well, I heard it hurt the magnetos too, but it's not true. I don't know about the vacuum pumps, so what exactly is hard on it?C-GPFG wrote:I used to do that. I then found out it will ruin the vacuum pump(s).Four1oh wrote:...if you aren't trying to start it, turn it opposite to normal rotation.
Have you ever hand propped an aircraft?
Moderators: lilfssister, North Shore, sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, I WAS Birddog
Drinking outside the box.
I did it on a plane with venturis so I can't speak for the vacuum pump but the engine easily made tbo so I don't think it hurts the mags at all.Four1oh wrote:well, I heard it hurt the magnetos too, but it's not true. I don't know about the vacuum pumps, so what exactly is hard on it?C-GPFG wrote:I used to do that. I then found out it will ruin the vacuum pump(s).Four1oh wrote:...if you aren't trying to start it, turn it opposite to normal rotation.
It's better to break ground and head into the wind than to break wind and head into the ground.
I've hand propped a few.. same thing as everyone else has posted so far. Most were on floats.. Only one due to my stupidity of leaving the master on! Never tried it with the beav.. I bet that would be quite the show..
I have however watched someone try and swing start a 172 with pretty horrific results.. slipped.. fell forward.. thankfully the engine only kicked over and didn't start and the downgoing blade struck him across the face. Knocked unconscious and ended up with a lot of stitches.. So Make sure you have some damn good footing and preferably someone in the hot seat on the brakes and ready to shut her down should anything go awry.
I have however watched someone try and swing start a 172 with pretty horrific results.. slipped.. fell forward.. thankfully the engine only kicked over and didn't start and the downgoing blade struck him across the face. Knocked unconscious and ended up with a lot of stitches.. So Make sure you have some damn good footing and preferably someone in the hot seat on the brakes and ready to shut her down should anything go awry.
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youngtimer
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Once on a Champ, under the careful direction and supervision of the owner. It obviously didn't have a starter and was easy to do. Kind of fun to do and a good thing to learn properly for the future when you're stuck somewhere. Mind you, I don't think I could get the ole pt-6 up to 12%, so it might not help now.
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heavymetal
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Helped my buddy hand prop a navajo (TIO-540) . I was sitting inside keeping the girl running. He was the human forklift that managed to turn the bastard over. Its amazing what you can do when you are faced with an overnight in Sandy Lake or get the thing started and go home.
I'm never played as the villian in the stories I've told.
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donttakeshi*
- Rank 1
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- Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 12:37 pm
185 on floats, I had help in the left seat (non pilot) - I stood on the right hand float and bombed the 3 blade prop with my right arm. The throttle was fully open, mixture lean (after priming) with instructions to my passenger to do the exact opposite once it caught. The reason for this uncomfortable procedure was that we were stuck on a remote lake with a battery with enough juice to run the boost pump and that was it. Not something I would recommend trying at home and I only ever did it once. One thing I have always found, a recip engine always starts better when started by hand, but you have to do it right. Remember that old vehicles like model T's etc did not have starters, they all used those short little nasty hand cranks, but they werent FI'd either. No im not that old - just heard the stories.Four1oh wrote:what plane was that?fogghorn wrote:I have hand bombed a 6 cyl. fuel injected engine. Not out of choice either, it aint pretty, but it can be done..oldtimer wrote:Do not attempt to hand spike any 6 cylinder aircraft engine. The prop on a 4 banger will always be high enough to hand spike properly. plus with only two compression strokes per revolution, the all important follow through will happen. A six is just too awkward. Most modern airplanes cannot be hand propped unless it has impulse mags. If the mags click when you turn it over, you can hand prop. Forget hand propping a fuel injected engine, it just will not work. If you are hand propping a small airplane like a Cub or Airknocker alone, spike it from behind the prop. If not, chock the wheels. Do not trust brakes and turn on the fuel, prime and pump etc, and then turn the fuel selector off. When the engine starts, you have more than enough time to enter the cockpit and turn the fuel back on. If it gets away from you, it will not go very far.
You will never live long enough to know it all, so quit being anal about it..
The old expression says "With patience, perseverance, a small cock and lots of vaseline, you can f@$#k a mouse in the ear"
Which is to say it can be done but should it be done. Hand spiking an airplane is dangerous and should not be attempted except for the small 4 bangers without electrics.
I once knew a hooker who could wrap her lips around the tailpipe and suck start a jet.
try that!!!
Which is to say it can be done but should it be done. Hand spiking an airplane is dangerous and should not be attempted except for the small 4 bangers without electrics.
I once knew a hooker who could wrap her lips around the tailpipe and suck start a jet.
try that!!!
The average pilot, despite the somewhat swaggering exterior, is very much capable of such feelings as love, affection, intimacy and caring.
These feelings just don't involve anyone else.
These feelings just don't involve anyone else.
whatever, it all Depends if you want to spend the nite out on some scummy lake in the back of an airplane in the middle of nowhere. The other choice is to do what you can probably do to get out of there, end of story - simply a matter of personal choice.
You will never live long enough to know it all, so quit being anal about it..
That's the chieftain, right? I was curious years ago when i flew it, and posed the question to the company's cheif AME, and he said that with shower of sparks, it couldn't be done. I guess he was wrong?heavymetal wrote:Helped my buddy hand prop a navajo (TIO-540) . I was sitting inside keeping the girl running. He was the human forklift that managed to turn the bastard over. Its amazing what you can do when you are faced with an overnight in Sandy Lake or get the thing started and go home.
Drinking outside the box.
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Single-Engine IFR
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- Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 9:59 pm
Have you ever hand propped an aircraft?
