?Georgian vs. Confed?

mathias_now · Post by **mathias_now** » Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:37 pm

Hello, I'm serious about becoming a pilot and just wondering if anyone had any thoughts about my current situation.

I have been granted admissions to Georgian's Aviation Management program to start second semester in January with the promise that I complete my private pilots license before the end of the summer. Although there is no flight training involved in the program, it will give me the requirements to by pass the prerequisites needed for the aviation courses in second year.

My goal is to become a pilot, so what I’m wondering is if the Georgian program would help me achieve this goal. In order for me to complete my flight training I will have to work while i'm there. My parents are strongly against my dream to become a pilot, so they won't assist me in anyway. Is this realistic? I would have paid co-ops to complete before the end of the course, which would allow me to save money.

Another option I’ve considered is to apply to Confed for September. It will allow me to offset some of the training costs required on the path to becoming a pilot and will also give me a diploma. The thing I'm wondering is which one will be of greater value in the long run and when I’m looking for my first job?

Besides the obvious, what are the pros and cons of both my options?

PS I'm 22 so age is starting to become a factor. I don't wish to fly the heavy tin. My ideal career would be flying tier 3 or corporate. Attainable, if so, by aprox. what age?

Thanks in advance,

MN

renfley · Post by **renfley** » Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:34 pm

I'm a Confederation College grad, I also took Georgian's Aviation Management course. The big advantage to Confed's course is that the flight training is not only subsidized but it is included in your curriculum. If being a pilot is what you want to do, go to Confed. If your looking for a career other than flying but still in aviation, go to Georgian.

Fell free to pm me if you have any more questions.

mathias_now · Post by **mathias_now** » Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:40 pm

renfley, Check out my "confed accpetance" post and let me know what you think.

Do you think Georgain would be good because you would have a back up plan? If something happend that you couldnt fly atleast you could still work in avation, right?

Is it worth having a "back up plan" like that though, or even having one at all?

MN

mathias_now · Post by **mathias_now** » Sun Nov 18, 2007 9:41 pm

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renfley · Post by **renfley** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 7:13 am

Having a back up plan is ALWAYS a good Idea. having said that, some people (like me) couldn't afford to do so.

I couldn't afford to get a degree (or diploma) and pay for flight training on top of that.

In an Ideal world I would have liked to a degree totally unrelated to flying, like mechanical engineering and take flight training while attending university.

I know a few people who have gotten the ME's License and continued to get their CPL.

If your straight out of high school, time is on your side, ( others correct me if I'm wrong)most operators won't hire very young guys, so stay in school! Plus, more education never hurts anybody!

mathias_now · Post by **mathias_now** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 5:07 pm

Does anyone know, or better yet is anyone, a successful pilot that took Georgian’s Aviation Management Program?

How did they/you do it?

MN

sstaurus · Post by **sstaurus** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:58 am

I think this is mostly a financial question. Will you really be able to make enough part-time money to flight train while attending school at Georgian? Probably not. There will be too many other distractions, and it will probably get dragged out too long.

If you're not going to get a non-aviation related degree elsewhere, then you might as well just go for Confed. If aviation doesn't work out, well at least with Confed you won't have some ridiculous $60K in debt or something.

renfley · Post by **renfley** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 3:37 pm

Nobody from my class were able to get their CPL during the entire 3 year course. a couple gave up half way, others went to Confed after graduating for Georgian, and others paid out of pocket after leaving Georgian to get their CPL.

Best bet, go Confed!

mathias_now · Post by **mathias_now** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 5:03 pm

Did these pilots that graduated from Georgian find jobs?

renfley · Post by **renfley** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 11:52 am

Did these pilots that graduated from Georgian find jobs?

they did not graduate as pilots, some of them who did end up getting their license, do not work as pilots.

They all work in the industry though.

nofixedaddress · Post by **nofixedaddress** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 6:16 am

Hi -

I'm in third year of the Georgian program, I am studying and working as a commercial pilot.

I started the program with my private but trained from 50 hours to 200 hours while in the program. Took on a huge loan to do it but I'll soon have a diploma in Aviation Management and a Bachelor of Science Degree in Technical Management from Embry Riddle and 1000 hours.

If all you want to do is fly go to Confed, if you want to be prepared for the future and have an Ace in your pocket than go to Georgian.

The industry is amazing right now so going to Confed is the best way to get working fast and effeciently, but if I lost my medical or the industry went tits up I'm still set and going to make a good living in Aviation.

All depends what you want at the end of the tunnel and how prepared you think you need to be.

Going to Confed and than going to Georgian would be a good move as well, you would carry over a few exemptions from Confed which would lighten your work load allowing you to make some extra cash. At the end of 6 years you would have two college diplomas and a degree, a CPL with 25 float and while at Georgian could instruct or something to build hours and could finish up with well over 1000 hours to enter the work force.

In 6 more years though you would be 28, not old at all, lots of guys get into the business around 25 and it doesn't hurt them one bit. Being in school till your 28 though would really suck.

