I think the announcement will be about the new employee profit-share scheme. Oh wait...somehow, CanJet never seems to turn a profit. Or maybe it does. Or doesn't...or does...or....*sigh* never mind...it's a nice phrase to try and tempt new hires but HOPEFULLY NO ONE WILL FALL FOR IT!!
I know no one ever seems to give a rats about the FA's, but they're still getting f*&ked hard by their managers...if there's a nice layover to be had guess which FA's will be operating it?! If there's anything that kills morale it's seeing your "bosses" skim the cream off the sched. No wonder there's zero respect. I can't even imagine the turnover rate now, it was a revolving door before but when "free uniform" is offered as a job perk you really have to wonder. Are they telling pilots they get to use "free fuel" in the airplane and that it's part of their compensation package?
Best of luck CanJetters, keep collecting a paycheque until you can find a company that treats you with an ounce of respect!
Canjet
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invertedattitude
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CantStandYa
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invertedattitude
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And the big news was........drum roll please...............................absolutly nothing.....nada....the big zero...zip...goose egg. Except to waste a day sitting listening to absolutly nothing. And on that note I'm going to hang up my keyboard and move on to other matters in my life besides Canjet. I don't think I want to waste another minute of my life on these people. It's way too precious.
The exodus will continue I'm sure.
The exodus will continue I'm sure.
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Troubleshot
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marquisman
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I agree. I had hope of good news but all I saw was that they hope this works out. Canjets commitment to the summer flying was not made clear to us.(to me anyway) I heard they had contracts lined up but never heard them say it was for all airplanes. Being at the bottom of the call backs does not instill confidence for me or my family. I also felt that they were not aware or didn't understand the consequences of the mass exodus of pilots.
That being said, I really hope this works for all involved as they are some of the finest people I have ever worked with. I have enjoyed working here every day since I started even refusing a Westjet interview in May( not my best move I think) I will still enjoy going to work as always but if the call comes from outside I will have no choice but to leave. I imagine I'm not alone in my point of view.
That being said, I really hope this works for all involved as they are some of the finest people I have ever worked with. I have enjoyed working here every day since I started even refusing a Westjet interview in May( not my best move I think) I will still enjoy going to work as always but if the call comes from outside I will have no choice but to leave. I imagine I'm not alone in my point of view.
I will ignore the illiterate and profane posts from the outsiders who should mind their own business. Rotate, you obviously were not at the same meeting I was at.! I can go back to your post Sunday Nov. 19th. quote- "can we get back on track of bashing CJ" If you really work for CJ, I think many of us will think leaving might be a good idea for you to make room for one of the many better attitude out of work pilots that were in the room plus quite a number that accepted other flying jobs and have requested to rejoin CJ. Marquisman, I think I know who you are and with low LH seat hours it would be a pity to go in limbo for a few years. Talk to guys like Scott and others as many of us know that all airlines, including AC and WJ have their own issues. Now we know there are no layoffs expected whether all aircraft or not are flying this summer it is up to us to make CJ an even better place to work. CJ/IMP are not great at communications so how they won being one of the top 50 best managed companies out of thousands for a fourth year in a row is beyond me!
I aplogize to anyone that I may have insulted in my previous posts. I was misled into believing there was good news. I actually expected more, but all I heard was the same old story as last fall. In the end it is obvious that the aircraft are still being returned this spring and late 2007/early 2008 with no signs of lease extensions or replacement aircraft.
Well the timing could not have been better. I got my call last week and it looks like I am going to follow through this time. I just can't take anymore chances with my career.
Enough is enough. Take care all...
Well the timing could not have been better. I got my call last week and it looks like I am going to follow through this time. I just can't take anymore chances with my career.
Enough is enough. Take care all...
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Stick-Shaker
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Pick up a business journal Hifly, that "50 Best" is a brotherhood of companies that IMP pays a membership to be included in. Its like your mother naming you the "Best Son of the Year".hifly wrote:CJ/IMP are not great at communications so how they won being one of the top 50 best managed companies out of thousands for a fourth year in a row is beyond me!
