It's MEDEVAC
Like "Medical Evacuation"
When is a Medivac not a medivac?
Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, lilfssister, North Shore, I WAS Birddog
Sometimes it is company policy to return nurses to a remote nursing station as quickly as possible, sometimes there are extenuating circumstances but many many times it is pure abuse, much like cue jumpers or drivers who cut you off. They are generally very selfish people who only think of themselves.
Don't know what the answer is except if they want to join you for friendship and fellowship at a coffee shop etc., just get up and walk away.
I don't think Nav Canada can do anything about it unless it becomes a safety issue but you can sure be prepared to rat on them for any violation of safe operating practices. May not do any good but it may make you feel better
Don't know what the answer is except if they want to join you for friendship and fellowship at a coffee shop etc., just get up and walk away.
I don't think Nav Canada can do anything about it unless it becomes a safety issue but you can sure be prepared to rat on them for any violation of safe operating practices. May not do any good but it may make you feel better
The average pilot, despite the somewhat swaggering exterior, is very much capable of such feelings as love, affection, intimacy and caring.
These feelings just don't involve anyone else.
These feelings just don't involve anyone else.
Gee, Matrix....did he hurt your feelings?? You are correct....but who GARA?
Clunk, a question I've always asked myself. How to business let these fly by night (flame away) Mickey Mouse operators run up these debts in the first place? With their reputation, sell them fuel and services on a "cash" only basis?
Clunk, a question I've always asked myself. How to business let these fly by night (flame away) Mickey Mouse operators run up these debts in the first place? With their reputation, sell them fuel and services on a "cash" only basis?
I am not defending the company but would like to point out that Medevac operators can have several reasons for calling themselves Medevac when they don't have a patient onboard.
In some cases they are responding to a call, they could be in a hurry to get the nurses back, or sometimes when they are the only medevac aircraft for an area it is important to get back to base and on call incase they are needed again. I'm sure some of the Medevac guys have many other reasons.
It's something that every company has to respect though. Calling yourself Medevac just to get out ahead of others or avoid Nav Canada charges is unacceptable.
To me Medevac means lights and sirens. I hate hearing the guys asked if they are a priority today. If you're calling yourself Medevac you better be a priority and treated as such!
In some cases they are responding to a call, they could be in a hurry to get the nurses back, or sometimes when they are the only medevac aircraft for an area it is important to get back to base and on call incase they are needed again. I'm sure some of the Medevac guys have many other reasons.
It's something that every company has to respect though. Calling yourself Medevac just to get out ahead of others or avoid Nav Canada charges is unacceptable.
To me Medevac means lights and sirens. I hate hearing the guys asked if they are a priority today. If you're calling yourself Medevac you better be a priority and treated as such!
They're asked if they are priority because 40% of the time they are NOT. It is an often abused prefix. There should be a way to levy heavy fines on these turkeys! When I did medevacs, we'd use the term less than 10% of the time....because there was NO reason to be treated as a priority medevac. You have heard of the boy who cried "WOLF"?
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co-joe
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It always depends on the circumstances, but I've filed "Medevac" many times without a patient on board. When going back to small communities with their nurses, doctors, paramedics, or EMT's because they need them back as soon as possible. Even EMT's of which there are many, are in short supply in some places, and the towns need them back so that if a large MVA or MCI or whatever happens they are in place. Not to mention that they may need the plane back.
I'm not saying it's right all the time, but most...sure.
I'm not saying it's right all the time, but most...sure.
The BC Air Ambulance Service has an agreement with the Vancouver ACC that says they'll only use the Medevac priority when it's required.
In Manitoba, I know it's a way different system. I guess ACCs and pilots have figured out this stuff between themselves regionally. That being said, It sucks to see it abused. Perhaps, for those carriers who regularly do medevacs, an agreement with the controllers isn't a bad idea.
AIM COM 5.8.1 A “MEDEVAC” is a flight responding to a medical emergency for the transport of patients, organ donors, organs or other urgently needed lifesaving medical material.
In Manitoba, I know it's a way different system. I guess ACCs and pilots have figured out this stuff between themselves regionally. That being said, It sucks to see it abused. Perhaps, for those carriers who regularly do medevacs, an agreement with the controllers isn't a bad idea.
AIM COM 5.8.1 A “MEDEVAC” is a flight responding to a medical emergency for the transport of patients, organ donors, organs or other urgently needed lifesaving medical material.
There should never be a need to ask a medevac flight if they're priority, but sadly too many times I've seen 3- or 4-way ties for the field (all MEDEVACs). It is (or should be) a stupid question, but it's either that or delay the critical patient when one of the other "medevacs" could have taken the turn.
I'll have to throw my hand up and say "Huh!!!!".Go Guns wrote:In Manitoba, I know it's a way different system. I guess ACCs and pilots have figured out this stuff between themselves regionally.
To me, if a flight files MEDEVAC, I'll bust my balls to get you in first. I may ask if a LAHSO is a possibility if landing 18 at YWG (with a requirement to roll to the end of Rwy 18 if I need to think about a LAHSO). But, I'll be honest and say I've lost count of the number of times the question has been raised for what ever reason (more than 1 Medevac) "Do you need to get your ass on the ground?" for whatever reason, and the answer is "Negative" (can't say I have used those words, but would love to).
Got vectors one night from a controller in YWG because there was a "medevac" five minutes behind us, who they "needed" to get down before us. We taxied past them...two pilots...no medics...no patients. They went for dinner, and were sitting around ESSO when we left two hours later. Yup. A medevac.
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Cat Driver
- Top Poster
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This should be a sticky.....so we can all remember how many true assholes there amongst us.
