NavCanada Security

pokaroo · Post by **pokaroo** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 7:47 am

http://torontosun.com/News/Canada/2007/ ... 7-sun.html

MONTREAL -- While all eyes were on the new Airbus A380, two Sun Media journalists slipped easily in to a restricted area at Montreal's airport yesterday.

The pair, driving their own car, slipped unnoticed into the restricted area at Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport by following behind an airport vehicle.

The barrier the reporters passed through was surveyed by two cameras but remained open for more than 10 seconds, admitting as many vehicles as were lined up.

Once parked, the journalists passed through the multiple doors with a tray of coffee cups in their hands and ID cards from Grand Prix du Canada 2001 strung around their necks.

NO QUESTIONS ASKED

Bent over their computers, about 40 controllers responsible for directing air traffic over Quebec, part of Ontario, Nunavut and the U.S., paid no attention to the intruders.

At no time, during the 10 minutes the journalists were in the restricted area, did anyone question their presence or ask for IDs.

An anonymous call to Sun Media prompted the journalists to test security at the control centre.

The caller expressed employees concerns over security since NAV Canada decided, in the spring of 2007, to do without security guards during the day.

The access control is carried out by staff in Ottawa -- 180 km away.

Ottawa is responsible for surveillance of access to the restricted area at the Montreal NAV Canada centre.

According to the same source, pizza delivery men have been caught twice with their large pizza delivery bags inside the building.

pokaroo · Post by **pokaroo** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 7:49 am

Apparently the same sort of thing happened not too long ago in YVR as well during some random olympic security checks, they had some cops gain access to the ops floor pretty quickly without ever being questioned.

We have ZERO onsite breathing security in Toronto. It's all cameras, fences and fancy locking doors.

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 8:25 am

Wow, the NMC is going to catch hell for this one

renfley · Post by **renfley** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 11:13 am

Ottawa is responsible for surveillance of access to the restricted area at the Montreal NAV Canada centre.

who thought this was a good idea????

hehe

kevenv · Post by **kevenv** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 11:27 am

perhaps the NMC was too busy watching the Moncton cams to notice the Montreal cams.

Justin Case · Post by **Justin Case** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:07 pm

Sorry, I saw Nav Canada and Security in the same title and I still haven't stopped laughing!

renfley · Post by **renfley** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:29 pm

To think Costco has better security, I couldn't even make it through the front door before I was asked to show my card!

I hope the higher ups at NAV Canada look at this and say "Woops, we really screwed the pooch on this one boys" and they learn a lesson.

hehe I start my training in January, and if this is a sign of things to come, it's gonna be interesting to say the least!

Alex YCV · Post by **Alex YCV** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:07 pm

Worse, one of the high up dudes was on the radio explaining how everything is redundant through the various centers, so a loss of a center wouldn't be a big thing.

I don't think he intended to say it that way.

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:17 pm

Alex YCV wrote: so a loss of a center wouldn't be a big thing.

.

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:18 pm

kevenv wrote:perhaps the NMC was too busy watching the Moncton cams to notice the Montreal cams.

Trying to leave work when I forgot pass:

"Name please" *Give name*

"Spell your last name please?" *Spelled it for him*

"your position?" *Got to be kidding me, told him*

"Can you spell your last name again?" *To which I replied "Open the damn gate man I'm going home now"

Gate opened.

kevenv · Post by **kevenv** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:29 pm

invertedattitude wrote:
kevenv wrote:perhaps the NMC was too busy watching the Moncton cams to notice the Montreal cams.
Trying to leave work when I forgot pass:

"Name please" *Give name*

"Spell your last name please?" *Spelled it for him*

"your position?" *Got to be kidding me, told him*

"Can you spell your last name again?" *To which I replied "Open the damn gate man I'm going home now"

Gate opened.

So it's all your fault!

Braun · Post by **Braun** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:33 pm

Everyone has been saying this forever now, especially since two months ago when they removed all the security guards from the ACC. Oh well, I like how they blame the employees, there are so many new faces all the time in center how the hell is one supposed to know who is an intruder! As if that's all controller's do is check faces and make sure there are no intruders, screw the traffic!