When they say "managed' it obviously has nothing to do with employee care! Doesn't it strike you funny that WJ, a company that prides itself in keeping its people happy has never won this award. (and if you don't think that most WJ employees are happy with their jobs, then you should try asking one).
If it ain't fried, it ain't chicken baby!
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Troubleshot
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now that is funny...son of the year...lolStick-Shaker wrote:Pick up a business journal Hifly, that "50 Best" is a brotherhood of companies that IMP pays a membership to be included in. Its like your mother naming you the "Best Son of the Year".hifly wrote:CJ/IMP are not great at communications so how they won being one of the top 50 best managed companies out of thousands for a fourth year in a row is beyond me!
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Stick-Shaker
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On another note, IMP/CJ hasn't been awarded this "Best 50" for a few years now, he just hasn't taken the stickers off his aircraft.
https://www.canadas50best.com/MeetOurWinners/Winners/
https://www.canadas50best.com/MeetOurWinners/Winners/
If it ain't fried, it ain't chicken baby!
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Just the facts
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What Was Said
Here's what I got from that meeting.
The COO, the finance director, the HR director, the DFO and the DCabSer chaired the meeting. Mr.Rowe and Mr. Plummer were available for questions. The meeting opened with a summary of where business plans were to date by the COO and her expectations that CJ Charters would be a long term successful venture. The DFinance discussed costing of charter work and it was good to hear that fuel hedging had been built into that costing.
Mr Rowe gave an historical account of CJ1-Canada 3000 and the the formulation of CJ2 and ultimately why it was not successful. He discussed fierce competition and high fuel costs. He disclosed that charter operations while profitable had been destroying the domestic schedule.
There was a frank disclosure of why CJ2 domestic was shut down....it was finished..and he wasn't sure whether there was a go forward viable business plan for CJ Charters or not. So they shut it down and terminated crews. A small staff was retained to explore the viability of a new business plan. It was all done in such a way as to provide bridge financing to crews so they could either get on with their lives or wait and see. Everyone was paid any monies due plus 3 weeks severence for every year served......12 weeks for many.
Mr. Rowe also pointed out that CJ Charters is a division of IMP and therefore as IMP employees we were all subject to IMP policy and procedures. He therefore explained that the change to certain benefits was due to alignment with IMP policy that employees are categorized as management and unionized. Been that way for 40 years. He did suggest he had been struggling with the issue and was very concerned that this impacted Captains negatively, and unfairly, as they had historically been categorized as managers simply by virtue of the great responsibility they bore. He also suggested that he recently instructed HR and legal to review this in order to determine if it were possible to re-classify captains as executive, by virtue of job function and responsibility. If indeed possible, changes would be retroactive. Mr. Rowe also said that HR was presently researching various FLEX plans in order to be able to provide dental plans to those who need it.
He went on to say that a formal business plan has been developed and approved and that he was very confident that CJ Charters would be a successful long term enterprise. He clearly stated that an agreement has been reached with a major customer for the summer schedule and in-addition that the capacity being offered to CJ for winter 2007/2008 was in excess of what CJ can currently provide. He suggested that this meant fleet expansion. He suggested that B737-700/800 is ideal as CJ's customers who would prefer CJ operate a 150 seat aircraft. The finance director acknowledged that those aircraft are difficult to find and pointed out that A319/320 are options. In any event Mr. Rowe said he would, if necessary, add additional 300/500 ac in order to address the extra capacity next winter. Aircraft leases, including 506, have been extended as necessary while contracts, agreements and aircraft availabliltity are reserached.
He said that ultimately the goal is long term agreements with their various tour customer(s) however, he has instructed management to negotiate, develop and align aircraft leases first that can then be coordinated with long term business agreements with CJ's customers. Development/progress in this area would be discussed at the next quartly meeting.
I must add that the ALPA chairman initiated a respectful dialogue with MR. Rowe and a good discussion ensued regarding ALPA and the Company working together on fuel saving startegies and ideas. Mr. Rowe said he welcomed their help in this regard. Certainly sounded to me like there was an openess to mutual cooperation going forward. The ALPA chairman was very professional and his approach certainly gave some re-newed credibility to ALPA. Good job Scott!
