JAZZ

[flyinhigh]

such a great deal shit head, show me the money.

Well you must be one of those college grads with remarks like the quoted one and all the piss and vinegar you got going on.

I happy to see your all for a wage increase, but guess what. until 09 nothing is going to happen regardless of what you think or say.

If you are truely unhappy do yourself and the rest of us a favor and quit. We'll be better off without you, and in a year you'll be happier because you'll be flying a king air into reserves during blizzards and going home having to put wing covers on while making your 45 K a year.

[Nightflight]

you'll be flying a king air into reserves during blizzards and going home having to put wing covers on while making your 45 K a year.

Yuck! I just had a wickedly bad flashback. And I was doing it for 36K IN THE LEFT SEAT. Times were different then and yep you guessed right, it was at Voyageur. I'm going to go throw up now.

BTW from what I heard last they are still paying those wages

[998877]

HI

[998877]

HI

[Nightflight]

[998877]

HI....

[. .]

First off, it was no typo. You clearly had no idea. You made that clear when you said that the relationship didn't matter anyway.

Second, you're currently on strike 2. If you have something even questionable to say then fire away. If all you have is a one line personal attack then it will be your last post here.

[Flying Low]

I went to Jazz knowing the pay. I could easily make Jazz a career...I enjoy the flying I do and most of the people I have worked with are great. I like the fact I can commute quite easily. I would have a hard time staying if offered WJ or mainline although, from a lifestyle point of view, I prefer Jazz...the money gap is just too big.

I actually agree with some of jmad's points. Renegotiating the contract early would show good faith by the company. We are out of bankruptcy and making money. The boss got a bonus so why is the rest of the company stuck in post CCAA wages.

Both jmad and management are partailly correct about guys leaving. Some will leave for the bigger planes regardless of the money and some will chase even the smallest raise but some of us will settle quite happily for a little less money (than WJ or mainline) to have the lifestyle we want.

I think part of the problem is the fact that it is easier to explain training costs to shareholders (sorry...just the cost of doing business) than giving the staff raises.

[CAL]

Jmad you need to get to another job and quick because life is way too short to be unhappy where you are....especially with the industry the way it is now.
With your RJ time you should be able to find something corporate or maybe left seat in a nice turbo-prop...have a look at that King Air 90 job posted today.
I agree with you as many do on here that the pay at Jazz simply stinks...its no different than a right seat job at FEX, Thunder, Bearskin etc etc. I guess it just really sucks to work as hard as you likely did to get that 'Jazz' job only to find out that you are poorer now than ever.
At the end of the day if wearing a snazzy uniform and cruising the terminal with your Capt. at YYZ is not enough for ya then dust of the resume...with some research and time you would be surprised how many good jobs are out there outside of the airlines in terms of sched and pay etc. and are close to civilization.
Remember Jazz doesnt give a shit about you. You are a number.....they require two pilots on each aircraft....they care about the shareholders and thats just the way it goes.
Dont expect to get any support from these guys as they are going to stick it out and have to convince themselves that 5-8 years to upgrade is ok and making less than a bank teller is ok after working your butt off for years.
But the RJ looks really cool...whats it like to fly?

[flyinhigh]

I went to Jazz knowing the pay.

some of us will settle quite happily for a little less money (than WJ or mainline) to have the lifestyle we want.

There it is right there, Money will come eventually. To me I could go to cathay and make 200K a year and have NO LIFESTYLE but thats ok cause I am making awesome money. Wrong,

To me a big part of a job is lifestyle, i'd rather a little less to have the lifestyle that I have got from Jazz.

The wage does suck, but I came in knowing it. If I bitch who's going to here me........mmmmmmmmmmm Maybe my wife and she'll give me an allowance, nope. Theres no point in getting all worked up cause you'll be nothing but miserable. Accept it and your going to be happier.

[Traf]

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA jmad, you dumb @#$!!!! You took a job at Jazz before hearing what the results were from your AC interview? BAHAHAHAHA, you deserve less pay than Jazz is giving you as you could possibly be the dumbest piece of shit flyin gin Canada today.

Let me get this straight. You had an interview at AC and did not receive a PFO. The, because you could not wait any longer you took a job at JAzz, knowing full well what the pay was. The AC calls but you can't go and now you are flying off the handle on the AV forum about wages at Jazz? You sir, should have failed the psych exam at AC because you are a fucking looney!!!!!!!!