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:03 pm

However we all must admit, what exactly were the commisionaires/security guards going to do if 15 armed gunmen showed up at the front door, other than politely open the door for them.

To me it's either no security, or 30 guys patrolling with MP5's.

pokaroo · Post by **pokaroo** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:04 pm

I don't know about the other ACC's but in Toronto we don't even have any management in the building overnight. Shift Managers stopped working mids around a month ago. There's always somebody on call but once again nobody in the building. When do I get to work from home?? This seems to be a trend.

Braun · Post by **Braun** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:05 pm

Yeah I really agree, one way or another they'd find a way to get in. Even with 30 armed guards with Mp5's.

thatdaveguy · Post by **thatdaveguy** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:08 pm

renfley wrote:
Ottawa is responsible for surveillance of access to the restricted area at the Montreal NAV Canada centre.
who thought this was a good idea????

hehe

The Edmonton ACC has this...genius security plan as well. It's all run out of Ottawa, by phone lines to Edmonton.

It's a camera, one way glass, and a crappy inter phone. I'm a Nav Canada employee who was there for a conference and they wouldn't let me in. I showed my ID and everything.

I couldn't understand a word the inter phone was saying as the guy was just barking over a cheap speaker.

Awful. We waited 15 minutes to get in when we could have just grabbed the door from someone leaving.

invertedattitude · Post by **invertedattitude** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:13 pm

I find it funny they haven't implemented the same system that is at the airports with the RAIC cards we use (well I used, no longer work ramp)

All the pilots can tell about it, Iris Picture and/or fingerprint scanner.

Much more secure than just a piece of plastic

Not saying I want the hastle, but, it's probably coming.

Pounder YWH · Post by **Pounder YWH** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:11 pm

invertedattitude wrote:However we all must admit, what exactly were the commisionaires/security guards going to do if 15 armed gunmen showed up at the front door, other than politely open the door for them.

Like being a peacekeeper back in the early 90s - "Stop or I'll say 'Stop' again!"

yrp · Post by **yrp** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:36 pm

renfley wrote:
Ottawa is responsible for surveillance of access to the restricted area at the Montreal NAV Canada centre.
who thought this was a good idea????

hehe

Same people as came up with DRCO and RAAS?

I'll get me coat

Alex YCV · Post by **Alex YCV** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:50 pm

TQS TV news here on Montreal was making fun of the situation today, one of their reporters was walking in and out of the gate like it was a door to a shopping mall or something.

NC will need more than a few paper towels to get all that egg off their faces.

FamilyGuy · Post by **FamilyGuy** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:50 pm

Alex YCV wrote:Worse, one of the high up dudes was on the radio explaining how everything is redundant through the various centers, so a loss of a center wouldn't be a big thing.

I don't think he intended to say it that way.

PLEASE tell me you are FUCKING joking!!!!

In the States they have ARMED guards at all major facilities. And yes, you may be able to shoot your way in, but it IS a visible deterrant to all but those who are really committed to trying.

Alex YCV · Post by **Alex YCV** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 5:15 pm

I'm not kidding. I think his intention was to say basically that there are redundancies in case there are any issues, but the way it came sounded rather flippant, like it wouldn't matter if the montreal center just disappeared off the map.

I am sure a more carefully worded explaination will follow in the next couple of days.

pokaroo · Post by **pokaroo** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:37 pm

While the company is in the middle of being embarassed maybe somebody should make a phone call about the Billion dollar, 20 year, already antiquated CAATS.

thatdaveguy · Post by **thatdaveguy** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 8:32 pm

pokaroo wrote:While the company is in the middle of being embarassed maybe somebody should make a phone call about the Billion dollar, 20 year, already antiquated CAATS.

at least you guys finally got CAATS, i don't see FIMS ever getting to us

lilfssister · Post by **lilfssister** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:38 pm

thatdaveguy wrote:
pokaroo wrote:While the company is in the middle of being embarassed maybe somebody should make a phone call about the Billion dollar, 20 year, already antiquated CAATS.
at least you guys finally got CAATS, i don't see FIMS ever getting to us

For which, from all I hear...you should be eternally grateful!