A question was asked if there would be layoffs during the summer if the schedule was reduced for short periods and Mr. Rowe said no.
Mr. Rowe closed the meeting by saying he had great hopes for CJ Charters and that as it prospered so would the employees. He said he was willing to invest IMP money and time into this new venture and asked everyone present to help him make the airline a success. I really felt the tone was quite concilliatory on IMP's part and I was impressed with Mr. Rowe's genuine concern and resolve to find solutions to the benefit issue. Mr. Rowe also asked the group how they would feel about a strategy that permitted, on a short term basis, a wet lease of two 800's to address capacity issues until we get our own machines and pilots trained. He asked us to think about it. ALPA will have to address this. Its not without precedent though.
For those I talked to, the feeling was that it was a responsible, informative meeting that went far to explain recent events. A step in the right direction. Everyone, including Mr.Rowe agreed these types of forum should continue on a quarterly basis. The mood was positive as far as I could tell and there seemed to be a renewed degree of optimism going forward.
The presentation wasn't sugar coated....just the facts and I now understand IMP's business approach. It's just their way. I think this thing can work and do see a future here if it all works out. So I'm willing to give it a try, as I suspect others will as well. They Company know's there is a public relations problem here and I think they are attempting to fix it.
So for me, I'm staying.
Finally, after reading many of the posts here I have to say debating is normal and disagreements with each other is normal and I think it is OK to complain. But, we are professional airline pilots; held to the highest standards, entrusted with the greatest of responsibilities, regardless of where we work. CanJet flight operations has always been viewed as high standard; safe and professional, by the industry. That some of you would take this to a level of demeaning each other, or demeaning the company execs with personal attacks does, in my view, demean yourselves, demeans our reputation, and demeans the profession, and, ultimately the CJ pilots and ALPA's credibility...........respect is a two way street. Everyone is aware that this site is public and viewed by, not only Company execs, but the entire industry. Take the high road. Always. We are only responsible for our own personal behavior.
With regard to the previous references regarding the seniority list I was told several weeks ago that changes to 5 at the top apparently reflect date of hire CJ2. Other than key training staff brought back to to get the airline going again, there was no leapfrogging and the list was followed. The JK issue is with the Company and ALPA.
So there it is and those are the facts as I perceive them.
There's an opportunity here, I respect those of us who have chosen to stay to try and make it work. I respect and understand why those of you choose to leave. For those of you who have left, you will be missed.
For us who are here, lets make it work!
JTF
The COO, the finance director, the HR director, the DFO and the DCabSer chaired the meeting. Mr.Rowe and Mr. Plummer were available for questions. The meeting opened with a summary of where business plans were to date by the COO and her expectations that CJ Charters would be a long term successful venture. The DFinance discussed costing of charter work and it was good to hear that fuel hedging had been built into that costing.
Mr Rowe gave an historical account of CJ1-Canada 3000 and the the formulation of CJ2 and ultimately why it was not successful. He discussed fierce competition and high fuel costs. He disclosed that charter operations while profitable had been destroying the domestic schedule.
There was a frank disclosure of why CJ2 domestic was shut down....it was finished..and he wasn't sure whether there was a go forward viable business plan for CJ Charters or not. So they shut it down and terminated crews. A small staff was retained to explore the viability of a new business plan. It was all done in such a way as to provide bridge financing to crews so they could either get on with their lives or wait and see. Everyone was paid any monies due plus 3 weeks severence for every year served......12 weeks for many.
Mr. Rowe also pointed out that CJ Charters is a division of IMP and therefore as IMP employees we were all subject to IMP policy and procedures. He therefore explained that the change to certain benefits was due to alignment with IMP policy that employees are categorized as management and unionized. Been that way for 40 years. He did suggest he had been struggling with the issue and was very concerned that this impacted Captains negatively, and unfairly, as they had historically been categorized as managers simply by virtue of the great responsibility they bore. He also suggested that he recently instructed HR and legal to review this in order to determine if it were possible to re-classify captains as executive, by virtue of job function and responsibility. If indeed possible, changes would be retroactive. Mr. Rowe also said that HR was presently researching various FLEX plans in order to be able to provide dental plans to those who need it.
