Bailout

Hedley · Post by **Hedley** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 7:33 am

I have been severely criticized here in the past by supposed instructors because of my attitude that parachutes are a Really Good Idea (tm) when you're doing something unusual:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 6384837258

rotateandfly · Post by **rotateandfly** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:30 am

Parachutes are a very good idea. I don't see any negative sides to it except that it looks funny, your walk looks funny and everyone can admire your crown jewels being pushed out.
Other than that I dont see why not. I wear one every time i go gliding, i have thought about taking it along to go power flying, yet i would feel weird. How odd.

bandit1 · Post by **bandit1** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:40 am

that's one of the best videos ever posted here.

spoolNick · Post by **spoolNick** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:53 pm

interesting how the general public thinks about parachutes. often times when i tell people about flying a small cessna or w.e i am asked if we carry parachutes.

Great vid btw

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 6:35 pm

Back in my Cadet days I spent a summer up in Central region, there was an officer there who flew gliders with a helmet, an actual CF helmet I believe... I don't think he was wearing a parachute.

At the time I thought he was nuts, but when you see how many gliders have been pranged into trees etc etc, might not be a bad idea.

yak driver · Post by **yak driver** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 7:46 pm

for the rest of the story:

http://www.warbirdaeropress.com/articles/bail_out.html

Phillip Banks · Post by **Phillip Banks** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 7:52 pm

invertedattitude wrote:Back in my Cadet days I spent a summer up in Central region, there was an officer there who flew gliders with a helmet, an actual CF helmet I believe... I don't think he was wearing a parachute.

At the time I thought he was nuts, but when you see how many gliders have been pranged into trees etc etc, might not be a bad idea.

pffft He probably made you call him maverick too...nerd

looproll · Post by **looproll** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:22 am

Who critisized you for the parachute suggestion? We really should be wearing them more often. They are a cheap insurance measure. The thing I'm worried about is bailing out and having the plane crash into someone on the ground. Richard Bach suggested he wore a chute every time he was flying a moonless night. Engine fails, he bails out!

Hedley · Post by **Hedley** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 8:10 am

I have spent over 1,000 hours sitting on a parachute in single-engine airplanes. It cost me usd$1,300, custom made. Perhaps I am wrong, but I think my life is worth more than that.

It would seem that others here do not think their life is worth usd$1,300 - they claim to be rated flight instructors, I try not to think about what they are teaching. Perhaps they don't wear seat belts, either.

For me, a parachute passes the safety cost/benefit analysis test, when I am doing something unusual in an airplane. Or if I was working in a tall building.

Again, I'm sure I will be ridiculed by the idiots here, but if I worked on the 100th floor of some tower, you can bet that I would have

1) some method of securing my office door from the inside
2) some method of breaking the window
3) a parachute hidden in the closet

I'll bet some of the people who died in the WTC towers would have really liked to have had the above. A stupid idea? Read on:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BASE_jumping

Tui · Post by **Tui** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 8:43 am

invertedattitude wrote:Back in my Cadet days I spent a summer up in Central region, there was an officer there who flew gliders with a helmet, an actual CF helmet I believe... I don't think he was wearing a parachute.

At the time I thought he was nuts, but when you see how many gliders have been pranged into trees etc etc, might not be a bad idea.

I know who you're talking about and I've only seen him wear it in the tow planes (no parachute). Either way, he's put up with a lot of shite for it.

Hedley · Post by **Hedley** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 8:56 am

he's put up with a lot of shite for it

For what - wearing a helmet?!

Let me get this straight. Countless moronic sheep blow their money on a 1 in 176 million gamble:

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/03/07/megami ... index.html

Then ridicule people who utilize safety equipment?! Why do I feel that

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idiocracy

was a Michael Moore documentary, and not fiction?

Do people who wear helmets while riding motorcycles get ridiculed, too, because they're not "macho"?

Is it "macho" to not wear seat belts in aircraft, too?

bandit1 · Post by **bandit1** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:03 am

what's cooler?

wearing a helmet or having your head broke open on the side of the road?

ScudRunner · Post by **ScudRunner** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:03 am

That vid wasnt great, that poor corsair is now gone forever!!

Kilo-Kilo · Post by **Kilo-Kilo** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:07 am

Hedley wrote:
Is it "macho" to not wear seat belts in aircraft, too?

THESE guys seem to think so. I pointed out before that you can clearly see the shoulder straps in the stowed position while they prang up the plane.

saucer_driver · Post by **saucer_driver** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:00 am

Could just be me.....but.......i think alot more people fall off motorbikes then people fly into trees and or hit birds in aircraft......do we all wear helmets when we drive cars? I dont, maybe i am trying to be macho...I wear a seat belt, because that is not uncomfortable.

Sure for some types of flying a parachuteis a good idea....ex, aerobatics, combat, formation flight.....

Are you suggesting Hedley that we all carry parachutes at all times? do you bring yours on all airline flights as well? If not are you then being unsafe? I mean why don't airlines put one in for every passanger?

lets face it this video is a poor argument for your cause.....this guy was in an admittedly cheaply enhanced aircraft....in an air race in close proximity to other aircraft.....yeah i would say a parachute is a good idea. However for the bulk of flight instruction and flying in general a parachute is not required to be safe.