You made a bad choice! Suck it up Sally!!!! You should have waited for AC to give you a yay or nay before you made the jump to Jazz. If you came to Jazz with hopes that the contract would be opened before 2009, you are even dumber than you sound on here.

I agree, wages here suck but I also have enough smarts to know that Jazz is not going to open it's CA early, in an economic boom to negotiate wages!!! Only a fucking retard would jump the gun on AC, come to Jazz and throw hissy fits because the wages are not going to be addressed before the term of the CA has been reached, especially when our economy is doing so well!!! Think of that before you bash the whole pilot group there because they are not throwing tantrums like you are about the wages. Oh, and by the way, the wages you are spouting off about were public knowledge before you accepted the job.

Man, I can't believe Jazz is hiring guys that dumb. We really are scraping the bottom of the pond now!

[genetic jack hammer]

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA jmad, you dumb @#$!!!! You took a job at Jazz before hearing what the results were from your AC interview? BAHAHAHAHA, you deserve less pay than Jazz is giving you as you could possibly be the dumbest piece of shit flyin gin Canada today.

Let me get this straight. You had an interview at AC and did not receive a PFO. The, because you could not wait any longer you took a job at JAzz, knowing full well what the pay was. The AC calls but you can't go and now you are flying off the handle on the AV forum about wages at Jazz? You sir, should have failed the psych exam at AC because you are a fucking looney!!!!!!!!

You made a bad choice! Suck it up Sally!!!! You should have waited for AC to give you a yay or nay before you made the jump to Jazz. If you came to Jazz with hopes that the contract would be opened before 2009, you are even dumber than you sound on here.

I agree, wages here suck but I also have enough smarts to know that Jazz is not going to open it's CA early, in an economic boom to negotiate wages!!! Only a fucking retard would jump the gun on AC, come to Jazz and throw hissy fits because the wages are not going to be addressed before the term of the CA has been reached, especially when our economy is doing so well!!! Think of that before you bash the whole pilot group there because they are not throwing tantrums like you are about the wages. Oh, and by the way, the wages you are spouting off about were public knowledge before you accepted the job.

Man, I can't believe Jazz is hiring guys that dumb. We really are scraping the bottom of the pond now!

Well worded and to the point. Jihad...oooops, i mean, jmad, feels really big right now.

[998877]

HI

[bcflyer]

Jmad,

I don't think anyone here is happy with the starting wages at Jazz. However everyone knew what the wage was before they signed on. There is no reason to insult someone who is being mature enough to accept the terms and conditions of the contract that was in effect when they accepted the position. Come 2009 there will be a drive for more money and better working conditions (not that they are all that bad now) but until then we are stuck with what we have.
As a side note I find it interesting that you are ranting and raving about the starting salary at Jazz and yet at the same time were more than willing to go to A/C to fly bigger aircraft for basically the same money. Would you have been this bitter if you hadn't been frozen here?
I'm also curious where you were flying before you came to Jazz. If you were so disgusted with the pay at Jazz whey did you accept the job?

[JZA]

i would have taken the job at mainline. However, they would not let me since i finished my training at jazz. I am now frozen for mainline, until they call me back.

Sounds like AC really picked a winner if he actually made it.

Too bad so many good guys/gals have been passed up for people like this.

[Ali G]

AC doesn't pick winners. They haven't figured out a thing with their hiring process. But that is another story....

[Traf]

i would have taken the job at mainline. However, they would not let me since i finished my training at jazz

Again, another mistake on your part. Anyone with half a brain and a little info about this industry knows that once you say YES to Jazz, AC will not take you. As for being frozen, you are in an altogether different category. You see, the fellows that were at Jazz and did interviews are frozen. they have a letter from AC with the terms laid out. What letter do you have? Probably nothing so even though AC says they have accpeted you, YOU GOT NOTHING!!! In 2 years when the hiring has slowed down and AC has forgotten all about you, you will be wasting away on the RJ, bitter and sad about your dumbfuck decision!!!

Your comment about being a lemming is laughable, just like you. I think the wages stink but I know that in the real world, nothing will be done until 2009 and rather than cry like a baby with wet ass, I accpet this, do my job and am saving for 2009 so that in the event we have to walk the line, I won't be ready to cave as fast as I suspect you will. You talk a big talk here on the AV forum but when it realy comes down to fighting for the wages, will you be there on the picket line or will you be home whinning to your pals about how you got ripped off by the big bad Jazz?