He went on to say that a formal business plan has been developed and approved and that he was very confident that CJ Charters would be a successful long term enterprise. He clearly stated that an agreement has been reached with a major customer for the summer schedule and in-addition that the capacity being offered to CJ for winter 2007/2008 was in excess of what CJ can currently provide. He suggested that this meant fleet expansion. He suggested that B737-700/800 is ideal as CJ's customers who would prefer CJ operate a 150 seat aircraft. The finance director acknowledged that those aircraft are difficult to find and pointed out that A319/320 are options. In any event Mr. Rowe said he would, if necessary, add additional 300/500 ac in order to address the extra capacity next winter. Aircraft leases, including 506, have been extended as necessary while contracts, agreements and aircraft availabliltity are reserached.
He said that ultimately the goal is long term agreements with their various tour customer(s) however, he has instructed management to negotiate, develop and align aircraft leases first that can then be coordinated with long term business agreements with CJ's customers. Development/progress in this area would be discussed at the next quartly meeting.
I must add that the ALPA chairman initiated a respectful dialogue with MR. Rowe and a good discussion ensued regarding ALPA and the Company working together on fuel saving startegies and ideas. Mr. Rowe said he welcomed their help in this regard. Certainly sounded to me like there was an openess to mutual cooperation going forward. The ALPA chairman was very professional and his approach certainly gave some re-newed credibility to ALPA. Good job Scott!
A question was asked if there would be layoffs during the summer if the schedule was reduced for short periods and Mr. Rowe said no.
Mr. Rowe closed the meeting by saying he had great hopes for CJ Charters and that as it prospered so would the employees. He said he was willing to invest IMP money and time into this new venture and asked everyone present to help him make the airline a success. I really felt the tone was quite concilliatory on IMP's part and I was impressed with Mr. Rowe's genuine concern and resolve to find solutions to the benefit issue. Mr. Rowe also asked the group how they would feel about a strategy that permitted, on a short term basis, a wet lease of two 800's to address capacity issues until we get our own machines and pilots trained. He asked us to think about it. ALPA will have to address this. Its not without precedent though.
For those I talked to, the feeling was that it was a responsible, informative meeting that went far to explain recent events. A step in the right direction. Everyone, including Mr.Rowe agreed these types of forum should continue on a quarterly basis. The mood was positive as far as I could tell and there seemed to be a renewed degree of optimism going forward.
The presentation wasn't sugar coated....just the facts and I now understand IMP's business approach. It's just their way. I think this thing can work and do see a future here if it all works out. So I'm willing to give it a try, as I suspect others will as well. They Company know's there is a public relations problem here and I think they are attempting to fix it.
So for me, I'm staying.
Finally, after reading many of the posts here I have to say debating is normal and disagreements with each other is normal and I think it is OK to complain. But, we are professional airline pilots; held to the highest standards, entrusted with the greatest of responsibilities, regardless of where we work. CanJet flight operations has always been viewed as high standard; safe and professional, by the industry. That some of you would take this to a level of demeaning each other, or demeaning the company execs with personal attacks does, in my view, demean yourselves, demeans our reputation, and demeans the profession, and, ultimately the CJ pilots and ALPA's credibility...........respect is a two way street. Everyone is aware that this site is public and viewed by, not only Company execs, but the entire industry. Take the high road. Always. We are only responsible for our own personal behavior.
With regard to the previous references regarding the seniority list I was told several weeks ago that changes to 5 at the top apparently reflect date of hire CJ2. Other than key training staff brought back to to get the airline going again, there was no leapfrogging and the list was followed. The JK issue is with the Company and ALPA.
So there it is and those are the facts as I perceive them.
There's an opportunity here, I respect those of us who have chosen to stay to try and make it work. I respect and understand why those of you choose to leave. For those of you who have left, you will be missed.
For us who are here, lets make it work!
JTF
Last edited by Just the facts on Thu Feb 01, 2007 8:14 am, edited 4 times in total.