Hedley · Post by **Hedley** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:07 am

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cost_benefit_analysis

Hedley · Post by **Hedley** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:08 am

http://www.tsb.gc.ca/en/media/communiqu ... 8q0114.asp

Also:

450 fatal stall/spin accidents from 1993 to 2001 involving fixed wing aircraft weighing less than 12,500 pounds. Stall/spin crashes accounted for 10% of all accidents and 13.7% of all fatal accidents.

So, ONE in SEVEN fatal accidents were attributed to stall/spin.

But instead we should rush out and buy lottery tickets that have a 1 in 176 MILLION chance of winning?

I am reminded that ONE in SIX canadians are planning to retire on their lottery winnings.

Rent Idiocracy, and try to figure out if it's fiction, or a documentary.

Blue Side Down · Post by **Blue Side Down** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:18 am

saucer_driver wrote:
do you bring yours on all airline flights as well? If not are you then being unsafe? I mean why don't airlines put one in for every passanger?

On three of the last five commercial flights I've been on, I had my sport rig with me. You should have seen the size of the eyes I got at security.

Not that one could reasonably use a parachute in an emergency, though- I carry-on because the airlines won't cover $3g worth of damage when someone behind the doors pops the reserve etc etc.

There are a number of reasons why airlines aren't so eager to do as you suggest: money... need I say more?; logistics- it takes a little training to implement a parachute and survive; it takes cooperation to get a jet load of passengers out a small door; exiting at anything over 130kts will hurt... bad; by the time the merde hits the ventilateur and somebody realizes it, it's already too late- people who fly airlines don't plan to crash- they'd rather stay home. When I fly acro, I do... and hence have a plan B and C for surviving. Thereafter, most people do not have the mental capability to do everything right the first time in such a critical and chaotic environment such as hurtling towards the earth at high speed. Granted in this example youd have enough air time to get bored and start thinking of constructive things to do with your time such as pull handles before hitting terra firmer.

Blue Side Down · Post by **Blue Side Down** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:19 am

Great bailout vid too-

Is the Malta air race video out there someplace too?

fougapilot · Post by **fougapilot** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 4:33 pm

saucer_driver wrote:Are you suggesting Hedley that we all carry parachutes at all times? do you bring yours on all airline flights as well? If not are you then being unsafe? I mean why don't airlines put one in for every passanger?

Saucer,

I'll have you notice that on his original post Hedley did say he was critisised for saying he wore a parachute when doing something unusual... not for flying a single engine day VFR over the prairies.

As for me, I do not wear my parachute when flying the Challenger at FL370, but never get into the Yak without the flight suite, helmet and parachute.

Feel free to rant on me, but I for one will continue to believe my life is worth more then the $1500 for the parachute, $2000 for the helmet and the $200 for the nomex flight suite.

D

saucer_driver · Post by **saucer_driver** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 8:38 pm

lol....yeah i noticed.....but unusual for Hedley is talking on the radio...so i wasn't sure what he was getting at.

As for flying the challenger, I think I would wear one.....not exactly the perfect plane.....hehe.....just kidding around.....

bandit1 · Post by **bandit1** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:25 am

I flew skydivers for a while with a bunch of different planes. Some planes, I would wear a chute and others for example, the GAF Nomad, I wouldn't because there is simply no way of getting out (the pilot door is within 3 inches from the prop and the rear door is about 20 feet back) and the stab is also really high up.

In a Porter, PAC750 or Cresco, I would always wear a parachute.

Hedley · Post by **Hedley** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 8:01 am

Whenever I have to dump jumpers - which I would call unusual, I'm sure the "experts" here would disagree - I always wear a chute.

I'm sure this is viewed as unnecessary by the "experts" here, but the "experts" may not be aware that if a chute is accidentally deployed in the cabin, it will likely snake out the back and wrap around the horizontal stab & elevator, and may likely make the aircraft uncontrollable.

Now, the "experts" here may be fat, dumb and happy in an uncontrollable aircraft, but if I'm in one of those, I think I'll step outside.

I did 3 (intentional) "round" parachute jumps back in 1980, when I suspect most of the "experts" here were either not conceived, or still getting their nutrition through the nipple of a bottle. I hope to never do one again, but I ain't ruling it out.

When I fly single-engine out over the ocean, you can bet that I'm wearing a chute. You "experts" can try getting out of a dark, inverted submerged aircraft after being banged around during the ditching.

Same for a fire - you can hang around, I'm going.

I really do not understand this negative attitude towards safety equipment.

Are there any students of history here? Anyone care to estimate how many pilot lives were lost in WWI because of obstinate British Generals, who refused to provide parachutes to their pilots, unlike the Germans?

The true unfortunate result of the above is that the ignorant British Generals were allowed to reproduce, which I strongly suspect produces the "experts" we have today, who go on to careers in Transport

mcrit · Post by **mcrit** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:35 am

If you want to wear a 'cute for ab initio spin training, booya, fill your boots.

D5GRVTY · Post by **D5GRVTY** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:36 pm

On three of the last five commercial flights I've been on, I had my sport rig with me.

Just out of curiosity do you have an aad installed if so did did you have any problems going through security?