NAC pay

fasteddie · Post by **fasteddie** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 8:43 am

I'm just a guy from Southern Ontario who worked up there, but here's the other side of the debate for conversational purposes:

A First Nation community moving south is like a village or town on the coast (E or W) that used to rely on fishing, but now has no jobs, moving to St. John or Vancouver. I wonder if you support that idea.

In fact, alot of the natives up north do leave and move south. They all come out for highschool and many don't go back.

I wonder how much federal money PEI got to build the Confederation Bridge? I guess if they choose to be a remote province they should have to get to and from their homes on their own dime.

[b]The Government of Canada agreed to an annual payment of approximately $44 million for 33 years to Strait Crossing Development Inc., this being the subsidy which was formerly paid to Marine Atlantic to cover operating losses of the ferry system. These payments are in effect a mortgage and are being used by the developer to pay off construction costs. In 2032 the bridge's ownership will revert to the federal government.
[/b]
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederation_Bridge

Personally, I've long advocated paving the north and giving the First Nations people the city of Winnipeg.

[i][/i]

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 8:59 am

Personally, I've long advocated paving the north and giving the First Nations people the city of Winnipeg.

Why?

fasteddie · Post by **fasteddie** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 9:50 am

[quote="Cat Driver"][quote]Personally, I've long advocated paving the north and giving the First Nations people the city of Winnipeg.[/quote]

Why?[/quote]

Ahhhhh just jokes,.........after 50 or 60 flights in a week over NWO and Northern Manitoba it seemed like a good idea. No more need for flying in crummy conditions and from what I've seen of Winnipeg, we may as well see if someone else can do a better job with the space.......(just jokes, I've had great times in Winnipeg it's a nice town

)

Rudy · Post by **Rudy** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 6:48 pm

Fort Hope has agreed to pay the $200,000 that they asked for. I don't know about the other owner communities. That should pay the leases for a while longer.

Hot Fuel · Post by **Hot Fuel** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 9:00 am

That figure strikes me as pocket change where aircraft lease payments are concerned. How many aircraft do they make lease payments on? Conservative guess is that a PC12 lease would be in the 25 to 30K range, multiply that by 4 or 5 airframes and your problem reoccurs in very short order does it not?

Rudy · Post by **Rudy** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 2:58 pm

They have a fleet of 13 and I was told only one aircraft is owned.
There are 4 other owner communities that would bring the total bailout to a million bucks though. There are clauses to the investments like lowering of airfares which aren't really going to help the bottom line.

stef · Post by **stef** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 6:59 pm

Well if the rumours are true I guess tomorrow is a big day for alot of guys. Best of luck to you all. I really hope it works out for you. Gotta be hell sitting wondering if you'll have a job at the end of the day.

Red Line · Post by **Red Line** » Fri Oct 19, 2007 1:06 pm

Well, how'd it go today?

Rudy · Post by **Rudy** » Fri Oct 19, 2007 4:20 pm

Indeed, Stef. Remember when they had over 100 staff with only a couple planes? Now they have 13 aircraft and quite a few more bases in Ontario and Manitoba. I can only imagine how many would be effected (affected?). Good luck to all staff. They're agents are all great people.

TheEvilTwin · Post by **TheEvilTwin** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 1:53 pm

Part of (or the main problem) of serving these remote $hitholes on a scheduled basis is the fact that 90% of the time 1/2 the people booked never show. Unlike large operators where you have a pre purchased ticket, these operators are pretty well book yourself a seat and maybe show up and pay depending on how much you drank the night before or for breakfast.

Its hard to make any kind of consistant profit when you run a business like that. I don't know how many countless times I've gone North expecting 14 and come back half empty or less. I really have to question the number and frequency of flights landing at some of these places that leave empty...

The only way to run a business like that is to own all your equipment...

stef · Post by **stef** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 5:02 pm

Having flown quite a bit in this area, I agree that no shows was a definite problem and constant source of frustration. Another was having to complete with companies that didn't need to make a profit. We managed, though, by providing better service; As an example none of our employees would ever consider calling someone's home a "remote shithole."

Hope the fellas are still flying.

TheEvilTwin · Post by **TheEvilTwin** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 6:59 pm

stef wrote: As an example none of our employees would ever consider calling someone's home a "remote shithole."

Hey, I only speak the truth...

