lights.
06:06:18.0
HOT-1 yeah.
06:06:24.2
HOT-1 one hundred knots.
06:06:25.1
HOT-2 checks.
06:06:31.2
HOT-1 V one, rotate.
06:06:31.8
HOT-1 whoa.
06:06:32.2
CAM [unknown ambient noise]
06:06:32.6
HOT-1 #.
06:06:33.0
CAM [sound of impact]
36 of 36
INTRA-COCKPIT COMMUNICATION AIR-GROUND COMMUNICATION
TIME (EDT) TIME (EDT)
& SOURCE CONTENT & SOURCE CONTENT
DCA06MA064
06:06:33.3
HOT-? [unintelligible exclamation]
06:06:33.8
CAM [sound similar to stick shaker]
06:06:34.7
CAM [sound of chime]
06:06:34.7
CAM [sound similar to stall warning starts and continues to end of recording]
06:06:35.1
HOT-? #.
06:06:35.7
HOT-1 [unintelligible exclamation]
06:06:36.2
END of RECORDING
END of TRANSCRIPT"

They got to V-1 Rotate. Were they really that close to being "ok". It sounds to me like they rotated and hit an obstacle/fence/grass/lights...whatever. Scary, scary scenario.

Any word on how the first officers' recovery is coming along? I heard he was in very rough shape. Lost an eye, arm and leg.

Cleared Enroute · Post by **Cleared Enroute** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:05 pm

F/O lost a leg and suffered brain damage and he's still luckier than the rest!

wingspan · Post by **wingspan** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:11 pm

Comair 5191 Accident Air Traffic Control (ATC) Tapes

http://www.faa.gov/data_statistics/acci ... air_tapes/

sprucemonkey · Post by **sprucemonkey** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 11:28 pm

I got a REAL sick feeling in my stomach when i syncronized the audio and printed version together by coincidence while reviewing them both.....

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 2:08 pm

Thanks for updating the link.

It was/is a terrifying scenario, because obviously at V1 and VR they didn't seem to know they were about to go off the end, but the transcript doesn't say what the tone of the voice was, the V1 and VR might have been said prematurely as well to get the PF to get the plane off the ground.

I believe they hit a "Berm" at the end of the runway

Chantal · Post by **Chantal** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 2:42 pm

sprucemonkey,

why did you feel that way?

Did you think there was too much chit chat during the preparations? You can read it on the transcript, and I didn't see if this F/O confirmed he was going to rwy 2 2 but I'll look again.

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 4:29 pm

Chantal wrote:sprucemonkey,

why did you feel that way?

Did you think there was too much chit chat during the preparations? You can read it on the transcript, and I didn't see if this F/O confirmed he was going to rwy 2 2 but I'll look again.

He did make the comment "Runway heading to 6000" just prior to departure, a quick glance down to check the heading would have worked, however there was some previous confusion on the runway heading (They had said 24, correct to 22, when they departed on 26.)

co-joe · Post by **co-joe** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 9:11 pm

Cleared Enroute wrote:F/O lost a leg and suffered brain damage and he's still luckier than the rest!

I wouldn't say that.

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 9:37 am

co-joe wrote:
Cleared Enroute wrote:F/O lost a leg and suffered brain damage and he's still luckier than the rest!
I wouldn't say that.

He's gotta live with the lives of all those people on his shoulders for the rest of his life. Even in situations where it is proven not to be their fault, the guilt of surviving over others can never be easy to get over, and in this case, it appears by the preliminary investigation to be majority pilot error.

Doc · Post by **Doc** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:03 pm

Looking at that airport diagram, and knowing there was only one controller on duty (and he was doing paperwork, not looking out his windows) I can see how this one happened. Bloody shame.

IFRATC · Post by **IFRATC** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:12 pm

Doc
Are you suggesting the controller was partially at fault? Or merely making the point that had he seen them line up he may have prevented this disaster? Either way it is a shame.

IFRATC

Red Line · Post by **Red Line** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 7:01 pm

IFRATC wrote:Doc
Are you suggesting the controller was partially at fault? Or merely making the point that had he seen them line up he may have prevented this disaster? Either way it is a shame.