Anyhow, looks like you messed up your career in a big way. I wouldn't hold my breath for AC remebering you in 2 years. Even if they do, you will have lost 1000 seniority spots in the meantime. Now, you want me to take advice from someone who has made the decisions you have in the last year? BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA!!! The way you handle your career, I should do the opposite of what you say. I am now officially "opposite jmad".

Man I wish I knew who you were in the real world. I would love to do a 3 day pairing with you and spend the whole time laughing my ass off at the dumbest bastad that ever had 2 interviews. LOL Don't mention what you did with your career i your WJ interview as I am sure they will laugh at you also and wonder how dumb could you actually be. Oh and by the way, rumour has it, WJ is not so easy to get into these days as a lot of the guys that were PFOd from AC are all applying there as their second choice an there are some fairly senior guys from Jazz taking a bunch of spots. In fact, I heard that it has never been harder to get into WJ as they now have a ton of guys applying.

Better luck next career jmad. Maybe typewriter maintenance would be more your speed.

traf

[arewethereyet]

Where is Rod Cambell..... at least he would fight for the guys wages!!!

ELECT ROD CAMBELL!!!!!!!!!!!

[Mr. North]

There are some very terse comments on this thread which isn't very becoming of professional pilots, as you all so claim to be. Here you have an individual (misguided, rude perhaps) questioning the amount on his paycheck and the proper thing for all of you to do is discredit his career choice, intelligence, and character? I am rather disgusted that such tenacity exists between fellow airmen at this level in aviation.

I would think the majority of the people using these forums are only in the early stages of their careers, and being one of them, I am appalled with the lack of respect demonstrated by whom I would consider "leaders" in our industry...

[Stinky]

So far this has been pretty hilarious.
I've heard that somebody on probation at AC was fired for some remarks made on a public forum, might have been this one actually.
It's pretty easy to have your job offer at AC rescinded, I'm surprised you have the balls to go off the handle here like that.
Good Luck staying annonymous, I'd hate to see you stuck at Jazz for the rest of your life.

[GRK]

Nice to see that nothing has changed back in the Great White North...Pilot V Pilot over working conditions...sad really...when will you guys ever learn?

[tonysoprano]

Mr. North
I think that jmad has been slammed not only for his remarks but also for his tone. Sometimes it's not what you say but how you say it. You seem to be disgusted with how jmad was treated. What about those who disagree with his outrage? Don't they not have the right to exghange anger? Even if you have some good points they can easily be overshadowed by the antagonistik tone you decide to use. This forum is pretty liberal in form and content. That, however, doesn't mean that"whining" is accepted. being a professional does not mean you accept bullshit. The facts are the facts. This guy woke up recently and realized he's in the wrong company. He's looking for support and not getting it. What does that say? You decide.

GRK.(Jerk?)
Being fortunate enough to have dinner and chat with pilots from all over the world I can tell you this is not exclusive to the great white north. I think you also know that to be the case.

[GRK]

Easy Tony...There is a type of pilot that will run you through the back with a long knife and hang his CV on the point as it comes out the front...just so the boss can see it first. It may be a world wide issue, but having only seen it in Canada, I can speak about it here. The rest is rumour... It's always been the same and until these guys realise they have to do their homework about ANY job they are offered, it'll never stop. As for your comment inside the brackets...what was that for?
Cheers
G. R. K.

[swampie]

Sounds like a lot of people trying to convince themselves that the Jazz pay structure is better then it is. It was created when aviation had taken one of the largest hits in history. Now, during record loads and profits IF the company wanted to give back to its employees it could offer more money in a heart beat. ALPA would never turn down more money for its pilots. But, why should Jazz when people are continuing to line up for the job. Don't forget ALPA it taking 1.95% GROSS of your salary. When I was there, I asked what do they do with 1.5million approx a year. Give it to the States, pay lobby groups and I quote "spend $400 000 in 2 year for the CPA". That is alot of money they take from you. Vote with your feet, leave.

[BigB]

The utter blathering that our fine friend Jmad is extruding is a fine example of someone who is not comfortable with the decisions he/she has made in life. Obviously one who does not take responsibility for his own actions. For those of you starting out in this industry (any industry for that matter), take heed and learn a lesson from Jmads rants.