Got vectors one night from a controller in YWG because there was a "medevac" five minutes behind us, who they "needed" to get down before us. We taxied past them...two pilots...no medics...no patients. They went for dinner, and were sitting around ESSO when we left two hours later. Yup. A medevac.
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
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furious george
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- Location: Aboard the Crazy Train
Never had to file Medevac without a patient, can't really see that in being necessary in Alberta. When we do have a patient we almost always file medevac status and if ATC asks we're always a priority!
Bottom line: it all comes down to the word of the week boys and girls:
"A" is for airmanship
Bottom line: it all comes down to the word of the week boys and girls:
"A" is for airmanship
If you piss your pants, you'll only stay warm for a while.
I am carrying a patient every second flight. Medivac status is filed probably every 6th flight. Do the math. Once I found it detremental as at the beginning of the flight, the patient is very stable and everything is calm. We don't file medavac status. During the flight in busy controlled airspace the patient takes a turn and we spring it on the controller that we want medavac priority. This probably creates a little chaos in the control room.
Do we file Medavac priority on every flight carrying a patient, or or continue as what we have been doing?
Do we file Medavac priority on every flight carrying a patient, or or continue as what we have been doing?
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furious george
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- Location: Aboard the Crazy Train
As pilots, we are neither doctors, nurses or paramedics. I for one am not going to judge a patient's condition based on what I see when they are getting on the plane.
I personally have seen a "walk-on" take a turn for the worse in flight and die by the time we got to the city.
I've also been told by a medic that the patient was doing fine and we wouldn't need any priority for that flight. Cancelled Medevac with FSS before takeoff.
Cheers
I personally have seen a "walk-on" take a turn for the worse in flight and die by the time we got to the city.
I've also been told by a medic that the patient was doing fine and we wouldn't need any priority for that flight. Cancelled Medevac with FSS before takeoff.
Cheers
If you piss your pants, you'll only stay warm for a while.
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JustVisiting
- Rank 0
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Well, seeing as this topic comes up annually:
MEDEVAC:
A term used to request ATS priority handling for a medical evacuation flight based on a medical emergency in the transport of patients, organ donors, organs, or other urgently needed life-saving medical material. The term is to be used on flight plans and in radiotelephony communications if a pilot determines that a priority is required.
http://www.tc.gc.ca/CivilAviation/publi ... EN/5-0.htm
As stated above, Filing "Medevac" is the aviation equivalent to a ground ambulance operating with lights and sirens on. Simple.
A land ambulance DOES NOT operate with lights and sirens on:
- when returning to base empty with no call pending (even in a 1 horse town or in an area of limited coverage).
- when carrying a stable non-critical patient.
You may have noticed that a land ambulance only operates with lights and sirens on when there is a priority medical emergency and they require a clear path ahead because either:
- something very bad is going on in the back;
- it is en route to the scene of something nasty or potentially nasty; or
- it is carrying organs or equipment required for the saving of life.
http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopic.php?p=224684
http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopic.php?p=234348
Someone below me still won't be able to figure it out.
MEDEVAC:
A term used to request ATS priority handling for a medical evacuation flight based on a medical emergency in the transport of patients, organ donors, organs, or other urgently needed life-saving medical material. The term is to be used on flight plans and in radiotelephony communications if a pilot determines that a priority is required.
http://www.tc.gc.ca/CivilAviation/publi ... EN/5-0.htm
As stated above, Filing "Medevac" is the aviation equivalent to a ground ambulance operating with lights and sirens on. Simple.
A land ambulance DOES NOT operate with lights and sirens on:
- when returning to base empty with no call pending (even in a 1 horse town or in an area of limited coverage).
- when carrying a stable non-critical patient.
You may have noticed that a land ambulance only operates with lights and sirens on when there is a priority medical emergency and they require a clear path ahead because either:
- something very bad is going on in the back;
- it is en route to the scene of something nasty or potentially nasty; or
- it is carrying organs or equipment required for the saving of life.
http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopic.php?p=224684
http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopic.php?p=234348
Someone below me still won't be able to figure it out.
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furious george
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- Location: Aboard the Crazy Train
Had a few of those too Doc. And I agree it's often abused. But it's the doctor's call to medevac them, not mine. And unless I hear otherwise, I treat them all the same.
In Alberta we're not even supposed to know anything at all about the patient, let alone their medical status.
Cheers
Edited cause we were writing a the same time. You're right this comes up way too often.
In Alberta we're not even supposed to know anything at all about the patient, let alone their medical status.
Cheers
Edited cause we were writing a the same time. You're right this comes up way too often.
If you piss your pants, you'll only stay warm for a while.
"In Alberta we're not even supposed to know anything at all about the patient........" BUT you have to lift their 300 pound fat ass into, and out of the airplane, just to see them get up and WALK away......I'm a very happy puppy since I've stopped dealing with these turkeys! And, don't even get me started on the bubble heads in the back end.....
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furious george
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- Location: Aboard the Crazy Train
Doc,
I'm just going to assume that our experiences in this type of flying differ a little. You're making a few generalizations that I haven't really come across. But different locations, different experiences. I have seen a couple of pretty questionable medevacs, as I alluded to earlier, but obviously not to the extent you have. Not sure where the bubbleheads come in though.
Cheers
I'm just going to assume that our experiences in this type of flying differ a little. You're making a few generalizations that I haven't really come across. But different locations, different experiences. I have seen a couple of pretty questionable medevacs, as I alluded to earlier, but obviously not to the extent you have. Not sure where the bubbleheads come in though.
Cheers
If you piss your pants, you'll only stay warm for a while.