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flyin' fish
- Rank 3
- Posts: 144
- Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:57 am
- Location: Halifax
There was some positive outcome to that meeting. The only problem is that news was premature to announce and therefore a little vague. They have committments for flying in the summer time but the details have to be sorted out, so it sounds like an MOU with Transat. I thought it would have been better to wait until all the signatures on the dotted line have been made.
KR was there to answer questions from the group, and tried his best to get everybody motivated. Tough task, but he came up with some witty answers as to why he shut the airline down in September, why the rollback with pensions and where he sees the airline in the future. The answers came down to IMP politics, the uncertainty of the airline in the fall, and his concern for the employees. I'm not going to get into the details, simply because if you're not a CJ employee it's none of your business.
The rumour of new aircraft is definitely on hold for the foreseeable future. Both KR and JR said they'll wheel and deal with the leasors to keep the -500's for the summer and possibly over the winter. KR made it clear he wants to stick to the boeing product and convert to the NG's, unless A319/320's come at a good deal. Bottom line is that he wants an aircraft that lifts around 150 seats.
That's not what I found positive about the meeting. What was positive is that KR faced the group and answered the questions that were thrown at him. Bottom line is that there's better communication, something that lacking at CanJet V2.0. Hopefully they'll improve on it and keep the rumour mill down to a minimum. Those of you at WJ can appreciate the importance of keeping your employees in the loop, hopefully we'll be at that level.
The other good news is that KR was very comfortable talking about CUPE and ALPA within the company. The bargaining with the FA's is almost complete and negeotiations with ALPA will soon begin.
Overall, it seems like a good step forward and maybe the beginning of improvements to name CanJet.
There's still risk involved, I'm sure the Air Atlantic guys heard this at CJ V1.0. The CJ V1.0 pilots heard this at CJ V2.0. Now were hearing something at CJ V2.5.
It could be the begining of a nice straight line or the return of the viscous circle. So, to those who are not at CanJet, stop speculating on what's going to happen, because you have no idea what's going on here, and history doesn't always repeat itself. I not saying we're all holding hands singing around the camp fire together, but at least I know I have a job this summer and next winter.
Will somebody like me stick around for the long term?.........those cards are pretty close to my chest.
KR was there to answer questions from the group, and tried his best to get everybody motivated. Tough task, but he came up with some witty answers as to why he shut the airline down in September, why the rollback with pensions and where he sees the airline in the future. The answers came down to IMP politics, the uncertainty of the airline in the fall, and his concern for the employees. I'm not going to get into the details, simply because if you're not a CJ employee it's none of your business.
The rumour of new aircraft is definitely on hold for the foreseeable future. Both KR and JR said they'll wheel and deal with the leasors to keep the -500's for the summer and possibly over the winter. KR made it clear he wants to stick to the boeing product and convert to the NG's, unless A319/320's come at a good deal. Bottom line is that he wants an aircraft that lifts around 150 seats.
That's not what I found positive about the meeting. What was positive is that KR faced the group and answered the questions that were thrown at him. Bottom line is that there's better communication, something that lacking at CanJet V2.0. Hopefully they'll improve on it and keep the rumour mill down to a minimum. Those of you at WJ can appreciate the importance of keeping your employees in the loop, hopefully we'll be at that level.
The other good news is that KR was very comfortable talking about CUPE and ALPA within the company. The bargaining with the FA's is almost complete and negeotiations with ALPA will soon begin.
Overall, it seems like a good step forward and maybe the beginning of improvements to name CanJet.
There's still risk involved, I'm sure the Air Atlantic guys heard this at CJ V1.0. The CJ V1.0 pilots heard this at CJ V2.0. Now were hearing something at CJ V2.5.
It could be the begining of a nice straight line or the return of the viscous circle. So, to those who are not at CanJet, stop speculating on what's going to happen, because you have no idea what's going on here, and history doesn't always repeat itself. I not saying we're all holding hands singing around the camp fire together, but at least I know I have a job this summer and next winter.
Will somebody like me stick around for the long term?.........those cards are pretty close to my chest.
ooooo, you guys are even lazier than me!
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flyin' fish
- Rank 3
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- Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:57 am
- Location: Halifax
In all honesty..what do you think KR is going to tell you?