If I was making the decision over again I would be telling myself - If I can afford the debt Georgian is the way to go, If I can't go to Confed.

gustind · Post by **gustind** » Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:29 pm

From what I've been told at Georgian and from personal experiences:

Georgian will prepare you for the behind the scenes at an airport. It is a fantastic program to fall back on in case you lose your medical or you just aren't up for or are unable to complete the requirements of an intensive Flight Training Program.

I know two guys both work at GTAA as a Security Managaer and another working in the "Heart of Operations" for GTAA (your little room with cameras). Both graduates of Georgian. Those are the kind of jobs Georgian will allow you to do.

Confed is a school for pilots. Can't say anything else since I dont know much about it.

RIMsky · Post by **RIMsky** » Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:48 pm

Hey,

Have you considered Seneca College? They offer a similar program, which from what I read, and heard, is pretty amazing. I would go to it myself, but just the move from Montreal, plus the fact that I am not an Ontario citizen, I wouldn't get subsidized either by Quebec, or Canada. Quebec since I would study in Ontario, and Canada since I'm a Quebec resident.

Seneca though, has an awesome fleet, 4 year degree, around 3400$ per semester. All that you'd have left to worry about is housing + food, plus eventually a little car so that you can move around from your place to the school, groceries and etc.

I myself, I want to get a degree before applying. I am still trying to see if I could actually save a year, get the degree + flight school at the same time, but in two different institutions. It sounds crazy, IT IS CRAZY, but c'est la vie. There is a saying in french which goes like this:

Qui ne risque rien, n'a rien!

If you need a translation just post back.

RIM.

CLguy · Post by **CLguy** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:49 am

Gustind, just to educate you a little on Confed. There are many graduates who are in management positions within various aviation companies and graduates who even own their own aviation companies. The sky is really not the limit when you graduate. Sure their main focus is flying but they do prepare you for more and you aren't saddled with $60k of debt when you graduate and living in a dark room in the middle of Pearson staring at screens all day.

For me that is when you would really know you made it in aviation. Spend 60k to stare at security screens!!

mathias_now · Post by **mathias_now** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 9:05 am

CLguy,

That’s so true, the only thing I’m worried about is flunking out of Confed. I’ve heard horror story about people getting 59s or 69s and getting the boot. I’m lucky to get 70s or 80s but I’ve applied to Confed for September 2008. If I’m accepted I will be on the fence about whether or not to accept.

Can anyone elaborate on how hard exactly the program is and what I can do it better prepare myself for it?

Thanks in advance,

MN

Jet2099 · Post by **Jet2099** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:28 pm

First of all, don't stress out. Whatever horror stories you've heard about people just on the line getting the boot were probably taken out of context. There are other factors such as character and determination to improve that they will look at at the end of the semester if you are just under the line. If you're a good guy and made an effort to get help when you needed it yet still fell just short, they will most likely grant you mercy. Then you get to sign a paper that basically says pull your socks up for next semester. If you're an ass that falls short, well then by the end of the semester you'll be the same except you'll be back home. In my year, I know at least one person that was a few percent below the line in first semester that was allowed to continue into the second.

The best advice I can give you was advice given to me in my first week by a second year student except my version of the advice emphasizes it more. Do not take those damn quizes lightly!!! IMO that's the deciding factor of whether you make it to second semester or not. The worst possible thing is to need a +85% on the college final exam because your quiz marks sucked. If the marking scheme is still the same, quizes in each of the 4 sections of ground school are worth 10% so quizes altogether make up 40% of your final ground school mark. If one of the teachers only gives you 2 quizes in his class, that means that each are worth 5% of your final mark. So it can be scary if you totally botch a quiz. When they say you have a quiz coming up, treat it as if it were a test. The quizes themselves are not difficult. Just understand most of the material the quiz is based on. You WILL have at least 1 quiz on just using the E6B. It is a simple fill in the blank so as long as you know how to use the thing, the answers are all right in front of you. When you have the lesson on E6B use or anything else for that matter, if you don't understand, get help. Another thing to consider is getting a tutor. I think it's $10 at the beginning of the semester for help in 3 courses. Your tutor will be a second year so they will know exactly what you are going through because they were in your position not too long ago.

It sounds like you have more motivation than I ever had so you should have no problem. To put it in perspective, my high school marks weren't impressive and I had never even come within 100 meters of anything short of a commercial airliner before I started college yet I was accepted and eventually graduated.

Good luck and don't worry about it. You'll do fine.

shimmydampner · Post by **shimmydampner** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:52 pm

RIMsky wrote:Have you considered Seneca College? They offer a similar program, which from what I read, and heard, is pretty amazing.

And the best part is after four years of wearing a tie you'll be well-prepared to get hired immediately by Jazz!

RIMsky · Post by **RIMsky** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:27 pm

shimmydampner wrote:
RIMsky wrote:Have you considered Seneca College? They offer a similar program, which from what I read, and heard, is pretty amazing.
And the best part is after four years of wearing a tie you'll be well-prepared to get hired immediately by Jazz!

