turn off your lights!!!

Doc · Post by **Doc** » Fri Sep 21, 2007 7:17 pm

Back to the original post....I'd have just asked the guy to turn his landing lights off? Or relayed the request through the tower.

turboprop · Post by **turboprop** » Fri Sep 21, 2007 7:51 pm

There has got to be something better to talk about than this!!!!!!!!!!

hazatude · Post by **hazatude** » Fri Sep 21, 2007 8:25 pm

This thread is an example to you young pilots to be.

TAKE HEED!

TAKE HEED!

Dave T · Post by **Dave T** » Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:54 pm

As far as off topic as this post has gotten guys using lights during the day are usually just following SOP's or making themselves more visible.

Most companies (including mine) have SOP's that dictate how the lights are to be used with a * saying that the PIC can use his judgement to follow proper airmanship.

Usually Nav lights on anytime there is power to the airplane (APU, GPU, or Batt) anti collision light to warn of engine start, strobes when in any runway environment (crossing or about to take off) and landing lights when cleared for take off.

I don't know about you guys and not being able to see lights but I have no problem seeing that an aircraft's nav lights are on, even in daylight. On a large ramp these cues can really help alert other pilots and ramp staff that an aircraft is about to start up ect. Sure they're not as bright as they are at night, but you certainly can still see them.

If it's your airplane do what you like, but most of us out here are just following SOP. That is the way they pay us to operate there air planes.

And to the guy with the taxi light on, that is just poor airmanship!

KISS_MY_TCAS · Post by **KISS_MY_TCAS** » Fri Sep 21, 2007 10:30 pm

As an AME, I can tell you we look for lights for various reasons, especially on crowded ramps. Navs on for power on, keeps us away because we know what is coming next and also not to approach the aircraft if we see something out of the ordinary, navs on means get the crew's attention first before approaching (this has occurred several times in my career). Beacons before start is a no-brainer, and taxi lights are a good sign of intent to move before taxi, again quite important on crowded ramps, especially if I am about to tow an aircraft in front of you and delay your taxi (fuel is not cheap) because you have been sitting there idling forever going over your checklist, cleaning your Ray-Bans and counting the stripes on your epaulettes. That being said, I have seen piles of AMEs use as many lights as possible on ground runs, strobes at night, landing lights to taxi, etc., with no regard for other aircraft. I use the rule of the highway on the ramp, if someone blinds me on the ramp, I flash the brightest thing available at them. It has worked every time.

KAG · Post by **KAG** » Fri Sep 21, 2007 11:50 pm

Leaving the NAV lights on has prevented me and some of my peers from killing batteries on more then a few occasion. Yes you can see them in daylight.
Pitot heat, turn it on, leave it on in flight. More to delevope the habit so when you do incounter ice there already on. Were creatures of habit, we follow routines. Those routines help us from making mistakes when were tired, distracted, ETC.

As for turning off your lights while holding short, thats just common sense.
Turn them off, I'm sure you wouldn't want a face full of light just as your about to land.

PT6-114A · Post by **PT6-114A** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 7:51 am

doc you have a great ass!

Dominic220 · Post by **Dominic220** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 9:38 am

KAG wrote:Leaving the NAV lights on has prevented me and some of my peers from killing batteries on more then a few occasion. Yes you can see them in daylight.
Pitot heat, turn it on, leave it on in flight. More to delevope the habit so when you do incounter ice there already on. Were creatures of habit, we follow routines. Those routines help us from making mistakes when were tired, distracted, ETC.

How does leaving an electrical system ON prevent you from killing the battery? (assuming your engine is not on) What happens when your pitot heat overheats in VFR weather, and when you need it, it's not there?

Yes, I'm picking out worse case scenarios, but still, what then? And by your last sentence there, why are you flying when distracted/tied/etc.?

Doc · Post by **Doc** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 9:52 am

Well, as you walk away from the aircraft, and you have left the bats on (don't give me the crap that this has never happened to YOU) you'll know, because you'll see the nav lites!
I've NEVER seen a pitot tube overheat in flight....even VFR!

KAG · Post by **KAG** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 11:12 am

Dominic220 wrote:
KAG wrote:Leaving the NAV lights on has prevented me and some of my peers from killing batteries on more then a few occasion. Yes you can see them in daylight.
Pitot heat, turn it on, leave it on in flight. More to delevope the habit so when you do incounter ice there already on. Were creatures of habit, we follow routines. Those routines help us from making mistakes when were tired, distracted, ETC.
How does leaving an electrical system ON prevent you from killing the battery? (assuming your engine is not on) What happens when your pitot heat overheats in VFR weather, and when you need it, it's not there?