I've hand propped several aircraft over the years. The easiest have to be the four cylinder engine tail draggers. Simply tie the tail down, put a chock under the wheel, stand in front and step back as you pull the prop down.
(Nose wheel aircraft are a little more dicey because you have to lean into it as you pull it through.)
Once it's going: walk to the door and turn the fuel on and set the throttle to a low idle, go untie the tail and pick up the chock as you get in the seat.
Some of the most difficult planes I've hand propped:
1. Cessna 175: Six cylinder and geared prop.
2. Cessna 205: Large six cylinder and three-blade prop.
3. Stinson 108-3 with the Lycoming 190 horse power and no impulse coupling or shower-of-sparks. That one kicked back like crazy but I eventually got it going.
Cheers,
SEI
(Nose wheel aircraft are a little more dicey because you have to lean into it as you pull it through.)
Once it's going: walk to the door and turn the fuel on and set the throttle to a low idle, go untie the tail and pick up the chock as you get in the seat.
Some of the most difficult planes I've hand propped:
1. Cessna 175: Six cylinder and geared prop.
2. Cessna 205: Large six cylinder and three-blade prop.
3. Stinson 108-3 with the Lycoming 190 horse power and no impulse coupling or shower-of-sparks. That one kicked back like crazy but I eventually got it going.
Cheers,
SEI
If the good Lord had intended man to fly, He wouldn't have given him railroads.
He's wrong. I personally have hand-bombed a 3-blade AEIO-540D4A5 in a Pitts (which does not have impluse coupling, it has shower of sparks/retard breaker) which didn't have enough battery to crank the engine over.company's chief AME, and he said that with shower of sparks, it couldn't be done
If you're a little guy, though, it just ain't gonna happen. I'm over 6 feet tall and 200 lbs, and it was all I could do, to hand-bomb the 540 with the Hartzell "claw". Needless to say, correct priming is everything.
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glorifiedtaxidriver
- Rank 3
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- Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 3:03 pm
Back up backhoe perpendicular to the airplane, tie one end of rope to backhoe. Wrap the other end of the rope around the prop hub and over itself (don't tie it to the prop). Driving the backhoe away will turn the prop. Do this very carefully, not sure how the engineers would feel about it. (well actually, I'm pretty sure how they'd feel about it) I've heard of it being done with a Norseman and a pickup truck too.co-joe wrote:DC3 with some rope and a backhoe? Holy shit Muskeg!I can't even visualize that one.
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comanchepilot
- Rank 3
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- Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2007 6:49 pm
- Location: Ontario
As far as the vacuum pumps are concerned, it is my understanding that the carbon vanes in them are known to chip if it is rotated opposite to its normal direction, which throws it out of balance, and then the pump self destructs.
Any AMEs/Avionics techs out there care to back up this claim?
Any AMEs/Avionics techs out there care to back up this claim?
Retractable pilots do it with their gear up!
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Cat Driver
- Top Poster
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- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 8:31 pm
Like I said I have done it with a skidoo, it is really quite easy...you just have to know how to wrap the rope around the prop dome.
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
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KenoraPilot
- Rank 8
- Posts: 905
- Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 2:34 pm
- Location: 'berta
I am not an AME, but I rebuilt my vacuum pumps a few times.comanchepilot wrote:As far as the vacuum pumps are concerned, it is my understanding that the carbon vanes in them are known to chip if it is rotated opposite to its normal direction, which throws it out of balance, and then the pump self destructs.
Any AMEs/Avionics techs out there care to back up this claim?
The way they are designed, the carbon vanes are at an angle, and apparently do not like to spin backwards.
Success in life is when the cognac that you drink is older than the women you drink it with.
Hand Proppin'
Yup, a Beaver and an Otter:
Both tied to a log boom in the middle of nowhere using the good old rope but with a small piece of tuct tape to hold the loop end high on the blade and lots of muscle!
Both tied to a log boom in the middle of nowhere using the good old rope but with a small piece of tuct tape to hold the loop end high on the blade and lots of muscle!
"Your passengers may only remember the landing but you should remember your passengers for the entire flight."
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ScudRunner
- Rank 11
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- Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 11:58 am
Use to Hand bomb an Islander that thing would fire better than with the starter. Always fun if it was the left engine jumping in the back door and crawling over the junk to get to the Seat.
Once did about 50 consecutive flight hand propping it when out in the sticks and was told that the starter wouldnt be there for another weeks.
God I love Turbines these days!
Once did about 50 consecutive flight hand propping it when out in the sticks and was told that the starter wouldnt be there for another weeks.
God I love Turbines these days!
But nobody else other than Muskeg is trying to start a 3...Cat Driver wrote:I found that it is easier to use a Skidoo..just make sure you have the rope wound the correct way and amount.
Just be safe people, lot's of good advice here. Get training, treat it like it has a live mag and stay the f*ck away from the prop once it starts..
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heavymetal
- Rank 4
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- Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2004 10:57 am
We tried the standard Navajo priming and start tricks, but it didn't want to catch. Finally we just primmed it till it was pissing fuel and did the flooded start procedure. It caught but barely. I'm not exactly sure how I managed to keep it going, but it was a circus of hands inside running between mixtures, throttle and boost pump to smooth the old girl out. I think it was pure motivation to not stay in in Sandy Lake any longer than we had to.Hedley wrote:If you're a little guy, though, it just ain't gonna happen. I'm over 6 feet tall and 200 lbs, and it was all I could do, to hand-bomb the 540 with the Hartzell "claw". Needless to say, correct priming is everything.
I'm never played as the villian in the stories I've told.