Actually, from what I heard, that's just a myth. It's only a few selected people that do actually get hired at Jazz. It's not like Jazz holds Seneca College Aviation School as it's primary recruiter. I don't know if it's true or not, but honestly, I really think you have equal chances at Jazz if you have a real Bachelors and you demonstrate that you really want to work for them. A good application is often what makes employees thirsty to hire you. What follows is the interview. Make sure to get your teeth whitened, be clean, shaved, preferably short hair, top notch, shiny shoes, great smile, rested, attitude. Be prepared, that's the key factor!

shimmydampner · Post by **shimmydampner** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 4:39 pm

It's only a few selected people that do actually get hired at Jazz.

Oh I know.

A good application is often what makes employees thirsty to hire you. What follows is the interview.

Or the ability to get a raging hard-on by seeing a jet-engine aircraft combined with such a complete and utter lack of experience that you think flying a jet is the be all and end all that you'd jump at the chance to be a $35000 seat warmer.

Make sure to get your teeth whitened, be clean, shaved, preferably short hair, top notch, shiny shoes, great smile, rested, attitude. Be prepared, that's the key factor!

Sadly, correct. More so than ability, skill or experience.

mathias_now · Post by **mathias_now** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 4:41 pm

Jet2099, Check your PMs

RIMsky · Post by **RIMsky** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 4:42 pm

shimmydampner wrote:
It's only a few selected people that do actually get hired at Jazz.
Oh I know.
A good application is often what makes employees thirsty to hire you. What follows is the interview.
Or the ability to get a raging hard-on by seeing a jet-engine aircraft combined with such a complete and utter lack of experience that you think flying a jet is the be all and end all that you'd jump at the chance to be a $35000 seat warmer.
Make sure to get your teeth whitened, be clean, shaved, preferably short hair, top notch, shiny shoes, great smile, rested, attitude. Be prepared, that's the key factor!
Sadly, correct. More so than ability, skill or experience.

Well you're right. You know what's even sadder, I'm going to complete a Bachelors and will never work in that domain. It's just something I'll fall back on. Meanwhile, I make sure to go to the gym 3-4 times a week, rest enough, keep my heart in shape. And I pray every night that my vision remains as good as it is!

RIM.

fingersmac · Post by **fingersmac** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 4:46 pm

mathias_now wrote:Can anyone elaborate on how hard exactly the program is and what I can do it better prepare myself for it?

The program material isn't that difficult; you just have to manage your time well. Don't leave things to the last minute or let things pile up. Stay on top of the course material in each class. And do your homework! And take advantage of the resources available to students. Tutors are available for all courses and the intern flight instructors are always available to help with ground school and in some cases other course material.

All things considered, you can still go out and have a good time. I know I did! But be responsible.

RIMsky · Post by **RIMsky** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 4:51 pm

fingersmac wrote:
mathias_now wrote:Can anyone elaborate on how hard exactly the program is and what I can do it better prepare myself for it?

Personnally, I would recommend that you organize your time extremly well. I, myself, am finishing a DEC in Montreal here in Health Science, and I can tell you, with Calculus and Linear Algebra in the same semester, plus Chemistry, Physics and Biology, life isn't as pink as it was last summer. How do I do it? I use either an agenda, or my laptop, which has Outlook Express on it. The software is amazing, and you can actually program all your classes on it, put all your homeowork, and even receive alerts 2-3 days before giving in a project, that of course depending on when you schedule them

Also, it's all about YOUR motivation. I always used this little motto, and up to now, it's always worked. Some might be skeptical on it, but : if you want it you can get it. It may not always work out, but keeping a good morale will get you up in the air in no time! Those 4 years will fly by as if they never were!

Adanac · Post by **Adanac** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 12:13 am

Hey there,

I am a Confed grad and also had the chance to go to Soo for a year too. Confed is a great school and you won't go wrong by going there. Any of the flight training schools are good, but you will have to work hard to stay.

I went there with my PPL in hand already, so my first two semisters were some what easier for me then most of my classmates. But I still put in the effort.

As for the whole Georgian - ND route, you can do that if you want. 1000 hrs of time when you leave is great, but that is a lot of cash to fork out. One thing I would look at is what kind of real world flying you will get to do in the time frame you are looking at. Do you have the 5-6 years to do the Georgian/ND thing? Or would getting 2.5 years of school and a CPL with a float endorsement do and jump into the work place?

I did the latter. Did a summer in the bush, went and got my multi during freeze up, went back and did skis. Great first year. Did my IFR after that and then moved onto a company that had both float and wheels. But thing of it was, I WANTED bush flying. I wanted to get time and knowledge about the north. My goal was water bombers.

I am currently do just that. Took me about 9 years of flying to get here, but now that I am, I don't think I would have changed a thing to the route I took.

I don't think you can go wrong at Confed. If you want to do well and are ready to fly, then you will succeed!

If you have any questions, PM me. I would be glad to help.

Good luck!

Cheers,

Adanac

?Georgian vs. Confed?

?Georgian vs. Confed?

Flying