SKYPILOT1956 · Post by **SKYPILOT1956** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 12:37 pm

the website says it all;;

NAC Air is a 100% First Nation-owned airline that has changed the face of air travel in Northwestern Ontario. In 2000, North American Charters (NAC) was created to transform airline service to First Nation communities in our region. Combating high ticket prices and limited flight service was our first priority.

We lowered airfares by 40-50%, spurring our competitors to reduce their airfares in this newly competitive market. We also made air travel accessible by introducing high frequency, 7 days a week flights. The consumer response was immediate as residents of First Nation communities and larger regional centres made NAC their first choice for air travel.

Businesses and government organizations were also eager to come onboard because NAC offered the freedom to travel to remote areas and return home on the same day, saving valuable work time.

Meeting the rising demand for our services has meant continual growth. NAC has evolved from a two aircraft operation serving four communities to a ten aircraft operation connecting Sioux Lookout, Winnipeg, Thunder Bay, Red Lake, Thompson and 22 First Nation communities.

Our expansion continued in 2006 with the construction of a new three-storey office and hangar complex at the Thunder Bay International Airport as well as the unveiling of our new name – NAC Air.

Our owning partner communities of Eabametoong (Fort Hope), Neskantaga (Lansdowne House), Webequie, Sachigo Lake, and Sandy Lake, as well as the staff of NAC Air, would like to thank all of our customers for helping us become Northwestern Ontario's leading regional airline company.

Cap'n P8 · Post by **Cap'n P8** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 12:53 pm

Leading? Says who?

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:04 pm

We lowered airfares by 40-50%, spurring our competitors to reduce their airfares in this newly competitive market.

How is it possible to lower fares by that amount and still maintain a safe operation maintenance and crew wise, and also make a profit??????????????????????????????????????????????????

El Comat · Post by **El Comat** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:43 pm

Cat Driver wrote:
We lowered airfares by 40-50%, spurring our competitors to reduce their airfares in this newly competitive market.

How is it possible to lower fares by that amount and still maintain a safe operation maintenance and crew wise, and also make a profit??????????????????????????????????????????????????

Well we've turned a profit for 6 straight years, and our maintenance staff are some of the best around. The 40-50% reduction in fares shows just how badly NWO was getting gouged by the existing sked operators.

EC

2R · Post by 2R » Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:59 pm

Should be interesting to see what happens if Wasaya gets the new contracts that subsidize those runs.

Rotorhead · Post by **Rotorhead** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:15 am

I saw a NAC pilot holding a plastic cup outside the TI asking for money to save his airline. This was on Saturday night.

Does anyone know if NAC received any money from any of the bands? If so, which band? I would like to ask for money as well.

Chuck Yeagermister · Post by **Chuck Yeagermister** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:22 am

Well your the one whos got all the info and in the loop. So please tell us whats happening.

Doc · Post by **Doc** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:25 am

What's happening, is they are waiting for yet another wheelbarrow full of tax payers dollars.

Appletini · Post by **Appletini** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:57 am

So...

NAC is 100% FN owned

NAC lowers air fare tickets down 50%

All the other companies have to lower their air fare prices

NAC slowly falls apart (not for sure though, 1 pc-12 repo'ed?)

NAC rises from the ashes from tax payers money?

Why dont they leave the prices up regardless? Are the people of NWO really suffering from these ticket prices? Is it not their own choice to live in the reserves and receive money from the government? To be competitive is one thing; but to bring down the other companies with them?

Dont want to start any fights or anything... But this is what I have come to realize living in NWO. Someone explain.

Appletini, Easy on the Tini

2R · Post by 2R » Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:36 am

Anyone can run an airline when the Governments are picking up the tab .

It takes more than a hat made by slave labour in China on ones head to have real pride in ones endeavors.

Maybe the Governments will tell them to use the profits from the Casino's to subsidize their other business's.Or maybe the crack dealers and bootleggers will donate some money to keep the supply lines open.

Perhaps a return to the more traditional means of transport would be respectful of the enviornment .

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:50 am

Maybe they could cut their prices another 50% and lure back the customers?

2R · Post by 2R » Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:03 am

So what is going on ???

HORUNNER · Post by **HORUNNER** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:41 am

I could be wrong but the way I understand this is, the communities that are owners, charge most of their flights to the band. It is this outstanding money that has put NAC in the hole. The way of thinking in the north is we own the company we dont need to pay. The money that people are talking about here that Nac is getting is only outstanding debt.

Again this is just my understanding from some limited inside advantage

NAC pay

www.nacair.ca

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