I believe Doc likely only mentioned it as a link in the chain that could have been broken. Controllers can be quite good at spoting things that are amiss. A few years ago when I worked for an FBO at CYAM, I called up Ground and requested clearance to proceed to the general aviation tie-downs. Looking out the window, the controller saw I was driving the Jet A truck and knowing there were only pistons parked were I was headed, he requested confirmation on what type of fuel I was carrying. I was actually only driving over there to drop off one of our customers at his aeroplane, but I was still very grateful the controller queried it.

This accident truely was a shame that I hope we can all learn from.

Red

N2 · Post by N2 » Fri Jan 19, 2007 7:50 pm

So let me ask then why 2 so called professionals would attempt to take off from an unlit runway with a plane full of passengers?

cyyz · Post by **cyyz** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 7:56 pm

N2 wrote:So let me ask then why 2 so called professionals would attempt to take off from an unlit runway with a plane full of passengers?

Explain to me why people would pay to take off with 2 so calle dprofessionals from an unlit runway...

the_professor · Post by **the_professor** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 9:32 pm

invertedattitude wrote:
co-joe wrote:
Cleared Enroute wrote:F/O lost a leg and suffered brain damage and he's still luckier than the rest!
I wouldn't say that.
He's gotta live with the lives of all those people on his shoulders for the rest of his life. Even in situations where it is proven not to be their fault, the guilt of surviving over others can never be easy to get over, and in this case, it appears by the preliminary investigation to be majority pilot error.

Majority pilot error? Try entirely pilot error. A f*ck-up of almost unimaginable scale.

The Other Kind · Post by **The Other Kind** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 9:54 pm

Explain to me why people would pay to take off with 2 so calle dprofessionals from an unlit runway... Rolling Eyes

The pax did not pay for two pilots to take off from an unlit runway, even though that is what they ended up with.

N2 asked a legitimate question, now run out and play in traffic you eye rolling twit.

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 7:54 am

the_professor wrote:
invertedattitude wrote:
co-joe wrote: I wouldn't say that.
He's gotta live with the lives of all those people on his shoulders for the rest of his life. Even in situations where it is proven not to be their fault, the guilt of surviving over others can never be easy to get over, and in this case, it appears by the preliminary investigation to be majority pilot error.
Majority pilot error? Try entirely pilot error. A f*ck-up of almost unimaginable scale.

The controller has worn some of it, although just a minority of it.

Keep in mind a controllers job is to Plan, Execute Monitor had the controller noticed the airplane lined up on the wrong runway, this would have been avoided.

By no means am I blaming this crash on the controller, just saying even a glance at the airplane he would have noticed, considering he works at this airport all the time, the orientation of the airplane would appear off to him. He was overworked, and the tower according to Americans standards was under-staffed.
On that note however the controller was working alone, on a midnight shift, and also had done a swing shift to the midnight the day before. Since the incident there has been 2 controllers in the tower at Lex at all times. Or so the FAA has said.

Donald · Post by **Donald** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 8:54 am

And don't think for a second that the controller who was on duty doesn't go home and re-play the events over and over and over, and wish he had of noticed.

2milefinal · Post by **2milefinal** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 9:06 am

invertedattitude wrote:[On that note however the controller was working alone, on a midnight shift, and also had done a swing shift to the midnight the day before. Since the incident there has been 2 controllers in the tower at Lex at all times. Or so the FAA has said.

I think this is one of the key things.
Is it just me or does anyone else think that everyone involved in this sad day, could/should of had more sleep.(?)

And yes, Donald from the little bit I understand about PTSD that controller is hurting bad.

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 9:55 am

" Looking at that airport diagram, and knowing there was only one controller on duty (and he was doing paperwork, not looking out his windows) I can see how this one happened. Bloody shame. "

The quest for safety is focusing more and more on " paper work ".

This event brings home what happens when the need to do paper work replaces the job the paper work is recording.

2milefinal · Post by **2milefinal** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 10:23 am

Ya, not to long ago I use to do my paper work at the end of the day sitting at a desk.
Not to say that thats a good idia, but sometimes I do think this paper work crap has gone way to far.

Doc · Post by **Doc** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 10:29 am

While the MAJOR cause is indeed pilot error, you would think, that a controller that issues a clearance like..."ABC, you're cleared for take off....." could actually look out the PHUQUEN window and watch the take off????? He might have noticed the lights weren't on? That the jet was lined up on the wrong runway.....in my view at least.....that is part of his job?? Is it not?