Yes, I'm picking out worse case scenarios, but still, what then? And by your last sentence there, why are you flying when distracted/tied/etc.?

In a King Air (or any plane for that matter) your battery will be drained by the other systems powered up on the ground, NAV lights on or off. I have left batterys on, and so have my peers, it happens. The NAV lights saved a few of us some nasty calls from our opps managers.
Also, in 12 years (jesus time is creeping by) I have yet to see a pitot tube fail let alone in flight.
Do what the book says, and your basis are covered. Learn this now while your young and inexperienced, its a bitch of a habbit to break down the road.

Dominic220 · Post by **Dominic220** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 12:44 pm

KAG wrote: In a King Air (or any plane for that matter) your battery will be drained by the other systems powered up on the ground, NAV lights on or off. I have left batterys on, and so have my peers, it happens. The NAV lights saved a few of us some nasty calls from our opps managers.
Also, in 12 years (jesus time is creeping by) I have yet to see a pitot tube fail let alone in flight.
Do what the book says, and your basis are covered. Learn this now while your young and inexperienced, its a bitch of a habbit to break down the road.

So, you're saying, being lazy is a good habit to be in? So, instead of turning things on as you need them, you'd rather turn everything on, whether you need them or not? Interesting logic.

Also, with your example given, I can understand that somewhat better now (NAV lights saving you), but at the same time, park in the blazing sun. Are you going to be able to see your nav lights? Oh wait... right, you fly a King Air. Disregard.

KAG · Post by **KAG** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 1:07 pm

Did I say everything? No, I mentioned NAV lights, and pitot heat.
And yes you will be able to see your NAV Lights, but not as easily as night. And besides, who says following the AFM, SOP's, and basic airmenship is being lazy?
Oh, and I no longer fly a king air, but I do miss it.

JetPilot123 · Post by **JetPilot123** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 3:09 pm

YES, you can see you nav lights in the daylight.

I have parked in PSP in 40 degree C with the sun blazing in my eyes and I still can see the Nav lights on (APU or GPU was on). Oh ya, I had the pitot heat on when we left (at 40 degrees). Why? because thats SOP and the last time I checked the higher you go the colder it gets. dosn't take long to get to freezing.

Doc · Post by **Doc** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 3:14 pm

This is the thread that never ends...it just goes on and on my friend...

gypsy · Post by **gypsy** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 5:01 pm

PT6, I am sure that the 200 pilots were just conserned for they heard that a King Air 350 was taxin in front of them. As we all know pilots that fly 350 are all old, cranky ( see this post), and blind. Turning on their lights was away to insure they were not taxied into and that the 350 found the center line okay. I am sure that you should be thanking them for being so considerate.

Jeremy Kent · Post by **Jeremy Kent** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 8:03 am

I am Birddog wrote:AND ONE MORE THING...MOVE OVER TO THE RIGHT AWAY FROM THE PASSING LANE!!!!

WHAT'S WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE THAT SIT IN THE LEFT LANE!?!

You MUST be in t.o.!! I'm in NY state right now, and the only bad drivers I'm seeing have Ontario plates. What a disgrace!

Doc · Post by **Doc** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 9:41 am

They're all headed to Florida, or somewhere they can use their walkers all winter!

mbav8r · Post by **mbav8r** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 11:09 am

Hey fellow posters, curious what you think about this situation.
I just landed and was taxiing onto the apron, I had my taxi lights on, as I was in taxi mode, seems to make sense so far, right? There was a, oh let's say Saab 340 painted blue and white,just as an example. The Saab was sitting waiting for us to go by, before they could start their Taxi(remember, they were not moving) As I went by them, they turned on all there lights at the precise moment to blind us. I said to the crew in question, that wasn't nice and they responded with neither were we.
Should I have turned off my taxi lights while taxiing on a dark ramp when all the other crew had to do was look away? So who's the Jackass in this situation?

CP · Post by CP » Sun Sep 23, 2007 11:23 am

Them.

CD · Post by CD » Sun Sep 23, 2007 12:11 pm

Doc · Post by **Doc** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 12:19 pm

Some people started posting, not knowing what it was....and they'll continue posting, forever, just because......this the thread that never ends....

Doc · Post by **Doc** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 12:26 pm

mbav8r, in all seriousness, I'd have stomped on my brakes and said something like.."Um....er....ground, we seem to have had a brake malfunction, and....um...we're going to have to sit right here, and..um..er, call company...we'll let you know when we can move....'"