Hi guys, just to let you no the truth. I ran all of you hard for the busy summer period so I could take as much cash as possible out of the airline. I closed the doors right after labour day when we would have started losing a lot of money. I wanted to lay everone off but I was forced to keep a skeleton crew on payroll so I wouldn't lose my OC. Losing my OC would have been horrible because it now takes roughly a year and 5 million big ones to generate a new one. In the mean time I was working on trying to keep the -500's flying, well the ones that I couldn't get out of the lease's on. Right now things look great, I will never lay anyone off again even though I have had no problem doing it in the past. In fact I even persuaded the government to change their polices so I wouldn't have to pay that pesky severence and other monies owed to my valuable employees. Our business plan looks terrific even though non of my other business plans has ever worked out for me. Thank you all for staying and seeing this to the end, which might be sooner then I have lead you to believe.
Get out while the getting is good!!
Hi guys, just to let you no the truth. I ran all of you hard for the busy summer period so I could take as much cash as possible out of the airline. I closed the doors right after labour day when we would have started losing a lot of money. I wanted to lay everone off but I was forced to keep a skeleton crew on payroll so I wouldn't lose my OC. Losing my OC would have been horrible because it now takes roughly a year and 5 million big ones to generate a new one. In the mean time I was working on trying to keep the -500's flying, well the ones that I couldn't get out of the lease's on. Right now things look great, I will never lay anyone off again even though I have had no problem doing it in the past. In fact I even persuaded the government to change their polices so I wouldn't have to pay that pesky severence and other monies owed to my valuable employees. Our business plan looks terrific even though non of my other business plans has ever worked out for me. Thank you all for staying and seeing this to the end, which might be sooner then I have lead you to believe.
Get out while the getting is good!!
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captain thicknjuicy
- Rank 1
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- Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2007 6:33 am
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captain thicknjuicy
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invertedattitude
- Rank 10
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- Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2004 1:12 pm
I`ll tell you who started all of this, it wasn`t KR, it`s Michel LeBlanc, if you want to bash someone who ruined peoples trust in the airline industry ,lets bash him! 
All that being said, I really hope CJA will come back stronger and stronger.
I made that CanJet farewell video, and tommorow morning I`m working CanJet`s first charter out of Moncton, and their first scheduled flight to YQM since they left (Except for a one time charter from YMM)
I`m looking greatly forward to working them tommorow morning, hopefully if any of you are on that plane will be sticking around for a while.
I can tell you all of the staff at my company, Ramp and Counter are GREATLY looking forward to dealing with CanJet once again, see you in the AM.... Friday too!
All that being said, I really hope CJA will come back stronger and stronger.
I made that CanJet farewell video, and tommorow morning I`m working CanJet`s first charter out of Moncton, and their first scheduled flight to YQM since they left (Except for a one time charter from YMM)
I`m looking greatly forward to working them tommorow morning, hopefully if any of you are on that plane will be sticking around for a while.
I can tell you all of the staff at my company, Ramp and Counter are GREATLY looking forward to dealing with CanJet once again, see you in the AM.... Friday too!
Fool me once, shame one you.
Fool me twice, three times, four times, well I must be a CanJet pilot.
Credit for at least (f&*king FINALLY) actually facing some employees mano a mano...but never, ever trust someone who explains away mistreatment as "company policy". Let's check back in six months say, and see how far that review by "legal" is getting towards categorizing captains as managers.
Were any issues re: the Cabin Services feifdom raised?
I appreciate the intent behind it, but as far as JTF's sermon on respect, he can save it, or perhaps sell it to IMP. The treatment of JK and others like GS, to name only a couple of examples, was hardly indicative of the high regard the management holds it's employees. If anyone HAS taken the high road consistently and acted with great professionalism, it's been ALPA and it's predecessor, CJPA. Once again a huge thanks should go to SB, who has exemplified that professionalism.
Fool me twice, three times, four times, well I must be a CanJet pilot.
Credit for at least (f&*king FINALLY) actually facing some employees mano a mano...but never, ever trust someone who explains away mistreatment as "company policy". Let's check back in six months say, and see how far that review by "legal" is getting towards categorizing captains as managers.
