Logging Instrument Time

Red Line · Post by **Red Line** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:14 pm

xsbank wrote:I think that only someone who has not flown IFR for a living would think that they might get asked about "cloud time."

Is that supposed to be a slam on me?

Gr8Pilot · Post by **Gr8Pilot** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:24 pm

I think we're straying from the topic a little bit.

When I was processing my ATPL a few years back, the TC inspector explained it to me this way:
If you are looking at your instruments and not looking outside, you are flying IFR. Regardless if the conditions are VFR or IFR, or whether you filed an IFR plan or not. You should put this time under 'Actual' and NOT 'Hood' . 'Hood' time can only be counted if you have a qualified person as a spotter and you have a device which restricts you from looking outside. ie. Training.
"Actual" refers to just what it means "Actual time you spend flying IFR" whether it's in cloud or not doesn't matter. Besides, how would you know if you're in a cloud, you're supposed to be looking at your instruments.......

Anyway, where it gets tricky is Northern Operations, when there are no FSS and no IFR flight plans but people operate under the IFR system, regardless whether the weather is good or bad.

This was the simplest and most logical explanation I've ever received.....especially surprising as it was from TC!!!

Tiny Voices · Post by **Tiny Voices** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:27 pm

Cat Driver wrote:
but like it or not, these questions do get asked.

I'm not saying that someone would not ask the question, I just do not understand why they would.

Could this paranoia be due to the training industry trying to make something that is relatively easy complex?

I don't understand either but, that's interviews for you. I once was asked if i've ever been scared in an airplane? C'mon! What kind of jackass question is that?

Think it has more to do with paranoia about the perceived quality and skill of the person you're going to put in your aircraft. Yes! It is total b.s.!

Tiny Voices · Post by **Tiny Voices** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:42 pm

Red Line wrote:
xsbank wrote:I think that only someone who has not flown IFR for a living would think that they might get asked about "cloud time."
Is that supposed to be a slam on me?

Not sure? Could of been a shot at me

! Might not of been a shot at all, and if it was, i'd like to think it was induced by a fine single malt. If it is directed my way, i quit caring about logging ifr years ago. Same goes for the number of approaches i've flown. Never did track that one. It could very well be a question directed to someone relatively new IFR though...single pilot Navajo. King Air or tier 3 FO. Whatever! Don't really have much more to add to this topic either.

Sorry to the OP for steering this thing on such a tangent.

Wacko · Post by **Wacko** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 8:13 am

So flying say AC or WJ... you still have a hobbs? Do you log from engine start? And... do you log IFR as air time or engine start?

AV8OR · Post by **AV8OR** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 8:21 am

I don't see how you can count IFR time from engine start, you don't taxi IFR. It would be your air time.

F/O Crunch · Post by **F/O Crunch** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 9:36 am

What about up north when its VMC on one a them nights when you feel like you're travelling through deep space?? Anyone log that??

Tiny Voices · Post by **Tiny Voices** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 9:51 am

Wacko wrote:So flying say AC or WJ... you still have a hobbs? Do you log from engine start? And... do you log IFR as air time or engine start?

No Hobbes. Our airplane is pretty smart. Go to the ACARS time page and it has your air and flight times if you care to record it right there at the gate after each leg. I don't log the IFR time since every flight you do at WJ or AC is filed IFR. The more relevant thing to track at this point is jet and jet PIC. If i were to log IFR time, i'd log only the portion of the flight that was flown in actual IMC conditions.

Wacko · Post by **Wacko** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 10:19 am

Morav wrote:found it in the CARs

"instrument time" means
(amended 2001/03/01; no previous version)

(a) instrument ground time,

(b) actual instrument flight time, or

(c) simulated instrument flight time; (temps aux instruments)

AV8OR: Point a is throwing me off here...
Tiny Voices: Thanks!

AV8OR · Post by **AV8OR** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 10:20 am

Instrument "ground" time is time in an approved simulator.

Wacko · Post by **Wacko** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 10:56 am

"I see," said the blind man as he pissed into the wind. It's all coming back to me now.