Were any issues re: the Cabin Services feifdom raised?
I appreciate the intent behind it, but as far as JTF's sermon on respect, he can save it, or perhaps sell it to IMP. The treatment of JK and others like GS, to name only a couple of examples, was hardly indicative of the high regard the management holds it's employees. If anyone HAS taken the high road consistently and acted with great professionalism, it's been ALPA and it's predecessor, CJPA. Once again a huge thanks should go to SB, who has exemplified that professionalism.
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Stick-Shaker
- Rank 4
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2004 3:39 pm
A well written post JTF and yours too FF. They also accurately record my understanding of what was said at the meeting. I agree with FF that the meeting might have been better held a little later for more detail but at least management kept their Dec. promise to bring us up to date by the end of Jan. JTF, you have my vote to be our first ALPA secretary and your minute of the meeting may be useful as a reference point to use as a reminder of the meeting because I agree much progress was made in the Q&A with KR which Scott can follow up on particularly as they appear to have established a cordial relationship together. This public forum may not be the best place to discuss in the future our employee and company business so I guess we should keep it internal from now on. It might also be interesting to take KR up on his offer to have more pilot imput into future aircraft fleet planning because we certainly got his attention when Scott started outlining how we could help his bottom line! I am optimistic that C6,sorry CJ, sorry IMP, will remain an interesting place to work !! Hi CJ bashers, i.e.whipline,Capt.ThicknJuicyBrain etc. --one of us will have to correct your inane rubbish at a later date when we have more time.
I do think the public forum has been useful in that it has helped to inform the public to some of the issues at C6. Even when you filter out the bs and plain axe-grinding - on both sides - it's not hard to get a pretty good picture of operations at the former C6. The one thing CanJet management seems to be sensitive to is bad press, and that appears to be acknowleged in some of the accounts of the meetings.
But the sad part is this. They are more concerned with trying to change people's perceptions of things, than actually trying to change the underlying causes for these perceptions. This has been demonstrated many times over in the past.
Yes, some pilots have some jobs. For now. But tell me, starting at a baseline inarguably below other comparable operators in Canada, what elements of the package have improved, instead of being eroded? How long will it take even just to recover to where you were a year ago? If pilots are truly to be seen as managers, these are the questions a good "manager" would be asking themself. Particularly as the industry is actually red-hot at the moment and won't be forever.
I'm sorry that the management types who want to gloss over a few inconvenient facts would dismiss the treatment of certain individuals and things like their continuance payments as "inane rubbish" and "bitching" but does this not certainly sum up the dismissive, unilateral nature of IMP management?
It's all well and good to be positive about things, and yes, history doesn't necesarily repeat itself. But sometimes a sh!t sandwich really is just a sh!t sandwich, even with a lot of dressing on it.
Good luck to the C6 Charter employees and may your "bridge financing" job reach all the way across to your next one.
But the sad part is this. They are more concerned with trying to change people's perceptions of things, than actually trying to change the underlying causes for these perceptions. This has been demonstrated many times over in the past.
Yes, some pilots have some jobs. For now. But tell me, starting at a baseline inarguably below other comparable operators in Canada, what elements of the package have improved, instead of being eroded? How long will it take even just to recover to where you were a year ago? If pilots are truly to be seen as managers, these are the questions a good "manager" would be asking themself. Particularly as the industry is actually red-hot at the moment and won't be forever.
I'm sorry that the management types who want to gloss over a few inconvenient facts would dismiss the treatment of certain individuals and things like their continuance payments as "inane rubbish" and "bitching" but does this not certainly sum up the dismissive, unilateral nature of IMP management?
It's all well and good to be positive about things, and yes, history doesn't necesarily repeat itself. But sometimes a sh!t sandwich really is just a sh!t sandwich, even with a lot of dressing on it.
Good luck to the C6 Charter employees and may your "bridge financing" job reach all the way across to your next one.
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CantStandYa
- Rank 1
- Posts: 23
- Joined: Thu Nov 16, 2006 1:53 am
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